Is Protestantism by its nature promote Relativism?

[c_martyr]

While “faith cometh by hearing” and “hearing from the Word of God”, Jesus said, “Whoever hears you, hears me.”

Yes, he was speaking to those who are his true disciples. Initially, this related to the ministry of the apostles, being sent by Christ, and yet it does not end with the apostles. Every born agian believer in Christ bears his name, and has the priviledge and responsability to speak in the authority of his name, seeing how he hath made us all “kings and priests” (see 1 Pet. 2:9, 3:15; Rev. 1:6). He who rejects the body rejects the head. Christ hath made all believers to be “salt and light” to the world, in order that we might give testimony to his glory through the proclamation of the word. When our message is despised, then Christ, who is our message is despised.

*both *Protestants and Catholics did things that weren’t Christ-like but . . . a discussion of the blame game during the Reformation isn’t going to help either side in this thread’s debate.

Please tell me that you are not trying to equate the two. There is no comparison whatsoever. Catholics murdered Protestants for centuries; burning them at the stake with their bibles tied around their necks. My Protestant fathers (and their children) had their tongues cut out of their mouths for reciting the Lord’s Prayer in the common language and not in Latin. The inquisition is responsible for the most in-humane torture methods imaginable. So please, lets not just pretend that we can wash the dark history of your church over with some egalitarian statement like, “both Protestants and Catholics did things that weren’t Christ-like.”

 

[JonNC]

Originally Posted by Dancelittleewok
both Protestants and Catholics did things that weren’t Christ-like but . . . a discussion of the blame game during the Reformation isn’t going to help either side in this thread’s debate.

Nor will it lead to a climate for reconciliation.

Please tell me that you are not trying to equate the two. There is no comparison whatsoever. Catholics murdered Protestants for centuries; burning them at the stake with their bibles tied around their necks. My Protestant fathers (and their children) had their tongues cut out of their mouths for reciting the Lord’s Prayer in the common language and not in Latin. The inquisition is responsible for the most in-humane torture methods imaginable. So please, lets not just pretend that we can wash the dark history of your church over with some egalitarian statement like, “both Protestants and Catholics did things that weren’t Christ-like.”

I don’t think Dance is trying to wash the darker moments in history of the Catholic Church. Nor should we the darker moments of those involved in the reformation.

Jon

 

[c_martyr]

Nor will it lead to a climate for reconciliation.

The Catholic religion needs to be reconciled to Jesus Christ. When and if this ever happens, it will only be by the rich and powerful rediscovery of the authority and centrality of the Scriptures in the life of the church. Until then, may the body of Christ pray for your insitution.

 

[Mikeoffaith]

If you look back in the Early Church, Early Christians worship is Liturgical and the belief in the Real Presence is very clear. Protestantism have departed from ancient Christian Liturgy and deny the Real Presence.

Wow if this is what you are using to define Protestantism, then this is fantastic news for us Lutherans. Our worship is both Liturgical and are belief in the Real Presence is quite clear.

 

[larkin31]

“Protestantism” has been mis-defined and misconstrued many times at CA. It is one of the reasons I have been here: to help dispel the misconceptions toward Protestants.

 

[JonNC]

The Catholic religion needs to be reconciled to Jesus Christ. When and if this ever happens, it will only be by the rich and powerful rediscovery of the authority and centrality of the Scriptures in the life of the church. Until then, may the body of Christ pray for your insitution.

I feel my institution is quite reconciled to Christ, and I believe the Catholic Church is, as well. Unfortunately, we are not completely reconciled to each other, as Christ commands us to be. So, to that extent, I join you in what you expressed in the emoticon: we should all go pray.

Jon

 

[KathleenGee]

c_martyr,

I think people hate the Catholic Church as well by its image. I think you would be very surprised just how much Catholics center their life on Christ as well. The clergy you see on TV – many have a deep and profound faith in Christ.

There were atrocities committed by both sides. The Church has apologized and there are Protestant leaderships who have also regretted the past.

You also have to take a larger picture of the times of the Reformation as well, and also note that what was happening universally was different in different geographical areas of the world. What was happening in Italy, France, Switzerland, Germany, Spain, and England were times of their beginning globalist expansions…alot of personal ambition and ego of peoples in those times.

Pride cometh before the fall.

Sin is essentially a break from God and neighbor.

 

[c_martyr]

I feel my institution is quite reconciled to Christ, and I believe the Catholic Church is, as well. Unfortunately, we are not completely reconciled to each other, as Christ commands us to be. So, to that extent, I join you in what you expressed in the emoticon: we should all go pray.

John, I understand that you feel your institution is reconciled to Christ. Unfortunately though, these things cannot be determined by feelings. The true test of whether or not a body of people are walking in the truth in Christ, is by what they teach and preach. Therefore, this issue is about the gospel, which is the only thing that can unite your institution to the church of Jesus Christ.

I think people hate the Catholic Church as well by its image. I think you would be very surprised just how much Catholics center their life on Christ as well. The clergy you see on TV – many have a deep and profound faith in Christ.

I understand where you are coming from. Unfortunately, however, the Christ that your religion preaches is not the same Christ of the New Testament. The more you read the Scriptures, the clearer this will become (2 Cor. 11:1-5). Also, it is important to understand that unity can only be achieved, if it is cerntered around to the truth of the gospel. Therefore, what needs to take place is your religion needs to embrace the true gospel. For this, I shall ever pray.

 

[JonNC]

John, I understand that you feel your institution is reconciled to Christ. Unfortunately though, these things cannot be determined by feelings. The true test of whether or not a body of people are walking in the truth in Christ, is by what they teach and preach. Therefore, this issue is about the gospel, which is the only thing that can unite your institution to the church of Jesus Christ.

Agreed. bookofconcord.org/augsburgconfession.php

Jon

 

[JonNC]

C,
What is your faith communion?

Jon

 

[KathleenGee]

Yes, second it.

By the way, I do not intend to get into debates…but I can assure you I have shared faith experiences with protestants and we all center on the same Christ.

 

[JonNC]

Yes, second it.

By the way, I do not intend to get into debates…but I can assure you I have shared faith experiences with protestants and we all center on the same Christ.

Jon

 

[c_martyr]

C,
What is your faith communion?

Jon

Our church does not label itself. We are a gospel church. We are called Grace Bible Church. Those who have attempted to label us in the past have called us “sovereign gracers.”

Our website: grace-bible.com/

Here are a few links to the pastors and churches which are in communion with ours:

donfortner.com/

henrytmahan.com/

Check them out, and listen to some of the messages.

 

[Nicea325]

I understand where you are coming from. Unfortunately, however, the Christ that your religion preaches is not the same Christ of the New Testament. The more you read the Scriptures, the clearer this will become (2 Cor. 11:1-5). Also, it is important to understand that unity can only be achieved, if it is cerntered around to the truth of the gospel. Therefore, what needs to take place is your religion needs to embrace the true gospel. For this, I shall ever pray

What arrogance you display! And your religion preaches the Christ of the NT? To judge others as to whether they follow the Jesus of the NT? Your man-made church does nothing of the sort!

I’ll pray you snap out of it and realize you follow one man-made church out of THOUSANDS!

 

[KathleenGee]

Thanks for the info on the association…I read some passages from your church and I have the same understanding of Christ.

 

[c_martyr]

What arrogance you display! And your religion preaches the Christ of the NT? To judge others as to whether they follow the Jesus of the NT? Your man-made church does nothing of the sort!

I’ll pray you snap out of it and realize you follow one man-made church out of THOUSANDS!

I am not here to be arrogant. Unfortunately, this is the perception you have of me simply because I speak with confindence and authority. However, please understand that I speak not in my own authority, but on the authority of the word of God.

I am open, and consider everything that is said on this forum in defense of the Catholic religion. But you treat your guests as if they are somehow obligated to agree, and if they do not, they are somehow arrogant. This is a shame, and no effective way to prove your case. Your abusive ad hominem attacks only point to the lack of substance there is in your position.

I admit that I set forth a stong proposition. And if I am challenged on it, then I will build my case from the Scriptures. I only wonder if there is any here who would even give an ear and an open heart of consideration.

My experience on this forum has caused me to adopt Galatians 4:16 as my personal passage. All this talk about “anti-catholics” is pretty hypocritical, seeing how the spirit of this forum in large measure is anti-protestant.

 

[graceandglory]

I’ve noticed that too. Sometimes I think it would be fun to invent a denomination, you know, just for kicks. I wouldn’t actually promote or believe in it though, it would just be weekend project. Or perhaps I could write my own Gospel …

 

[graceandglory]

However, please understand that **I speak not in my own authority, but on the authority of the word of God. **

:bigyikes:

isn’t that the basic definition of arrogance?

I’m not intending to poke fun, just to point out to you what you are really saying?
How did you come about this AUTHORITY of which you speak?

Please read this book:
books.google.com/books?id=KAR_-rRWOV4C&printsec=frontcover&dq=by+what+authority&source=bl&ots=adEGm_RsiH&sig=DB5DMzINwk1b0YU69SIdu2mYiyM&hl=en&ei=QuIeTIjVFcPpnQeR16jnAw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

[graceandglory]

I admit that I set forth a stong proposition. And if I am challenged on it, then I will build my case from the Scriptures. I only wonder if there is any here who would even give an ear and an open heart of consideration.

But you are delusional… You don’t have a strong proposition. You, personally, stand against 2,000 years of Scripture and Church authority…

We have already considered your case, and found it lacking. It’s not a difficult bridge to cross.

You want to argue from the bible alone?
Here you go.
scripturecatholic.com/scripture_alone.html

 

[KathleenGee]

Jesus and His apostles did not pass out Bibles.

There was no Gutenberg printing press until the 1400’s to make Bibles and Christians then were no different than those today.