Is Lying Always a Sin?

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Vigis

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Well I have been wandering lately if lying is always a sin. For example, spies that work for the CIA lie quite a lot I would imagine. So would that mean that they offend God for lying which is part of their job? Another example is that when those two from Columbine (I do not know how to spell) asked students that if they were Christian to raise their hands would it have been wrong and against God not to raise your hand when you were actually Christian? What I am trying to get at is if lying can be justified in the eyes of God, and if so, then what are the qualifications for it to be justified? Does the Catholic Church say anything about this? Please share me your views.

God speed.

Vigis
 
Vigis said:
Well I have been wandering lately if lying is always a sin. For example, spies that work for the CIA lie quite a lot I would imagine. So would that mean that they offend God for lying which is part of their job? Another example is that when those two from Columbine (I do not know how to spell) asked students that if they were Christian to raise their hands would it have been wrong and against God not to raise your hand when you were actually Christian? What I am trying to get at is if lying can be justified in the eyes of God, and if so, then what are the qualifications for it to be justified? Does the Catholic Church say anything about this? Please share me your views.

God speed.

Vigis
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What did Saint Dismus do?
 
Jesus said:
“The truth will set you free” (Jn 8, 32)

Lies enslave us. No matter how justified we think it may be to tell a lie, we will have to keep on lying in order to sustain that first lie. It becomes a never ending chain! 😦

Jesus also said:
“All you need say ys ‘Yes’ if you mean yes, ‘No’ if you mean no; anything more than this comes from the Evil One.” (Mt 5, 37)

:amen:

Alma
 
Hi
I can’t speak for the Catholics, for I am an Ahmadi. We believe lying is always a sin. This is witout prejudice to your faith.
Thanks
 
Is Lying Always a Sin?
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Of course it is. Would Jesus lie (for ANY reason?)

We are often confronted with the question of a “white lie” (a non-truth told to spare the sensibilities of another, with no apparent ill effects). This is an “ends justifies the means” argument which has been refuted by many Christian theologians for many centuries.

However, a lie told with charitable intent (while still morally wrong) probably falls into the category of venial sin (not mortal sin),and, as such, could not cause our damnation.
 
I agree, most priests will tell you that lies to spare feelings, “that dress is fine”, “they didn’t ruin your hair, it looks okay”. things like that are acceptable. To use not lieing as a reason to be cruel (which some people do) is wrong and defies common sense. Sometimes you can think of a “truth” that is kinder, but if pressed, a small lie that doesn’t hurt anyone is not like lieing about more serious matters.
 
Telling a Lie is an intrinsically immoral act. Therefore it can never be “good” to tell a lie.

However, you can certainly think of occasions where telling a lie is far and away the lesser of two evils.

For example, th World War II German soldier looking for Jews hidden in your house asks you “Is there anyone else here?”

Then it’s certainly better to lie than to send these people to the gas chamber.

However, perhaps it is not necessary to lie? Maybe you can just not answer the question?

But if push comes to shove and you’re “forced” to tell a lie.

Then though it would not become a moral good, it would be a sin for which you are not culpable.

Chuck
 
Vigis said:
Does the Catholic Church say anything about this?
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The Catholic Church speaks rather clearly about this:

From The Catechism of the Catholic Church
Part Three Life in Christ,
Section Two: The Ten Commandments:
Chapter Two: “You Shall Love Your Neighbor as Yourself”
Article 8: The Eighth Commandment

2482 “A lie consists in speaking a falsehood with the intention of deceiving.” The Lord denounces lying as the work of the devil: “You are of your father the devil, . . . there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.”

2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.
2484The gravity of a lie is measured against the nature of the truth it deforms, the circumstances, the intentions of the one who lies, and the harm suffered by its victims. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error.

I recommend reading the entire article, though, as it goes into your question about the CIA and such.
 
I believe that lying is wrong, and should be avoided, I don’t believe however that you are morally obligated to reveal information that is not benefical i.e. would result in people getting killed or some other crime. I think that if you revealed information that you know would be used in executing some crime, you would probably become an Accomplice to that crime.

For instance if someone asked you how to rob a bank and not get caught, and you knew the answer, I think it would be very imprudent to tell this person, just because you don’t want to lie. You could just tell them “I’m not telling you” or even better give them some good reasons not to rob a bank!

When our Lord Jesus was arrested and questioned he didn’t lie but he didn’t answer the question that they wanted him to either :

Luke 22
66 When day came the council of elders of the people met, both chief priests and scribes, and they brought him before their Sanhedrin. 67 They said, “If you are the Messiah, tell us,” but he replied to them, “If I tell you, you will not believe, 68 and if I question, you will not respond. 69 But from this time on the Son of Man will be seated at the right hand of the power of God.”
70 They all asked, “Are you then the Son of God?” He replied to them, “It is You that say I am.”
(from the New American Bible)

He didn’t say “Yes that’s me, I’m the son of God”. He didn’t give them a reason to kill Him, He did however give them another opportunity to hear the truth.

Hope This is helpful
 
Okay I have another question. What about joking? When I was a little kid I heard about the city of Lima. I asked my dad then if that is where all of the lima beans come from. He replied, “yes”, and contnued to expand a little on his joke. It was not long until I realized he was joking. We both laughed. Was it wrong for him to pull this joke on me?

Also, does this mean sarcassim is wrong as well. Such as when someone asks a stupid question and you reply “yes” when it is really “no”. It that wrong as well?

God speed.

Vigis
 
I think jokes, surprise parties and the like aren’t lying, but “fiction”. You are “deceiving” someone who will not be hurt by it for a very limited amount of time for their enjoyment. It can’t be any more wrong than telling your children bedtime stories.
 
YinYangMom said:
Article 8: The Eighth Commandment

2482 “A lie consists in speaking a falsehood with the intention of deceiving.” The Lord denounces lying as the work of the devil: “You are of your father the devil, . . . there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.”

2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.
2484The gravity of a lie is measured against the nature of the truth it deforms, the circumstances, the intentions of the one who lies, and the harm suffered by its victims. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error.

I recommend reading the entire article, though, as it goes into your question about the CIA and such.
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I’m not sure it goes deeply enough into the actual telling of false information for good purposes, but if one reads between the lines one can see that it is permitted. Here are some more paragraphs of interest:

2488 The right to the communication of the truth is not unconditional. Everyone must conform his life to the Gospel precept of fraternal love. This requires us in concrete situations to judge whether or not it is appropriate to reveal the truth to someone who asks for it.

2489 Charity and respect for the truth should dictate the response to every request for information or communication. The good and safety of others, respect for privacy, and the common good are sufficient reasons for being silent about what ought not be known or for making use of a discreet LANGUAGE. The duty to avoid scandal often commands strict discretion. No one is bound to reveal the truth to someone who does not have the right to know it.

The problem is, sometimes even silence or discreet language is not enough. For example, when the Allies invaded France in 1944 they went to great lengths to deceive the Nazis as to where they were going to invade, to keep Nazi divisions holed up in the wrong place. Silence would not have done that, nor would discreet language. It took outright lying. Or in the case of a Gestapo agent looking for Jews, trying to use discreet language might just get you tortured and giving up the Jews you are hiding. It may be that only a straight-out lie can protect them (and yourself).

Perhaps the key phrase in the CCC account is “and the harm suffered by its victims”. Who is the victim of a lie to the Nazi war machine, or to a Chinese secret policeman looking to arrest secret Christians? I do not believe that there is a moral victim when such are lied to, so I do not believe the eighth commandment comes into play at all.
 
VociMike said:
Perhaps the key phrase in the CCC account is “and the harm suffered by its victims”. Who is the victim of a lie to the Nazi war machine, or to a Chinese secret policeman looking to arrest secret Christians? I do not believe that there is a moral victim when such are lied to, so I do not believe the eighth commandment comes into play at all.
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I whole-heartedly agree!
I think when we disclose information we need to be aware of the consequences (Prudence) to be sure that no-one will be hurt. We need also to aware of our intentions. Is it our intention to deny truth?

I think in the case of Lying to the Nazis or the Chinese secret police your intention is not to deceive, but instead you are being forced to. otherwise you are aiding then in a greater evil. You have no moral obligation to disclose information. You do on the other hand, have a duty to protect life (from conception, to natural death) and to defend the weak.

Someone put it like this “People do not have the right to information about another, when they are neither part of the problem or the solution” ( I suppose you could also apply this to gossiping too!)

On the issue of Joking; I think you need to ask yourself if it is you’re intention to decieve?
I think humour is a gift that can be use to build people up, of to knock them down! Like all gifts, we can use it for good or for bad. on the subject of sarcasm, i believe it can be used to help people laugh at there faults and not to take themselves too seriously. But again it can be used as a wepon to hurt them. We need to be careful! If our words are intended to cut somone (even a small bit) then they *will *bleed.

Before I came to know the Lord, I had a really wicked sense of humour! People were scared to be the butt of my jokes because they cut so deep, yet still the people I would hang out with would laugh. So I would continue.
Now that I Know Our Lord, He has shown me how to use this gift for Him, to build up His kingdom and His people and to help people laugh at the silly things they do.
Humour is a gift from God but be sure that your intentions are “Jesus oriented” and you’re not using it for your own gain (ie to get 1up on someone)

Telling stories is great. 😃 Telling stories and pretending that they’re real is not! :tsktsk: It’s deception, and can be very confusing for young children.
Kids are great, they believe what adults tell them, and they are suposed to! It is very easy to explain the diffrence between “story things” like faries, elfs and santa clause and “real things” like Jesus, Mary and the Angels.:angel1:

Hope this helped answer your question

God bless!
 
I think some sarcasm is a type of joke meant for enjoyment and not to deceive a person into error or harm.

I can’t imagine getting rid of all my Boudreaux jokes!!
 
I think there is a difference between deliberate lying, which is always a sin, and the intention to decieve, which is not a sin.Say your friend was being chased by a murderer, he knocks at the door and asks you to hide him.Then the murderer knocks and asks if hes there, OF COURSE it is NOT a sin to say ‘No’. And it isn’t a sin to lie in order to keep secrets- eg. If it was someones birthday and you were preparing a surprise party, it would not be a sin to say you had completely forgotton his birthday, because it would make the surprise even more fun.So lying is not neccesarilly a sin, it depends on your motive, and on wheather you willingly tell it, or just want to decieve someone for a good reason.I, unfortunately, am an instinctive liar, and sometimes tell stupid lies.I think this is not a sin, but a serious imperfection which could become a sin, and Iam trying very hard to break the habit.:hmmm:
 
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