Is modesty overrated?

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One can look attractive and covered up.
 
I’m weighing in late, but I love the topic.

Modesty is humility.

_Im_modesty involves showing yourself off to others- your looks, your body, your credentials, your talents, your fancy car, etc. - in order to gain attention and approval from others.

It’s not at all hard to be sexy and feminine without showing yourself off for approval. That’s a revolutionary statement in the this the great age of the Internet selfie, but there you have it.
 
edwest211 said:
Scandal is to be avoided.
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Scandal can also be avoided by gossiping about what others wear.

There is genuine concern for someone’s well being and just clothing preferences. And clothing / fashion has changed other the hundreds of years.
 
Chastity is a beautiful virtue and modesty is a good way to practice it. With the right motivation it doesn’t become that big of a deal.
 
I think much of the reaction is also - there are men who are going to look. If a guy’s trying to find something to look at, he’ll find it. Some men even see a modest woman as a challenge, like her chastity is some challenge to their masculinity.

I think it is a mistake to frame modesty too much in what men look at. If a man sees no need to keep custody of his eyes, he will find something to look at no matter what women wear.

(I’ve also made this as a practical point before, but some of us aren’t going to look like your modesty models no matter what we wear. The closest I’ve ever gotten is managing to look busty and pregnant rather than just busty.)
 
DarkLight said:
I think it is a mistake to frame modesty too much in what men look at. If a man sees no need to keep custody of his eyes, he will find something to look at no matter what women wear.
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Amen to that! It’s such a misinterpretation of modesty to solely frame it around what arouses the other sex. It is more about each individual’s walk with God, and where they are at.

🌷
 
As a man, particularly in my younger days, I realized how much of a challenge it is for men to maintain custody of the eyes. Men tend to be more visual people.

I remember a gym I worked out at regularly, and some women I think would purposely dress in a way to get noticed. A few gyms have even implemented dress codes (for both sexes) to minimize the distraction, and to keep certain gyms from having a reputation. In the early 2000s, I had a job that required frequent travel, and going through airports there would be women wearing low rise pants and tops that showed their underwear (I think some of these fashions are going away). I have gone to some beaches in Mexico, and I like to swim and do water sports, but I do have to be more alert in maintaining custody of the eyes, more so in Mexico than Texas, California, or Florida. As a guy, I will usually wear board shorts to the beach, or a decent pair of trunks.
 
Clothing/fashion in this era are dictated by a small group of self-proclaimed fashion designers. That is a fact. Going to the beach to see women in their underwear is 100% off limits. That is a fact.
 
I’m pretty sure that’s been every era ever. We’ve had fashion plates for as long as we were able to print the things.

The frustration as a woman is that it seems, no matter what clothes you wear, someone will find it immodest. And especially if it’s framed as not making men lust, well, it often seems that merely being discernibly female in public does that. I’ve had enough lustful comments directed my way in full winter gear to have lost any illusions that there’s a level of coverage that’ll stop them.
 
edwest211 said:
Clothing/fashion in this era are dictated by a small group of self-proclaimed fashion designers. That is a fact. Going to the beach to see women in their underwear is 100% off limits. That is a fact.
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Clothing is not just designed by a small group of people. There are so many styles, and millions of people on this earth, and different cultures—I don’t see a select few people catering to all of them.

At the beach people wear beachwear, and depending on who they are and what they like, they will wear different things. No one should feel shamed into wearing a sackcloth at the beach, less they offend the wandering eyes of a man (or woman).

Some people simply go to the beach to enjoy family and friend time. Some people like wearing board shorts and tops, others a string bikini. Neither should feel out of place, or shamed.

For all we know the person wearing a speedo (or in Australian terms “smuggling a budgie”), is a practicing Catholic. Case in point: our former Prime Minister Tony Abbott, who likes to wear fitting swimming briefs (like tighty whiteys just for swimming).

So, again: we shouldn’t judge people on their appearances. As long as they are not physically or verbally actually affronting you, or harassing you, they should be able to live. If their existence and what they wear makes you uncomfortable, you can change beaches, or go at a different time.
 
Clearly you don’t understand EdWest’s shtick. Let me give you the Cliffs Notes version.

There’s a secret cabal of evildoers who are conspiring to undermine societal morals and drag us down from the peak of human excellence (America in the 1950s). In other words, you kids get off my lawn.
 
Probably don’t understand that schtick at all, you are right. 🤣

But the 1950s weren’t all good. Like, why do people romanticise the past? Because they were children then, and everything seems so wholesome? 🤭
 
Got me. I’ve had that discussion with him before and can’t go down that road again. The degree to which he idealizes a specific era is pretty bonkers.
 
hwriggles4 said:
Men tend to be more visual people.
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I want to get to know this person who started to establish this idea to give him or her an slight slap and say "dude, do you have an idea how many heated discussions are based on this meaning ? We, men and women, are equal in our ability to sin as in our ability to avoid sin.
 
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Immodesty is what is actually overrated. Kind of degrading yourself when it gets to certain levels.
 
Some people deny decency. Some people don’t want to feel ashamed. That is not proper for Catholics.
 
Incorrect. “Get off my grass!” Mandatory once you reach a certain age 🙂
 
I have plenty of magazines from the 1950s - regular magazines, not dirty magazines. The way women dressed back then, in the West, was appropriate. Those who did not conform to the standard were reminded. If an older stranger told me, “Young, man. You should be ashamed of yourself.” when I was a kid, I took that person seriously. The 1950s were awesome from a Catholic/Christian perspective. God was in our daily lives more.
 
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