Is pedophilia more sinful than homosexuality?

[TEPO]

If pedophilia is a mental “disorder” that requires treatment, then how is it a sin…?

If homosexuality is not a mental disorder, but a sexual “orientation” that requires no treatment, then how is it not a sin…?

Is it true then that the sin of acting out as a homosexual with no remorse is more grave than the sin of acting out as a pedophile full of guilt?

 

[Pitcharan]

If pedophilia is a mental “disorder” that requires treatment, then how is it a sin…?

If homosexuality is not a mental disorder, but a sexual “orientation” that requires no treatment, then how is it not a sin…?

Is it true then that the sin of acting out as a homosexual with no remorse is more grave than the sin of acting out as a pedophile full of guilt?

Every kind of sin, is a consequence of “interior defilement” that makes us succumb to temptation. The nature of defilement (mental disorder) has a wide variety and we are given a “free will” to either resist or willingly co-operate with our defilement.

 

[itullian]

yes, a child is innocent, vulnerable,and not capable of decisions

as you can tell,i believe in gradations of sin and evil.

 

[underacloud]

When you talk about mental illness, remorse, guilt, etc you are discussing the subjective nature of sin. This is hard to talk about in an abstract sense and is really up to God alone to judge.

If we want to talk about the objective nature of sin, I believe pedophilia to be much graver sin than homosexuality. I’m not sure if the Church would say anything on such a comparison, but pedophilia corrupts the innocent and destroys lives, whereas homosexuality is generally conducted between consenting adults who can make their own lifestyle choices. This is why there is generally a legal age of consent, and I think the principle holds in the moral sense.

“Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but woe to the man through whom they come!” Matthew 18:7

To apply this to pedophilia, I think it’s fair to say that God will be very angry with those who sexually corrupt children.

 

[TEPO]

yes, a child is innocent, vulnerable,and not capable of decisions

as you can tell,i believe in gradations of sin and evil.

I believe in gradations of sin too. But I’m not sure how to measure… Is it the result of a sin that determines its severity, or is it based on the sinner -depending on what gifts or lack thereof one might possess… In other words, say for example that I’m a veterinarian who loves animals with all my heart -but one night, I decide to take a gun and go on a dog-killing spree. To do such a horrific act goes against all that I hold dear. On the same token, another man who’s family was recently mauled by a pack of pit bulls loses control after dining at the cafe he used to take his family to when he sees a man walking a pack of pit bulls out the window. He then grabs a steak knife off the table, runs outside and kills all the dogs.

Now both men have committed the same sin and have done equal damage… Is one mans sin more grave than the others…?

 

[TEPO]

When you talk about mental illness, remorse, guilt, etc you are discussing the subjective nature of sin. This is hard to talk about in an abstract sense and is really up to God alone to judge.

If we want to talk about the objective nature of sin, I believe pedophilia to be much graver sin than homosexuality. I’m not sure if the Church would say anything on such a comparison, but pedophilia corrupts the innocent and destroys lives, whereas homosexuality is generally conducted between consenting adults who can make their own lifestyle choices. This is why there is generally a legal age of consent, and I think the principle holds in the moral sense.

“Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but woe to the man through whom they come!” Matthew 18:7

To apply this to pedophilia, I think it’s fair to say that God will be very angry with those who sexually corrupt children.

Yes, the subjective nature of sin… Surely the church has a position on this to some extent… I would think.

 

[thistle]

If pedophilia is a mental “disorder” that requires treatment, then how is it a sin…?

If homosexuality is not a mental disorder, but a sexual “orientation” that requires no treatment, then how is it not a sin…?

Is it true then that the sin of acting out as a homosexual with no remorse is more grave than the sin of acting out as a pedophile full of guilt?

In terms of dying with either sin on your soul they both send you to Hell.
I have never understood the merit in arguing about the degree of gravity of mortal sins. They all have the same effect (put you in a state of mortal sin) and have the same consequence if you die unrepentant (you go immediately to Hell).

 

[Cbus]

There are a few passages in scripture that seem to imply that some sins are more grave than others. So I would have to say that pedophilia is a much more serious sin than homosexuality because of the damage it does to an innocent person.

I don’t buy for a second the mental illness argument. Just because someone is attracted to children doesn’t mean they have to act on it. If we can expect straight men to not fornicate with women, then I think we are justified in expecting pedophiles to keep their hands to themselves.

 

[dailey]

A mortal sin is a mortal sin. I don’t get how why people try to figure out which one is worse? If they can both possibly send you to hell, then who cares?

So to answer your question, is pedophilia more sinful than homosexuality? No.

 

[GEddie]

I believe in gradations of sin too. But I’m not sure how to measure… Is it the result of a sin that determines its severity, or is it based on the sinner -depending on what gifts or lack thereof one might possess… In other words, say for example that I’m a veterinarian who loves animals with all my heart -but one night, I decide to take a gun and go on a dog-killing spree. To do such a horrific act goes against all that I hold dear. On the same token, another man who’s family was recently mauled by a pack of pit bulls loses control after dining at the cafe he used to take his family to when he sees a man walking a pack of pit bulls out the window. He then grabs a steak knife off the table, runs outside and kills all the dogs.

Now both men have committed the same sin and have done equal damage… Is one mans sin more grave than the others…?

What would motivate the veterinarian in your example to go killing dogs?

There is always something twisted in our psyche when we become involved in sinning. Without knowing what that factor is, it is pointless to speculate on the sin’s relative severity.

That goes for pedophiliac/gay issues. Pedophilia excites more anger than does gayness, possibly because of the relative innocence of the youths involved. But the anger felt by those uninvolved does not, in itself, equate to severity of sin.

ICXC NIKA

 

[NeedImprovement]

. . . I have never understood the merit in arguing about the degree of gravity of mortal sins. They all have the same effect (put you in a state of mortal sin) and have the same consequence if you die unrepentant (you go immediately to Hell).

 

[NeedImprovement]

. . . If homosexuality is not a mental disorder, but a sexual “orientation” that requires no treatment, then how is it not a sin…? . . .

Not to argue, but certainly to clarify :

I believe the emphasis should fall on the word " if " in the portion of the OP’s statement quoted above . There doesn’t appear to be any scientific proof that homosexuality is not a mental disorder . The only reason “homosexuality” no longer appears on the American Psychiatric Association’s list of disorders is that the APA was intimidated into removing it from the list by gay militants . Even the activists who spearheaded the attacks against members of the APA admit that the decision to remove homosexuality from the list of disorders was “always more of a political decision than a medical decision.”

Homosexual Activists Intimidate American Psychiatric Association into Removing Homosexuality from List of Disorders

"Kay Lahusen and Barbera Gittings know what really happened to the APA. In the book, Making History they are quite open about the reality.

Kay: This was always more of a political decision than a medical decision.
Barbara: It never was a medical decision—and that’s why I think the action came so fast. After all, it was only three years from the time that feminists and gays first sapped the APA at a behavior therapy session to the time that the Board of Trustees voted in 1973 to approve removing homosexuality from the list of mental disorders. It was a political move.” (Making History, p.224)

The APA was thoroughly intimidated. Later in the same year (1974), after the APA’s vote, Gittings was interviewed by a historian of the same-gender sex movement, Jonathan Ned Katz. Gittings brags, “That’s how far we’ve come in ten years. Now we even have the American Psychiatric Association running scared.” (Gay American History, by Jonathan Ned Katz, 1992, p.427. This interview was taped July 19, 1974). Anytime a scientific organization endorses same-gender sex, remember Gittings words: “They are running scared.” Same-gender sex activists have learned that intimidation works and they are never hesitant about using intimidation, psychological manipulation and deceit to reach the goals of their radical agenda."

As far as homosexuality being a sin , Father John Hardon, S.J.'s approach from his Modern Catholic Dictionary cuts through a lot of confusion, specifying that three levels are to be distinguished :

• tendency
• attraction
• activity

Of these three, active homosexuality is morally indefensible

HOMOSEXUALITY. In general, some form of sexual relationship among members of the same sex. From a moral standpoint, three levels are to be distinguished: tendency, attraction, and activity. Homosexual tendencies in any person are within the normal range of human nature, whose fallen condition includes every conceivable kind of impulse that with sincere effort and divine grace can be controlled. Sexual attraction for members of the same sex may be partly due to the peculiar make-up of certain individuals or, more often, the result of indiscretion or seduction and presents a graver problem; yet this, too, is not by itself sinful and may in fact be an occasion for great supernatural merit. When the condition is pathological, it requires therapy. Active homosexuality is morally indefensible and has been many times forbidden in revelation and the teaching of the Church. The most extensive declaration on the subject was by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, approved by Pope Paul VI on November 7, 1975.

Returning to the OP’s quote again -

. . . If homosexuality is not a mental disorder, but a sexual “orientation” that requires no treatment, then how is it not a sin…? . . .

It is neither society’s physicians ( nor their lack of moral integrity ) which defines sin.

 

[TEPO]

Not to argue, but certainly to clarify :

I believe the emphasis should fall on the word " if " in the portion of the OP’s statement quoted above . There doesn’t appear to be any scientific proof that homosexuality is not a mental disorder . The only reason “homosexuality” no longer appears on the American Psychiatric Association’s list of disorders is that the APA was intimidated into removing it from the list by gay militants . Even the activists who spearheaded the attacks against members of the APA admit that the decision to remove homosexuality from the list of disorders was “always more of a political decision than a medical decision.”

Homosexual Activists Intimidate American Psychiatric Association into Removing Homosexuality from List of Disorders

As far as homosexuality being a sin , Father John Hardon, S.J.'s approach from his Modern Catholic Dictionary cuts through a lot of confusion, specifying that three levels are to be distinguished :

• tendency
• attraction
• activity

Of these three, active homosexuality is morally indefensible

Returning to the OP’s quote again -

It is neither society’s physicians ( nor their lack of moral integrity ) which defines sin.

Excellent post.

So now I musk ask -what is the benefit of removing homosexuality from the list of disorders…? Does medicine still have the authority to find a cure for homosexuality -or is it now “protected” from treatment.

I would have to assume that universal healthcare would reject treatment for homosexuality even if it found a cure…

 

[TEPO]

Is the refusal to treat an immoral disorder a form of religious oppression?

 

[Dakota_Roberts]

If pedophilia is a mental “disorder” that requires treatment, then how is it a sin…?

If homosexuality is not a mental disorder, but a sexual “orientation” that requires no treatment, then how is it not a sin…?

Is it true then that the sin of acting out as a homosexual with no remorse is more grave than the sin of acting out as a pedophile full of guilt?

Paedophilia is a mental disorder (specifically a paraphilia). Most of them understand what they are doing is extremely wrong, but many try to rationalize it as they are helping the child… Paedophilia is effectively incurable.

Actions can be sinful, unbidden desires can’t. A recurring desire to engage in sexual acts with the same sex shows up no more on mental illness tests that a recurring desire to engage in masturbation, i.e. as long as they aren’t addicted it doesn’t show up.

No, because one is a solitary sin whereas the other typically involves many sins .

 

[JimG]

If by pedophilia and homosexuality, one means particular types of sexual inclinations, that it would seem that neither one is sinful unless willingly acted upon. In the same way, a sexual inclination toward a person of the opposite sex becomes sinful only if one willfully engages in lustful desires, or fornication, or adultery.

 

[Usagi]

An adult who has sex with a child or young teenager invariably commits rape, over and above any concerns about having sex with a forbidden “target,” so I would say that the pedophilic act is very much worse.

Two men or two women having consensual sex may be sinful, but it’s not generally my business to intervene in their activities. An adult raping a child (or another adult, of either sex), on the other hand, imposes on me a duty to call the cops and possibly intervene physically if I am able to do so.

Usagi

 

[JimG]

An adult who has sex with a child or young teenager invariably commits rape, over and above any concerns about having sex with a forbidden “target,” so I would say that the pedophilic act is very much worse.

Two men or two women having consensual sex may be sinful, but it’s not generally my business to intervene in their activities. An adult raping a child (or another adult, of either sex), on the other hand, imposes on me a duty to call the cops and possibly intervene physically if I am able to do so.

Usagi

Agreed. But it is the act that is sinful, not the inclination. (The inclination may be disordered, but that is a distinct matter.)

 

[Usagi]

Agreed. But it is the act that is sinful, not the inclination. (The inclination may be disordered, but that is a distinct matter.)

Agreed. That’s why I talked about “having sex” in various combinations rather than just speaking of the conditions in general.

Usagi

 

[TEPO]

What would motivate the veterinarian in your example to go killing dogs?

There is always something twisted in our psyche when we become involved in sinning. Without knowing what that factor is, it is pointless to speculate on the sin’s relative severity.

That goes for pedophiliac/gay issues. Pedophilia excites more anger than does gayness, possibly because of the relative innocence of the youths involved. But the anger felt by those uninvolved does not, in itself, equate to severity of sin.

ICXC NIKA

The Veterinarian did it out of blood lust.

But now there’s a third man on the other side of town who is a Relativist. He just finished reading a series of articles by Stanley Fish, and was convinced that there was inherently nothing morally right or wrong. So he shot a farmers yard dogs as moving target practice last night.

Now there’s three men…

One sinned out of lust
One sinned out of insanity
One sinned because he had no faith

Are all three sins equal in measure?