C
Chicago_Bears
Guest
Or is YHWH only the father part of the trinity?
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
Z
zach_dunn
Guest
YHWH is the name of God, Jesus is God so I would think that name would apply to Him as well, He says that’s who He is in John 8:58Or is YHWH only the father part of the trinity?
“58 Jesus said to them, ‘Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.’”
I am is what YHWH means (literally “I am who am”), we see in the next verse that the Jews took up stones to kill Him because that was God’s sacred name.
Hope this helped,
Zach
P
PacoG
Guest
Similar vein…which person of the Trinity appeared as the Burning Bush? Whos shadow did Moses see? Who wrestled with Jacob?
Was it the Holy Spirit? Is that what is meant in the Nicene Creed when it says “He has spoken through the prophets”? Does that include the patriarchs?
Was it the Holy Spirit? Is that what is meant in the Nicene Creed when it says “He has spoken through the prophets”? Does that include the patriarchs?
C
CeltusSanctus
Guest
Greetings my Catholic brother,Similar vein…which person of the Trinity appeared as the Burning Bush? Whos shadow did Moses see? Who wrestled with Jacob?
Was it the Holy Spirit? Is that what is meant in the Nicene Creed when it says “He has spoken through the prophets”? Does that include the patriarchs?
Where ever one member of the Trinity is present the other two are also present. Where ever the Father is, the Son and the Spirit are also present because they are united in “being”. While it appears the Father spoke in the burning bush and on the mountain with Moses, the Son and Spirit were present with Him. YHWH is God’s name (not just the Father’s), God is the Being that all three Persons share in. So all three are YHWH. The patriarchs conversed with the Father, (Son and Spirit always present with Father) but when the Patriarchs preached, it was under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Since the Holy Spirit is God, He too is YHWH. Hope that has helped. God bless.
E
Evan
Guest
Yet Justin Martyr claims it was the Son who walked in the Garden with Adam, who spoke in the Burning Bush and on the Mountain. He is the Word of God.Where ever one member of the Trinity is present the other two are also present. Where ever the Father is, the Son and the Spirit are also present because they are united in “being”. While it appears the Father spoke in the burning bush and on the mountain with Moses, the Son and Spirit were present with Him. YHWH is God’s name (not just the Father’s), God is the Being that all three Persons share in. So all three are YHWH. The patriarchs conversed with the Father, (Son and Spirit always present with Father) but when the Patriarchs preached, it was under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Since the Holy Spirit is God, He too is YHWH. Hope that has helped. God bless.
Another Note: YHWH was not used at the time of Christ, but Adonai, in greek Kyrios to refer to the God of the Old Testament. So when Paul claim Jesus Christ is LORD! this is a claim by Paul that Jesus is the God of the Old Testament. When Paul writes that all shall kneel at His name, in the heavens, on the earth and under the earth, he is refering to the name LORD… Kyrios.
C
CeltusSanctus
Guest
Greetings my Catholic brother,
That being said, the Catholic Church teaches that where ever one member of the Trinity is, the other two are also present. If the Son was the one walking with Adam, the Father and Spirit were automatically present (not necessarily visibly, but Spiritually)
It is true, that Adonai was used by St. Paul and others in identifying Jesus as the same God of the Old Testament. This is because, like you have said, Adonai was used to identify the Jewish God (the sacred name YHWH was restricted to the temple). That being said, Jesus identified Himself as YHWH as well.
I think the point is, the Supreme Being, God, identified Himself as YHWH, God or YHWH exists in Three Divine Persons. Since Jesus is one of the Divine Persons in YHWH, Jesus also identified Himself as YHWH. Like you said, Christ’s followers also identified Him as Adonai, the same common term used to identiy God, because Adonai was the common term used “instead of” the special term YHWH used by the High Priest alone.
While Church Fathers are important witnesses to Sacred Tradition, not everything that the Church Fathers thought or speculated is infallible. Tertulian’s fall into Heresy is evident of that. St. Justin the Martyr’s opinion may be wise (far superior to mine), but in the end, it is an opinion.Yet Justin Martyr claims it was the Son who walked in the Garden with Adam, who spoke in the Burning Bush and on the Mountain. He is the Word of God.
That being said, the Catholic Church teaches that where ever one member of the Trinity is, the other two are also present. If the Son was the one walking with Adam, the Father and Spirit were automatically present (not necessarily visibly, but Spiritually)
Well to be technical, YHWH, Elohim and Adonai were all used. God identified Himself as YHWH (I AM). The name YHWH was so sacred that it could only be said in a whisper once a year on the day of Atonement by the Jewish High Priest alone. No one else was allowed to speak the sacred name. Since the name YHWH was so sacred, Adonai (Lord God), was the common word used for God, so Adonai was used by the levites and the faithful. Also I was under the impression that when Scripture uses “LORD” it refers to YHWH and that when “Lord” is used it refers to Adonai.Another Note: YHWH was not used at the time of Christ, but Adonai, in greek Kyrios to refer to the God of the Old Testament. So when Paul claim Jesus Christ is LORD! this is a claim by Paul that Jesus is the God of the Old Testament. When Paul writes that all shall kneel at His name, in the heavens, on the earth and under the earth, he is refering to the name LORD… Kyrios.
It is true, that Adonai was used by St. Paul and others in identifying Jesus as the same God of the Old Testament. This is because, like you have said, Adonai was used to identify the Jewish God (the sacred name YHWH was restricted to the temple). That being said, Jesus identified Himself as YHWH as well.
I think the point is, the Supreme Being, God, identified Himself as YHWH, God or YHWH exists in Three Divine Persons. Since Jesus is one of the Divine Persons in YHWH, Jesus also identified Himself as YHWH. Like you said, Christ’s followers also identified Him as Adonai, the same common term used to identiy God, because Adonai was the common term used “instead of” the special term YHWH used by the High Priest alone.
E
Evan
Guest
…Greetings my Catholic brother,
Yup, I agree with all you wrote. Since OT Israel did not have the revelation of Trinity, I believe that references to God, Adonai, YHWH, El Shaddai, Elohim refer to the one God, 3 Persons.
Side note: The Church has asked us to eliminate all references to YHWH during the mass (songs, homilies, etc) and replace it with LORD as that is the name Jesus used to refer to himself (except for an occational I AM) and the the Father. That is the name used by Paul, Thomas, Peter, various people that were healed. Course, we still get to use Hallel YH = alleluia = praise to I AM.
A
adam_in_ohio
Guest
Just something to point out. We say in the NAME of the Father and the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Not in the nameS.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.