Did not Jesus wash the feet of his apostles at the last supper? Did he come to glorify himself or to bring us salvation? In doing so he glorified the Father, but one would be hard put to declare scourging, a crown of thorns, and a death by crucifixion to be a process of glorification. Jesus came to serve humanity. He taught us to emulate him.
Please point out the paragraph(s) wherein Gaudium et Spes says that man is the center rather than Christ.
I don’t think GS says that. Let’s look at the two instances of this phrase that I can find, in their contexts:
There’s the rub, as Shakespeare would say.
You beat me to it.
Excellent question. Which comes first – devotion to Christ or devotion to the Church? I don’t think this question can be answered definitively. Each of us answers it in his own way. Some Catholics put the Church first, while others, Christian witness. Personally, I try to maintain a balance. I pursue discipleship, through Catholic teachings, because that’s the primary context in which I view Christ and the journey of His people. Metaphorically, Christ is my life. The Church is my conduit to Him.
Cool. But don’t forget Christ’s commandment that we meet in His name, and to consume His flesh and blood. We can’t do that if we stay home.
Thats ok, but we can meet in His name out of church as friends in someones home as Jesus did. We can talk about the love of God as we do it right now, i think this is even better since we share our opinions and our experiences. I dont think drinking wine is going to save me either. I know lots of people who drink a lot of wine and not for the sake of God.
)I don’t think we’re talking about serving a church (meaning “a building”, we’re talking about serving the Church (meaning “the Mystical Body of Christ, the Church founded by Jesus Christ”).
Assuming you’re talking about the word “church” in the building sense, churches are not just for us to pray in “if [we] want”. Our churches are also where the Body of Christ assembles for divine worship of God, on every Sunday and holy-day.
Scripture does not agree with you. Yes, Jesus was born into humble estate, but he was visited by Magi bearing gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh. The Book of Revelation shows that Jesus is clothed in fine garments, worthy of all wealth and power and honor and glory. Just because God is with the lowly does not mean He is “far from gold”.
Building a beautiful church in which to worship God does not preclude us from loving God in every place in which we encounter Him (such as the poor of the world).
s visitors took all that wealth for him means that thats what he wanted. I think this is our way of expressing that He is important. Like Mary Magdalene who had nothing but still bought expensive oil to pour it onto His body. Its just a symbol of our love, like a diamond engagement ring. To show that youd give away everything to prove you are serious. Just like Jesus asked the wealthy to give away everything he had to prove he is devoted.I think you are over-reacting. EVERY human needs the Church. The Church is the Body of Christ. There is no salvation apart from Christ nor his Body.
No one is asking you to have an expensive marriage. But you said you do believe in the institution of marriage, so why aren’t you married? I do not mean to judge, but are you admitting you are living in a sexual relationship outside of marriage? That is something you should correct. (I have things I need to correct, too!)
Some people are trying to change the Church, but they will ultimately fail. God protects His Church.
Wait, so which is it? Should we, or shouldn’t we, go to church? I’m confused.
Okay, you’re wrong. Yes, you do “NEED to go to church to worship God.” God commands it, and he commands us to do only what is needful. Jesus Christ asked us to only one thing for him, and that was to take part in the Eucharist “in remembrance” of him. The only place you can do that is at Mass.
I agree on the personal relationship point. However, again, Christianity has to be much more than that – a personal relationship. Don’t forget salvation history and the colossal importance of organized Christianity in human time. Without them, there wouldn’t be any Christianity. We must make the public testament regularly, together, for many, many reasons, one of which is the maintenance of our collective self-identity and way of life. I’m no saint. I frequently miss Mass out of pure sloth. Still, I believe in it. Mass has not failed me. I have failed the Lord by not faithfully attending Mass. I’m going this Sunday, barring WWIII in Texas. It’s going to happen, no matter what.Thats ok, but we can meet in His name out of church as friends in someones home as Jesus did. We can talk about the love of God as we do it right now, i think this is even better since we share our opinions and our experiences. I dont think drinking wine is going to save me either. I know lots of people who drink a lot of wine and not for the sake of God.
I am not saying not to go to church, all I am saying is to know the difference between God and a house. I live in a place where some people go to church to gossip, and those ones from the first row I hear them cursing the day after.
Going to church to serve it or serve the priest or the pope himself is not right they are not eny better than you are. You can serve God from a shed and you can hate him from the Vatican if you like.
I love GOD in or out of a church and I dont need anything to tell me how to do so. You have to have your own realitonship with Him and he`ll let you know what to do.
That’s not very Catholic.
You are missing something by not going to Church. You are neglecting your duty, as a member of the Body of Christ, to worship God together with His Church on Sunday, the day which commemorates the Resurrection. You are avoiding Holy Communion, the Most Blessed Sacrament where Jesus Christ comes to each of us, under the appearance of bread and wine; his Real Presence. You are missing the other sacraments, especially Reconciliation (or Confession or Penance, whatever you prefer to call it). You are probably also neglecting to have your child baptized, which is compounded by the fact that you don’t appear to be a practicing Catholic.Some politicians are Catholic. As such, they should be Catholic even when they are “on the job”. Case closed.
It is nonsensical to separate God and His Church. Jesus is the head of the Church; the Church is the body. The Church is his bride!
That sort of relativism and indifferentism leads to the thousands of sects of Christianity you find today. Instead of doing what suits us, why don’t we try to learn what suits God?