is my dad in hell?

[Amielia]

my dad died in the 9/11 terrorist attacks he was working in the north tower when it was struck by the plane… he was one of the people who jumped from the upper floors. my mum wont let me talk about him anymore because she says he is in hell because he took his own life…

i dont want to go to heaven if my dad isnt there. please help.

 

[1ke]

Amielia,

Please seek counseling from your priest, and your mother too if she will go.

When something so horrible happens, as being trapped in a burning building, people are not attempting to kill themselves purposely but are instead attempting to escape the fire. They are not rational, they are in a panic. God knows this, and God is merciful. God knows our hearts.

 

[Amielia]

my mum says that if his faith was really really strong that he wouldn’t have jumped because he would have known he would have been with the Lord soon… she says she never had a husband and it hurts because my dad was amazing

what if she is right and my dad isnt waiting for me in heaven?

 

[Godfollower]

First, suicide is not a guarantee of going to Hell.

Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.

Catechism of the Catholic Church paragraphs 2282-83.

Second, it is doubtful that he actually committed suicide. If he was at the top of the twin towers, he was fleeing a raging fire. People who are fleeing fire are irrational and do things that a normal person considers bizarre – and that specifically includes leaping out of buildings too high in the air to survive.

Finally, please accept my condolences on the loss of your father. I imagine it hurts quite a lot. I pray that you find peace with God and experience His warmth and love. You will never “get over” the loss of your father, but you will probably find that the hurt diminishes over time. I hope you can find peace.

 

[LilyM]

my mum says that if his faith was really really strong that he wouldn’t have jumped because he would have known he would have been with the Lord soon… she says she never had a husband and it hurts because my dad was amazing

what if she is right and my dad isnt waiting for me in heaven?

THIS is the official Church teaching on suicide - from the Catechism:

"2282 …Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

2283 **We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives. ** "

So you can see, especially from that last paragraph, there’s always reason to hope for the salvation even of suicides. St John Vianney, trying to console a woman whose husband had killed himself by jumping off a bridge, was gifted with divine knowledge and said ‘fear not, Madam, he repented between the bridge and the water.’

Your mother is quite wrong to insist that he is in hell - we simply can’t know what goes through a person’s mind - but we can be sure that God understands the sort of psychological anguish that must lead to someone taking that decision, and He is infinitely merciful.

 

[happymommy]

I don’t want to break your heart, but I don’t want to lie either. He is in hell, and he will burn for eternity. But try not to think of that…

What an awful thing to write. Shame on you! You owe this person an apology!

 

[wcknight]

If your dad was a good man, most likely your dad is in Heaven. God does not send good people to Hell. Suicide may be wrong but in some circumstances God understands and forgives us when we seemingly have no choice.

God is a good father, the best in the entire universe. Suppose your own son were in that situation, Would you forgive him if he chose to jump instead of facing a fiery death ? Why would we think God is more merciless than we are. God is a far better father than any of us, so in His infinite mercy, He probably forgave those folks who saw no better choice than to jump.

My prayers are with you and your family especially your father and your mother. You may want to ask her, if you were in the same situation, would she not forgive you if you had made the same choice. I’m sure your dad was praying the entire time fro forgiveness, I would have. He didn’t jump to spite God or reject Him or His gift of life, he did so to escape a more horrible death. Many of us may have done the exact same thing.

 

[Annn]

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news my young friend, but your father’s faith was indeed not strong enough. Suicide is a form of murder… It is, infact, pre-meditated self-murder. The scriptures say. “no murderer has eternal life abiding in him”. This means that an unrepentant murderer will not being going to heaven.

Your father had no possible opportunity to repent for his murder, and will therefore be residing in hell… There is no scripture to suggest otherwise, and I am truly sorry…

I don’t want to break your heart, but I don’t want to lie either. He is in hell, and he will burn for eternity. But try not to think of that…

This is the cruelest post I have ever read.

 

[DevoutMatthew]

‘fear not, Madam, he repented between the bridge and the water.’

This is good news for you! I heard it took about 10 seconds for the people from the top floors of the twin towers to hit the ground, which gave your father 10 whole seconds to repent.

 

[1ke]

my mum says that if his faith was really really strong that he wouldn’t have jumped because he would have known he would have been with the Lord soon… she says she never had a husband and it hurts because my dad was amazing

what if she is right and my dad isnt waiting for me in heaven?

(1) In your mother’s grief she is not thinking clearly. She is hurt and is lashing out. She cannot know your father’s state of mind or God’s mind either.

(2) Go get counseling from your priest.

(3) Ignore “DevoutMatthew” who is wrong on this matter and cruel in the extreme. He is not basing what he is saying on authentic Catholic teaching. You have been given the Church’s teaching in the Catechism. Be at peace. And, since this is only this person’s second post on Catholic Answers… I also suspect an ulterior motive for them to post something so heinous and unfounded.

NO ONE knows who is in hell and who isn’t except God. And, remember, God is merciful.

Go see your priest, Amielia.

 

[LilyM]

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news my young friend, but your father’s faith was indeed not strong enough.Suicide is a form of muder… It is, infact, pre-meditated self-murder. The scriptures say. “no murderer has eternal life abiding in him”. This means that an unrepentant murderer will not being going to heaven.

Your father had no possible opportunity to repent for his murder, and will therefore be residing in hell… There is no scripture to suggest otherwise, and I am truly sorry…

I don’t want to break your heart, but I don’t want to lie either. He is in hell, and he will burn for eternity. But try not to think of that…

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news for you, Matthew, but your conclusion is totally wrong and contrary to the Church teaching as quoted above and more generally.

We know firstly that to be mortal sin there must be full consent of the mind - and that things like the horror of being in a burning building with no chance of escape are quite enough to drive one out of their senses and so remove the element of consent, as madness can do, and thus this poor man’s behaviour has a good chance of NOT meeting the requirements of mortal sin.

We know also that every instant of life, including those instants *after *this poor man jumped from that building, is a fresh opportunity for repentance and salvation. And so he may have taken advantage of those opportunities. If it was enough for the soul St John Vianney was discussing (who certainly didn’t fall from nearly so great a height) then who are you to say it wasn’t enough for this gentleman?

So in short we do NOT know for certain that he is in Hell. And you owe a huge great big grovelling apology to this poor poster.

 

[happymommy]

This is good news for you! I heard it took about 10 seconds for the people from the top floors of the twin towers to hit the ground, which gave your father 10 whole seconds to repent.

why don’t you just go away! You are not helping anyone and are just being mean. I see this is only your second post. You won’t last long around here being that unkind!

 

[twosweetgirls]

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news my young friend, but your father’s faith was indeed not strong enough. Suicide is a form of murder… It is, infact, pre-meditated self-murder. The scriptures say. “no murderer has eternal life abiding in him”. This means that an unrepentant murderer will not being going to heaven.

Your father had no possible opportunity to repent for his murder, and will therefore be residing in hell… There is no scripture to suggest otherwise, and I am truly sorry…

I don’t want to break your heart, but I don’t want to lie either. He is in hell, and he will burn for eternity. But try not to think of that…

What a disgusting thing to say.

 

[JPUSC]

I am truly sorry for your loss. I hope that you can offer Masses for his soul as they are what he needs right now.



Here is a good site for inexpensive Mass Cards from the Franciscans:

seraphicmass.org/

 

[Amielia]

thank you everyone for your kind words… i’m going to send this page to my mum and hopefully she will listen to what you’ve said… and maybe change her mind because i don’t think i can really say goodbye until she does as well.

 

[Godfollower]

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news my young friend, but your father’s faith was indeed not strong enough. Suicide is a form of murder… It is, infact, pre-meditated self-murder. The scriptures say. “no murderer has eternal life abiding in him”. This means that an unrepentant murderer will not being going to heaven.

Your father had no possible opportunity to repent for his murder, and will therefore be residing in hell… There is no scripture to suggest otherwise, and I am truly sorry…

I don’t want to break your heart, but I don’t want to lie either. He is in hell, and he will burn for eternity. But try not to think of that…

Matthew is mistaken. First, we don’t even know that your father actually chose to jump (as opposed to fleeing the fire until he accidentally fell; this is what 1ke and I are talking about: your mind gets filled with “flee the fire flee the fire flee the fire” and pays no attention to little things like being a thousand feet up – this has been shown over and over again in other burning-building contexts). Second, even if he did choose to jump, it wasn’t premeditated. He was the victim of a building on fire; he didn’t go up there planning to jump.

The Catholic Church teaches as dogma that we have no way to determine whether any particular person is in Hell. This includes your father. No one on this planet can say that he is in Hell; we can, however, say with confidence that a merciful God does take into account things like the fact he was fleeing the fire.

 

[wcknight]

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news my young friend, but your father’s faith was indeed not strong enough. Suicide is a form of murder… It is, infact, pre-meditated self-murder. The scriptures say. “no murderer has eternal life abiding in him”. This means that an unrepentant murderer will not being going to heaven.
…

That’s an absurd assumption to make. No one knows who goes to Hell or not. Pray that God does not judge you as harsely as you judge others. Given the same circumstances you may have made the same choice.

 

[nicolep]

This is good news for you! I heard it took about 10 seconds for the people from the top floors of the twin towers to hit the ground, which gave your father 10 whole seconds to repent.

Please stop. You’re posts are offending me and he wasn’t my father.

To the OP, the Catholic Church does not condem people who committed suicide. In order for a sin to be mortal, it must be done with free will (along with the two other requirements). He most certainly didn’t have free will in the face of the horrors of that day.

I will pray a rosary for you, your mom and father this evening. May God give you all peace.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news my young friend,

This is obviously a troll. The whole thread seems rather far-fetched, but especially this “new” member’s response.

 

[wcknight]

10 seconds is more than enough time to repent. Saint Catherine tells us that someone repented in the time it took to fall off a horse and hit the ground, that’s about a tenth of a second.