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Frankie65
Guest
See Margaret Ann’s message about our Lady of Salette above. It doesn’t come clearer than that
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jesusmademe
Guest
Tis_Bearself
Patron
I disagree with your opinion about buying and selling. I believe that by going to Mass and spending time in prayer, I have “kept the Lord’s day holy” and it is unimportant whether I also visited Walmart or purchased something on eBay on Sunday.
YMMV.
This is another case where you are free to have an opinion about what you personally want to do on Sunday, but kindly don’t impose it on others or present it as being “Church teaching” that good Catholics don’t shop on Sundays. The Church does not teach that we must refrain from buying things on Sunday in order to keep the Lord’s day holy. When you claim that other Catholics don’t keep the Lord’s day well because they buy something, that is your opinion, only.
Regarding Our Lady of Salette, I would first note that Catholics are not required to believe in approved private revelations. Second, even if we do believe in Our Lady of Salette, her message made it clear that it wasn’t merely a case of people working on Sunday. They also were not going to Mass on Sunday, were mocking the Catholic faith, were taking the name of the Lord in vain, were disregarding the Church rule not to eat meat on Friday, and were not saying their prayers. In general, they had fallen away from religious practice and faith in God. For you to seize upon Sunday shopping, only, as the key message of La Salette is ignoring the overall message.
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newconvertcatholic
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@Tis_Bearself I have to disagree with you on this. I am not perfect at all and I do shop on Sundays at all. That said I do not believe simply going to mass and praying fulfills the commandment to keep the Lord’s day holy. That is actually a very minimalist approach to religion.
Keeping the Lord’s day holy means doing nothing unnecessary or fanciful on that day. Jesus did condemn using Lord’s day as an excuse to not doing holy things like helping our neighbor but he also said that he hasn’t come to abolish the Law and the Law is clear.
And in this case, I don’t think it’s a question of personal choice. It’s a commandment. Yes, it is hard to keep and I doubt it’s grave matter, but shopping on Sunday is a sin albeit venial in my opinion. And frankly, I don’t think it matter whether’s it’s a computer, whether transaction takes place or not, it’s a matter of conscience.
Are you honoring the Lord by shopping on Sunday = no
Is it a sin = yes, unless there is no way you can avoid shopping
It is it a grave sin that needs to be confessed = not if it happens once in a blue moon but if it’s a regular thing, it’s a problem
Not being a Pharisee here, i also struggle with this and I am trying my best to avoid all shopping on Sundays and Holy Days by doing the shopping at the any other point in the week. You can obviously log on to internent and buy on Monday. If you choose to do it on Sunday, I’m afraid you are breaking a commandment.
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newconvertcatholic
Guest
This is a typical example of Christians adapting to modern society’s standards instead of what God wanted for us.
God wanted us to rest one day a week. Think about those restaurant workers, they don’t need to work on Sundays. If there was a collective effort to ban Sunday trading and have a 35-work week as is the case here in France, this wouldn’t be an issue at all.
We are made to work six days a week and rest the seventh day. It is for our own good that God commanded this. It is unfortunate that we cannot even offer one day up to the Lord and we’re so caught up in our materialistic culture.
I am fully part of it and I take my share of the blame. But how have we come to this where the day of our Lord’s resurrection matters less to us than shopping?
No serious, practicing Jew would do this on Sabbath and muslims fast for a whole month during daytime. As Catholics, we should at least be trying to keep the commandments of God, not find excuses for our behavior and moral deprivation of society.
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Frankie65
Guest
Certain people seem to think this is my opinion and I should therefore not dare to impose my opinion on others. I an new on this site. Show me any of my posts where I have imposed my opinion on others. Is it possible to impose an opinion on an online forum? Am I forcing you to shop or not shake hands with someone in Mass or anything else? Everything I have written is in line with church Fathers. Hate it if you want to, if it opposes your way of life.
St Alfonsus Liguori: . “Smallness of matter excuses from the violation of the precept. But what should we consider to be sufficient matter for mortal sin? Some theologians say, that to work for an hour is a mortal sin; others extend the time to two hours; but unless there is a just cause, the shortness of the time employed in work does not excuse from venial sin.”
St Alfonsus Liguori: . “Smallness of matter excuses from the violation of the precept. But what should we consider to be sufficient matter for mortal sin? Some theologians say, that to work for an hour is a mortal sin; others extend the time to two hours; but unless there is a just cause, the shortness of the time employed in work does not excuse from venial sin.”
Tis_Bearself
Patron
You’re free to disagree. We disagree with each other on many things on the forum.
The problem is that when people present their personal view of a practice, whether it is shopping on Sunday, or one of the other things people mentioned in passing in the thread - women not working outside the home, etc. - like it is a Church teaching.
People read this forum who are not Catholic. Someone who is an atheist may think that the Catholic church teaches that we can’t buy anything, not even hit the “Pay” button on an ebay auction that we put a bid in for on Satuday and that ended Sunday, without it being a sin.
This is an area that the Church leaves up to people’s personal judgment and you can ask 50 priests and get 50 different opinions, just like what is happening on this thread.
The only reason I have continued to post here is to make clear that the opinions on the thread are just that, people’s opinions, and not the teaching of the Church.
The teaching of the Church on the Third Commandment is in the Catechism and the link is already posted in the thread. It does not contain any prohibition on Sunday shopping and simply states that “the faithful are to refrain from engaging in work or activities that hinder the worship owed to God, the joy proper to the Lord’s Day, the performance of the works of mercy, and the appropriate relaxation of mind and body. Family needs or important social service can legitimately excuse from the obligation of Sunday rest. The faithful should see to it that legitimate excuses do not lead to habits prejudicial to religion, family life, and health.”
People may use their judgment in interpreting this.
With that, I am done with this thread, as I am repeating myself and it is not necessary for me to post the same thing to everybody who wishes to take a more extreme view of Sunday practice. Have a nice day.
The problem is that when people present their personal view of a practice, whether it is shopping on Sunday, or one of the other things people mentioned in passing in the thread - women not working outside the home, etc. - like it is a Church teaching.
People read this forum who are not Catholic. Someone who is an atheist may think that the Catholic church teaches that we can’t buy anything, not even hit the “Pay” button on an ebay auction that we put a bid in for on Satuday and that ended Sunday, without it being a sin.
This is an area that the Church leaves up to people’s personal judgment and you can ask 50 priests and get 50 different opinions, just like what is happening on this thread.
The only reason I have continued to post here is to make clear that the opinions on the thread are just that, people’s opinions, and not the teaching of the Church.
The teaching of the Church on the Third Commandment is in the Catechism and the link is already posted in the thread. It does not contain any prohibition on Sunday shopping and simply states that “the faithful are to refrain from engaging in work or activities that hinder the worship owed to God, the joy proper to the Lord’s Day, the performance of the works of mercy, and the appropriate relaxation of mind and body. Family needs or important social service can legitimately excuse from the obligation of Sunday rest. The faithful should see to it that legitimate excuses do not lead to habits prejudicial to religion, family life, and health.”
People may use their judgment in interpreting this.
With that, I am done with this thread, as I am repeating myself and it is not necessary for me to post the same thing to everybody who wishes to take a more extreme view of Sunday practice. Have a nice day.
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Sarcelle
Guest
Or sit and face the wall and endlessly pray until Monday.
Can’t use electricity or water since that makes the utility workers work on Sunday which makes you an accessory to sin.
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Sarcelle
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I disagree.
You are not the Magisterium and you do not have the authority to declare something as sin.
It’s best for the OP to talk to his or her parish priest for guidance which counts more than the opinions of strangers.
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ZMystiCat
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I didn’t realize that the early Church knew about Amazon.
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IdaCatholic
Guest
I shop on Sunday all the time. Do you think I am sinning? If so, why?
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Mi_Rose
Guest
It is not a sin. Shopping in stores on Sunday is not a sin either. Remember the Lord’s day and keep it holy is what the Commandment says not Thou shalt not shop on Amazon on the sabbath.
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IdaCatholic
Guest
Please cite from the Catechism.
Just a few random thoughts:
This issue goes far beyond restaurants and retail sales.
Do you like to spend Sunday afternoons reading the newspaper? It was delivered by somebody working on Sunday. Your Monday newspaper will be written by people working on Sunday.
Like to enjoy a nice movie on TV or listen to your favorite radio station on Sunday? People are working at those stations.
Movies? Swimming pool? The local gym? All require people to work in order to operate.
Traveling a long distance to visit someone? Somebody needs to work at the gas station so you can fill up to make it home. Do you travel to by bus, train, airplane? All require people to work.
How about going to a ball game? Ticket sellers, ushers, concession workers - even the athletes themselves if they are professionals - all work on Sunday to put on that game.
The point I am trying to make is that there are many, many people whose Sunday labor we rely on. Drawing the line between what is essential and non-essential is very difficult.
This issue goes far beyond restaurants and retail sales.
Do you like to spend Sunday afternoons reading the newspaper? It was delivered by somebody working on Sunday. Your Monday newspaper will be written by people working on Sunday.
Like to enjoy a nice movie on TV or listen to your favorite radio station on Sunday? People are working at those stations.
Movies? Swimming pool? The local gym? All require people to work in order to operate.
Traveling a long distance to visit someone? Somebody needs to work at the gas station so you can fill up to make it home. Do you travel to by bus, train, airplane? All require people to work.
How about going to a ball game? Ticket sellers, ushers, concession workers - even the athletes themselves if they are professionals - all work on Sunday to put on that game.
The point I am trying to make is that there are many, many people whose Sunday labor we rely on. Drawing the line between what is essential and non-essential is very difficult.
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Sarcelle
Guest
It says keeping the Lord’s day holy.
This means Sunday as a Holy Day of Obligation where the attendance of mass Is obligatory. It does not say anything about shopping or watching TV or cooking or laundry being forbidden under pain of sin.
My point still remains. You are still not the Magisterium.
By the way I sometimes work on Sundays and my parish priest says it’s not a sin to work or shop for that matter. I’d believe him over you.
This means Sunday as a Holy Day of Obligation where the attendance of mass Is obligatory. It does not say anything about shopping or watching TV or cooking or laundry being forbidden under pain of sin.
My point still remains. You are still not the Magisterium.
By the way I sometimes work on Sundays and my parish priest says it’s not a sin to work or shop for that matter. I’d believe him over you.
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Sarcelle
Guest
Yes
I work in the railroad industry and this industry still delivers goods even on a Sunday and yet I have not heard the Catholic Church forbid Catholics from working in the transportation industry lest they have to work on Sunday and in the process commit sin.
Even switching on the lights, flushing the toilet necessitates the need for utility workers to work on a Sunday. Do we sin if we flush the toilet?
I work in the railroad industry and this industry still delivers goods even on a Sunday and yet I have not heard the Catholic Church forbid Catholics from working in the transportation industry lest they have to work on Sunday and in the process commit sin.
Even switching on the lights, flushing the toilet necessitates the need for utility workers to work on a Sunday. Do we sin if we flush the toilet?
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PennyinCanada
Guest
I went to a bar mitzvah and they were not to start until after sundown. Sunset was at 6pm according to the weather station, but they waited until 6:30 pm. Why didn’t they start at 6:05? They added a full 1/2 hour. That spoke to me on how they showed a, what’s the word, willingness? to follow God. A certain care and attention in following God. It touched my heart that they did that.
Many times our questions are about how close can we get to the edge without falling off. Not many questions on how a person can be generous with God. How can we honor God with how we live. How are we a light to someone as we follow God?
When we love someone, we do things that show we love them. Not once a year because it’s their birthday and there’s maybe a sense of obligation. I can’t overlook a birthday. But that showing we care for them should be often.
If there’s any task that can be moved to Saturday or Monday, take that opportunity and say Jesus I love you, save souls.
Many times our questions are about how close can we get to the edge without falling off. Not many questions on how a person can be generous with God. How can we honor God with how we live. How are we a light to someone as we follow God?
When we love someone, we do things that show we love them. Not once a year because it’s their birthday and there’s maybe a sense of obligation. I can’t overlook a birthday. But that showing we care for them should be often.
If there’s any task that can be moved to Saturday or Monday, take that opportunity and say Jesus I love you, save souls.
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Cruciferi
Guest
Mark 2:27
Then he said to them, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
Catechism of the Catholic Church
In Brief
2189 “Observe the sabbath day, to keep it holy” (Deut 5:12). “The seventh day is a sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the Lord” ( Ex 31:15).
2190 The sabbath, which represented the completion of the first creation, has been replaced by Sunday which recalls the new creation inaugurated by the Resurrection of Christ.
2191 The Church celebrates the day of Christ’s Resurrection on the “eighth day,” Sunday, which is rightly called the Lord’s Day (cf. SC 106).
2192 “Sunday . . . is to be observed as the foremost holy day of obligation in the universal Church” (CIC, can. 1246 § 1). “On Sundays and other holy days of obligation the faithful are bound to participate in the Mass” (CIC, can. 1247).
2193 “On Sundays and other holy days of obligation the faithful are bound . . . to abstain from those labors and business concerns which impede the worship to be rendered to God, the joy which is proper to the Lord’s Day, or the proper relaxation of mind and body” (CIC, can. 1247).
2194 The institution of Sunday helps all “to be allowed sufficient rest and leisure to cultivate their amilial, cultural, social, and religious lives” ( GS 67 § 3).
2195 Every Christian should avoid making unnecessary demands on others that would hinder them from observing the Lord’s Day.
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a3.htm
Then he said to them, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
Catechism of the Catholic Church
In Brief
2189 “Observe the sabbath day, to keep it holy” (Deut 5:12). “The seventh day is a sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the Lord” ( Ex 31:15).
2190 The sabbath, which represented the completion of the first creation, has been replaced by Sunday which recalls the new creation inaugurated by the Resurrection of Christ.
2191 The Church celebrates the day of Christ’s Resurrection on the “eighth day,” Sunday, which is rightly called the Lord’s Day (cf. SC 106).
2192 “Sunday . . . is to be observed as the foremost holy day of obligation in the universal Church” (CIC, can. 1246 § 1). “On Sundays and other holy days of obligation the faithful are bound to participate in the Mass” (CIC, can. 1247).
2193 “On Sundays and other holy days of obligation the faithful are bound . . . to abstain from those labors and business concerns which impede the worship to be rendered to God, the joy which is proper to the Lord’s Day, or the proper relaxation of mind and body” (CIC, can. 1247).
2194 The institution of Sunday helps all “to be allowed sufficient rest and leisure to cultivate their amilial, cultural, social, and religious lives” ( GS 67 § 3).
2195 Every Christian should avoid making unnecessary demands on others that would hinder them from observing the Lord’s Day.
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a3.htm
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Cruciferi
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I “actually” checked the Catechism and you’re Fine 
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bassmansteiny
Guest
Just to add to the conversation, and I am not saying to buy or not buy on the interwebs on Sunday, the USPS does deliver Amazon packages on Sunday. Sorry if someone already mentioned this.
Another thing I might add. Most of your online stores like Ebay and Amazon, your transactions are all done electronically and not through an individual normally. Of course there are exceptions to this. Again, not telling the OP what to do.
Another thing I might add. Most of your online stores like Ebay and Amazon, your transactions are all done electronically and not through an individual normally. Of course there are exceptions to this. Again, not telling the OP what to do.
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