Is Jesus God?

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RobGentner said:
Even my friend Solo_scripture and other Protestants believes in purgatory!
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I’m still pondering, while being distracted by mortal challenges which interfere with my reading and cogitations. However, your statement merits some clarification, maybe some contradiction.

“Pergatory” is a Roman dogma with aspects which are, by definition, required. As such (Roman) , Pergatory is not the term which the other branches apply to their understanding of the “descent into hell” - they don’t accept Pergatory as dogmatic. We need to keep our definitions separate here!

BTW, when thinking about the Ascension – why did Christ+ ascend? Why did He not just -* poof!* - vaporize and disappear?

One thing is that He chose a method to leave them whereby He knew they would understand that they could not follow Him, and still be understood to have left them for the last time (until His Second Coming). If He had vaporized, they would have thought that He might come back “tonight” or “tomorrow”.
 
whomper said:
I’m still pondering, while being distracted by mortal challenges which interfere with my reading and cogitations. However, your statement merits some clarification, maybe some contradiction.

“Pergatory” is a Roman dogma with aspects which are, by definition, required. As such Pergatory is not the term which the other branches apply to their understanding of the “descent into hell” - they don’t accept Pergatory as dogmatic. We need to keep our definitions separate here!
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**
OK! 🙂
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church - Part 1, Section 2 Chapter 2 Article 5 paragraph 1 😃

632 The frequent New Testament affirmations that Jesus was “raised from the dead” presuppose that the crucified one sojourned in the realm of the dead prior to his resurrection.478 This was the first meaning given in the apostolic preaching to Christ’s descent into hell: that Jesus, like all men, experienced death and in his soul joined the others in the realm of the dead. But he descended there as Savior, proclaiming the Good News to the spirits imprisoned there.479

633 Scripture calls the abode of the dead, to which the dead Christ went down, “hell” - Sheol in Hebrew or Hades in Greek - because those who are there are deprived of the vision of God.480 Such is the case for all the dead, whether evil or righteous, while they await the Redeemer: which does not mean that their lot is identical, as Jesus shows through the parable of the poor man Lazarus who was received into “Abraham’s bosom”:481 "It is precisely these holy souls, who awaited their Savior in Abraham’s bosom, whom Christ the Lord delivered when he descended into hell."482 Jesus did not descend into hell to deliver the damned, nor to destroy the hell of damnation, but to free the just who had gone before him.483

634 "The gospel was preached even to the dead."484 The descent into hell brings the Gospel message of salvation to complete fulfilment. This is the last phase of Jesus’ messianic mission, a phase which is condensed in time but vast in its real significance: the spread of Christ’s redemptive work to all men of all times and all places, for all who are saved have been made sharers in the redemption.

635 Christ went down into the depths of death so that "the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live."485 Jesus, “the Author of life”, by dying destroyed "him who has the power of death, that is, the devil, and [delivered] all those who through fear of death were subject to lifelong bondage."486 Henceforth the risen Christ holds “the keys of Death and Hades”, so that "at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth."487 **
whomper said:
BTW, when thinking about the Ascension – why did Christ+ ascend? Why did He not just -* poof!* - vaporize and disappear?
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**You are serious? 😃 **
whomper said:
One thing is that He chose a method to leave them whereby He knew they would understand that they could not follow Him, and still be understood to have left them for the last time (until His Second Coming). If He had vaporized, they would have thought that He might come back “tonight” or “tomorrow”.
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**
That is Kind of the reason. A better explanation is:

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church - Part 1, Section 2 Chapter 2 Article 6

661 This final stage stays closely linked to the first, that is, to his descent from heaven in the Incarnation. Only the one who “came from the Father” can return to the Father: Christ Jesus.538 "No one has ascended into heaven but he who descended from heaven, the Son of man."539 Left to its own natural powers humanity does not have access to the “Father’s house”, to God’s life and happiness.540 Only Christ can open to man such access that we, his members, might have confidence that we too shall go where he, our Head and our Source, has preceded us.

:extrahappy: Thanks for the laugh! :extrahappy:

GOD BLESS

**
 
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RobGentner:
661 This final stage stays closely linked to the first, that is, to his descent from heaven in the Incarnation.
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Simple-minded Man probably does not equate man’s childbirth with “descending”.

If God were to appear in your house tonight, do you REALLY think that anyone is going to believe you? The great thing is, that you don’t need to worry about everyone else! * [Actually, He probably would come more like George Burns…]*

But still, don’t you thnk God knows Man so well that He came in a manner which Man would understand? And He left in a manner which Man would understand?

If He didn’t want Man to understand anything, why would He do the soul-saving things He did?? Why did He suffer the death of the cross? Why did He come as a peasant, rather than as a nobleman? Why not a king, like Herod, who could just decree what men are to do, to believe?

Because He had to persuade Man to understand, instead of just plain “doing like you’re supposed to do”.

If you don’t understand, or can’t understand, just take other men’s testimony on faith.

Isn’t this another way in which Muslims differ from Christians?
:hmmm:
 
whomper said:
Simple-minded Man probably does not equate man’s childbirth with “descending”.Simple-minded Man probably realizes that God is more powerful then they are and not care?

If God were to appear in your house tonight, do you REALLY think that anyone is going to believe you? The great thing is, that you don’t need to worry about everyone else! * [Actually, He probably would come more like George Burns…]*Yea Right! He comes to me as every person I help!

But still, don’t you thnk God knows Man so well that He came in a manner which Man would understand? And He left in a manner which Man would understand? ** Of course I would say that, hoever I ask you , what difference does it matter? He came he estanblsihed the RCC He suffered, died, rosed, accended and will come again! All I need to know! 🤷 **

If He didn’t want Man to understand anything, why would He do the soul-saving things He did?? Why did He suffer the death of the cross? Why did He come as a peasant, rather than as a nobleman? Why not a king, like Herod, who could just decree what men are to do, to believe?**He does want man to understand that is why he established the RCC to teach us.👍 **

Because He had to persuade Man to understand, instead of just plain “doing like you’re supposed to do”.**Good that is answered! 😃 **

If you don’t understand, or can’t understand, just take other men’s testimony on faith.We did it is called written, oral tradition, and the Bible. 😃 /COLOR]

Isn’t this another way in which Muslims differ from Christians?
:hmmm:

**Who cares?: hmmm: BTW, Wrong OP!😃 On my way to help Jesus build a Habitat for Humanity house. Have a great day pondering what Jesus wants you to do, I already know!

God Bless**
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