Is lying ever ok?

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Josethecatholic

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I am wondering if it’s Always a sin a sin to lie even when you do so for a greater purpose for example if the enemy asks you for the password to your account so he can take it over you will never give it to him or if someone asks a teacher who is a shooter where her students are hiding she should lie shouldn’t she?
 
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The Catechism tells us that Satan is the father of lies.

God is truth.

All lies are sins, someone may be less culpable for the sin.

Catechism also tells us we may never do evil so that good may come of it.
Josethecatholic said:
him or if someone asks a teacher who is a shooter where her students are hiding she should lie shouldn’t she?
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This is a situation that comes up on line very often. The teacher would be in total fear and panic. We ought not speculate on someone in such a terrible situation.
 
Josethecatholic said:
if the enemy asks you for the password to your account so he can take it over you will never give it to him o
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How is this a lie? Where did you say something that was untrue here?
Josethecatholic said:
if someone asks a teacher who is a shooter where her students are hiding she should lie shouldn’t she?
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Yeah, she could. Or she could refuse to say anything. Shootings are exceptional situations and no one is going to fault a teacher for pointing a shooter away from her students until help arrives. In normal situations that don’t involve people dying, i.e. someone asking you if you did something and you say you didn’t when you did, that can be a sin, either mortal or venial depending on the circumstances and consequences.
 
To lie is ALWAYS a sin. However you rise a valid question and the answer is quite simple. We need to fully understand what a lie actually is.
The definition from the Catechism of the Catholic Church states:
“Lying is depraving some one of the truth due to him/her”.
The hinge for your answer is: Is anyone due the knowledge of your password?
And the answer is: NO ONE, only you are due this knowledge.
Is a Nazi soldier due the knowledge that Jews are hiding in your house?
Answer: NO no one should receive this knowledge if it would use it to cause harm to them.
Hope this helps you.
Peace!
 
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But if a jew was hiding in my house, of course I would not tell the nazis, but what if told them there wasn’t a jew hiding in my house. Is that a lie/sin?
That’s probably a question that’s been asked a thousand times but I don’t know the answer.
 
I would say No, that’s like saying is the death penalty a sin because killing is a sin, legalism is when you follow the law to such an extreme that instead of ensuring justice it obstructs it.
 
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Josethecatholic said:
I am wondering if it’s Always a sin a sin to lie even when you do so for a greater purpose for example if the enemy asks you for the password to your account so he can take it over you will never give it to him or if someone asks a teacher who is a shooter where her students are hiding she should lie shouldn’t she?
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Yes, it’s ok. If someone wants to argue it’s still technically a sin if you tell the killer there’s no-one in the basement then no problem. Does anyone think God would hold it against you?
 
I think the shooter is someone who doesn’t deserve to know the truth, so the teacher could certainly lie in the case to keep the children safe.
 
Is the Nazi due to know this truth?
Since you do know what he is going to do with the information the answer is no!
Peace!
 
“Catechism . . . due to him/her” To which section of the Catechism are you referring?
 
This exact same thread is raised and debated ad Infinitum every like 3-4 months, right down to the “nazis at the door” examples. They always break 2 ways:
  1. Yes or
  2. No because some people have no right to the full truth.
I believe in answer number 2.
 
I just happened to come in a situation where lying seemed necessary, I was putting a water gallon on the car and I lightly bumped into a car and the woman was like did you hit the car, and I believe it was obvious that no was the right answer to tell her because first of all, is a mild hit even a hit or can it be considered a touch? Secondly no evidence was produced by the bump because no mark was left, but you get the idea, isn’t it legalism to make a big drama by someone mildly hitting your already dirty beat up car when no damage was caused, how can I even compensate the person for damage when the only possible damage caused is microscopic damage, what does she want pennies or dollars because if no mark is noticed by the naked eye it isn’t worth dollars.
 
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I hate being in situations where I feel like I have to lie to evade an uncalled for dramatic situation over something that Is incredibly innocent and does not warrant any drama.
 
Well you did lie. If you didn’t do any damage as you say, why would you lie?
 
Irishmom2 said:
Well you did lie. If you didn’t do any damage as you say, why would you lie?
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To prevent false accusations since the car already looked in bad shape and to avoid further drama. Ironically this happened after I made this thread, it’s amazing how many situations we encounter where problematic people want to start problems about every little thing instead of turning the other cheek, I also was yelled at for taking pictures of a house as part of my trip in a beautiful neighborhood when that’s perfectly legal.
 
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One of the attributes of a legalistic person is someone who always starts problems for the smallest things you can imagine, instead of turning the other cheek.

I believe this all stems from pride, when you are a proud person you don’t have any tolerance of even the most mild displeasures because you see yourself as your own God.
 
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Right here:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P8K.HTM

2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead into error someone who has the right to know the truth. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.

Peace!
 
As a truther i can tell you I hate lies but that doesn’t mean lies don’t have their rightful use in a sinful fallen world, I also hate killing but one wouldn’t argue the death penalty is a sin of murder or would they?

One would not argue that disobedience to the government is a sin when the government begins to force us to take the mark of the beast or would it?

This is where wisdom is needed, one should be obedient to the law within the context of logic and reason in order to avoid falling into the sin of legalism.
 
Yeah, I am looking at the same section, and it does not have the language about “who has the right to know the truth”: www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a8.htm

2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.

I don’t think the link is working, though – I will try it in another response

2483 Lying is the most direct offense against the truth. To lie is to speak or act against the truth in order to lead someone into error. By injuring man’s relation to truth and to his neighbor, a lie offends against the fundamental relation of man and of his word to the Lord.
 
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