Is smoking wrong or not?

[stanley123]

cynic:

And what about drinking alcohol, even a small consumption has been linked to an increased incidence of cancer.

This would seem to be true. I see where some posters say that smoking is a sin, either venial or mortal depending on the degree, and the reason given is that it causes cancer. But then, in order to be consistent, why would not it also be a sin to consume any amount of alcohol, if what you say is true.
On the other hand, I read some studies that link a moderate use of red wine to better health. But I don’t know if it was the red wine or if it was the diet which was the overriding factor in this.

 

[thistle]

To Cynic: I’ve never seen any studies that say a small amount of alcohol is linked to an increase in cancer. What type of cancer? Please show me where these studies are so I can read them.
The contrary is the case that small amounts of alcohol are in fact good for the health.

Also drinking moderately is not a sin. Jesus drank wine but he was free from sin.

 

[CreosMary]

Once again political correctness gone stupid. I follow the CCC sections as mentioned earlier section 2290.
But none of these political correctness fanatics seem to ponder on section 2291 which talks about the grave sin of Illicit drugs.
How many have to die, develop shizophrenia, loose limbs, internal organs, disrupt family and society before people start demanding an end to Drugs like heroin and cannabis. But its OK to use these drugs because the welfare Industry says so (it keeps them in a job).
I have yet to hear of someone who committed armed robbery or acts of violence to get ciggarettes.
By the way I enjoy about 5 Captain Black filtered cigars a day thank you…will you judge me?

 

[David_Zampino]

Scott Waddell:

Again, I’m not denying that smoking can become a compulsion, and perhaps some have a predisposition toward a bad habit, but responsibility belongs to the individual rather than going in for the modern (and frankly un-Catholic) notion that a personal failure to cultivate the virtue of temperance is someone/something else’s fault.

Scott

I completely agree.

 

[snoopy]

mjdonnelly:

Only doing it infrequently would not be a sin, since drinking in moderation is not, even though it still does damage to the body. It is the chain smoking, letting it run your life that is the sinful part. My father in law didn’t go on a cruise with his wife because he was worried about where to smoke.

My mother in law still went, she just paid for my wife to go with her.

Guess what? infrequent smoking leads to chain smoking–in most cases. Why take the chance. Plus- no one has addressed the fact that cigarettes are about $4.50 a pack in MN. Think of what could be done with that money. I don’t know how anyone can afford to be a heavy smoker in this day and age. But-- I will not convince anyone to stop if they don’t want to. For some, only a diagnosis of cancer or emphysema or stroke or heart attack may be the wake-up call. Unfortunately then it is almost always too late, and your choices are taken away from you. Then you can think about whether it was a sin or not.I know a lady who has lung cancer that was caused by smoking and she said " You kick yourself so much more knowing it was self-inflicted, and now it’s too late!"

 

[snoopy]

CreosMary:

Once again political correctness gone stupid. I follow the CCC sections as mentioned earlier section 2290.
But none of these political correctness fanatics seem to ponder on section 2291 which talks about the grave sin of Illicit drugs.
How many have to die, develop shizophrenia, loose limbs, internal organs, disrupt family and society before people start demanding an end to Drugs like heroin and cannabis. But its OK to use these drugs because the welfare Industry says so (it keeps them in a job).
I have yet to hear of someone who committed armed robbery or acts of violence to get ciggarettes.
By the way I enjoy about 5 Captain Black filtered cigars a day thank you…will you judge me?

NO, I will not judge you. You know that smoking kills. Do what you want, it’s your life.

 

[David_Zampino]

snoopy:

Guess what? infrequent smoking leads to chain smoking–in most cases.

In some cases. But not in all cases. Even not in many cases. This is why the medical definition of what constitutes an “addiction” needs to be firmed up.

snoopy:

Why take the chance.

Again, this is a significant part of the issue about the difficulty with the definition of addiction. For example, it has been medically demonstrated that at a certain level, cocaine IS addictive. At a certain level, opiates ARE addictive. You can’t go “cold turkey” without very real physical symptoms. Yet this has not been proven true with nicotine or caffeine or (name habit of choice here!) There is a distinct difference between a physical and/or psychological dependency and a chemical addiction.

snoopy:

Plus- no one has addressed the fact that cigarettes are about $4.50 a pack in MN.

That is another matter entirely, and a very good point. As Christians we are called upon to be good stewards with what we have been given.

snoopy:

Think of what could be done with that money. I don’t know how anyone can afford to be a heavy smoker in this day and age.

Indeed – but this is not limited to tobacco! This holds true for any voluntary choices we make with our money. Some choices are better than others. For me, I would not be using that $4.50 on cigarettes, but I might on a couple of Big Macs! (Which for me, in my state of life and health, might be more dangerous than a pack of smokes! )

snoopy:

But-- I will not convince anyone to stop if they don’t want to. For some, only a diagnosis of cancer or emphysema or stroke or heart attack may be the wake-up call. Unfortunately then it is almost always too late, and your choices are taken away from you. Then you can think about whether it was a sin or not.I know a lady who has lung cancer that was caused by smoking and she said " You kick yourself so much more knowing it was self-inflicted, and now it’s too late!"

This indeed is true . . . but again, the exact same statement can be made for many, many health and lifestyle choices.

My great concern is two-fold:

1. I don’t like the “health police” deciding ***for ***me what is best for me. Right now, smoking, drinking, and eating fatty foods are the “great sins” of America – while abortion, oral contraception, sexually transmitted diseases, homosexual behavior, etc. are ignored (when they are not being forcibly mainstreamed).
2. I don’t like that blatant mismanagement of health studies and statistics which HAVE gone along with the anti-smoking crusaders. The article listed below is outstanding on this subject.

cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv21n4/lies.pdf

Please understand that I am not trying to condone bad habits, etc., and I’ve made it clear to my children that cigarette smoking is a bad habit. But I do react negatively to some of the mindless hysteria coming from ***some ***in the anti-smoking movement.

Respectfully submitted,

 

[snoopy]

David Zampino:

In some cases. But not in all cases. Even not in many cases. This is why the medical definition of what constitutes an “addiction” needs to be firmed up.

Again, this is a significant part of the issue about the difficulty with the definition of addiction. For example, it has been medically demonstrated that at a certain level, cocaine IS addictive. At a certain level, opiates ARE addictive. You can’t go “cold turkey” without very real physical symptoms. Yet this has not been proven true with nicotine or caffeine or (name habit of choice here!) There is a distinct difference between a physical and/or psychological dependency and a chemical addiction.

That is another matter entirely, and a very good point. As Christians we are called upon to be good stewards with what we have been given.

Indeed – but this is not limited to tobacco! This holds true for any voluntary choices we make with our money. Some choices are better than others. For me, I would not be using that $4.50 on cigarettes, but I might on a couple of Big Macs! (Which for me, in my state of life and health, might be more dangerous than a pack of smokes! )

This indeed is true . . . but again, the exact same statement can be made for many, many health and lifestyle choices.

My great concern is two-fold:

1. I don’t like the “health police” deciding ***for ***me what is best for me. Right now, smoking, drinking, and eating fatty foods are the “great sins” of America – while abortion, oral contraception, sexually transmitted diseases, homosexual behavior, etc. are ignored (when they are not being forcibly mainstreamed).
2. I don’t like that blatant mismanagement of health studies and statistics which HAVE gone along with the anti-smoking crusaders. The article listed below is outstanding on this subject.

cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv21n4/lies.pdf

Please understand that I am not trying to condone bad habits, etc., and I’ve made it clear to my children that cigarette smoking is a bad habit. But I do react negatively to some of the mindless hysteria coming from ***some ***in the anti-smoking movement.

Respectfully submitted,

In my humble opinion, you are trying to justify something that even the most unintelligent beings know. Smoking Kills!!! And you are trying to define addictions with some form of scientific evidence, which you will not get. Here’s a thought, just ask smokers or former smokers how hard it is to quit. What is their definition of addiction. BTW, I’m not hysterical. I just feel very, very sorry for those who have just had a stroke, or heart attack, or been diagnosed with cancer or emphysema, and they know they did it to themselves. How do you think that must feel. How do you think the Lord feels when he gave you the precious gift of life with a perfect working machine and you squander it with something you absolutely know kills. I am not talking about a Big Mac here, I’m talking about a killer. How do you think your family feels, how about your children, your wife, your parents and everyone that loves you? However, it is not my job to be anyone’s caretaker. I just had a few minutes today and thought I would take the time to see if I could reach a smoker and plant a seed to quit.If you can’t quit for yourself, do it for the people who love you.

 

[stanley123]

thistle:

To Cynic: I’ve never seen any studies that say a small amount of alcohol is linked to an increase in cancer. What type of cancer? Please show me where these studies are so I can read them.

Artificial sweetners have been linked to cancer.

http://www.scambustersusa.com/articles/Drugs_and_Supplements/artificial_sweetner_deception.shtml

Also eating read meat has been linked to cancer.

http://in.news.yahoo.com/050112/139/2iz2x.html

Red 40 has been linked to cancer.

http://www.snet.net/features/qa/articles/2001/03160101.shtml

Here is the link for where it is claimed that alcohol can cause cnacer

http://www.cancer.org/downloads/PRO/alcohol.pdf#search='cancer alcohol’

Now does that mean that if a Catholic were to drink a diet Coke, or eat a hamburger, or eat a red jelly bean that he would suffer the horrific fire of either purgatory or hell for committing a venial or a mortal sin? What would be the difference between smoking cigarets or eating a red jelly bean, or eating a hamburger, when it is know that all three are linked to an increased risk for cancer?

 

[snoopy]

stanley123:

Artificial sweetners have been linked to cancer.

http://www.scambustersusa.com/articles/Drugs_and_Supplements/artificial_sweetner_deception.shtml

Also eating read meat has been linked to cancer.

http://in.news.yahoo.com/050112/139/2iz2x.html

Red 40 has been linked to cancer.

http://www.snet.net/features/qa/articles/2001/03160101.shtml

Here is the link for where it is claimed that alcohol can cause cnacer

http://www.cancer.org/downloads/PRO/alcohol.pdf#search='cancer alcohol’

Now does that mean that if a Catholic were to drink a diet Coke, or eat a hamburger, or eat a red jelly bean that he would suffer the horrific fire of either purgatory or hell for committing a venial or a mortal sin? What would be the difference between smoking cigarets or eating a red jelly bean, or eating a hamburger, when it is know that all three are linked to an increased risk for cancer?

I don’t know, why don’t you ask the American Cancer Society.

 

[Scott_Waddell]

snoopy:

I don’t know, why don’t you ask the American Cancer Society.

I didn’t realize they were qualified to speak on Catholic moral theology.

Scott

 

[snoopy]

Scott Waddell:

I didn’t realize they were qualified to speak on Catholic moral theology.

Scott

I didn’t say they were. The question was, what’s the difference if someone smokes, eats a red jellybean or eats a hamburger. Answer–Plenty. Ask the American Cancer Society.

 

[frogman80]

snoopy:

Here’s a thought, just ask smokers or former smokers how hard it is to quit. What is their definition of addiction.

My insurance company labels me as a smoker. (fact is they label anyone who has had a tobacco product in the past year a smoker!) I am a smoker… I smoke a pipe. At most a couple times a week… at least once a month. I also use nasal snuff. I am Catholic… moderation is important to me… I make efforts to keep my smoking moderate. I also strive to practice temperance.

What does this mean? Well, for one, I enjoy my pipe. If I think its is getting out of control, I put it away for awhile. I gave it up for lent last year, and will probably do the same this year. Honestly… the biggest “pull” that makes me want to smoke again is the flavor… the sugars in the tobacco. (It is a learned taste) Only when I have been intemperate does the chemical pull start to become an issue.

Is tobacco addicting… yes. Does the addiction remove free will? No, and if used in moderation, it doesn’t even interfere with your free will. Is tobacco for everyone? No.

My definition of addiction… well… .there are lots of things called “addiction.” How many people drink a couple cups of coffee a day, and then on the days when they can only find decaf the get headaches? For some this is caffeine addiction. Some people get addicted to nasal spray… they use it while sick to keep their nose open… but then their body adapts, and they become dependent on it.

So how about this question… when is “addiction” sinful? My answer would be when a person throws moderation and temperance out the window to indulge in something that will eventually lead to loss of control.

See my post above (#47)… I have listed some saints who used tobacco. I can guarantee they felt the effects of tobacco… just like we do today. It seems to me that addiction did not get in the way of their journey to Heaven.

 

[stanley123]

snoopy:

The question was, what’s the difference if someone smokes, eats a red jellybean or eats a hamburger. Answer–Plenty. Ask the American Cancer Society.

The links show that cigaret smoking, eating a red jelly bean, eating a hamburger, drinking a diet soda made from a certain type of artificial sweetner, and drinking alcohol have something in common - they all have the potential to increase the risk from cancer.
So if one were a sin, why wouldn’t they all be sins?
In fact, many alcoholic beverages contain a printed health warning on the container. It seems curious that smoking tobacoo is viewed as a sin because it has been linked to cancer, but other things not, even in the case of alcoholic beverages which have on them a printed warning? Where is the consistency?
By the way the last link on cancer related to alcoholic beverages was sponsored by the American Cancer Socieity. So the American Cancer Society has spoken and you can read what they say by going to the link I already provided.
“Many research studies have established the relationship between alcohol use and cancer.”

 

[Dorothy]

Everything in moderation makes a lot of sense.

When something becomes an idol in our life and gets our priorities out of order, then it would be a sin.

 

[Rebecca_New]

Katie1723:

If you like smelling like an ashtray , then I would say NO…smoking is not a sin.

          ~ Kathy ~

The last time I checked an ashtray, there was no nose, so it could not smell.

 

[frogman80]

In 1919 US started the alcohol prohibition… proponents toted it a drink that led to immorality… Doctors were quoted as saying they believed it to be a poison that inflicted diseases and untimely death.

You know what… they were partly right. Alcohol CAN lead to immorality. Alcohol can be poisonous… It can inflict diseases, and lead to death. It can even lead people to violence! But… it is not likely when used in moderation.

Today… we have a “political-moral” issues with tobacco. Be wary of distractions of this nature… when they come up there are usually bigger more import issues being glossed. When people do not study history it tends to repeat itself.

Nazi Germany banned tobacco products too… for the same reasons we see them being condemned today in the US… yes, I understand that argument doesn’t make tobacco use good by itself. But it should make you curious enough to continue reading about it.

 

[frogman80]

frogman80:

Nazi Germany banned tobacco products too.

Oops… no ban just anti-campaigns

 

[Scott_Waddell]

frogman80:

Oops… no ban just anti-campaigns

You are right. Example:

http://home.comcast.net/~scottwwaddell/naziprop.gif

Anti-smoking has been around since the begining (1600’s) with blowhards like James I and all sorts of Refer Madness absurdities like tobacco will turn you into a sexual pervert, that you can drop dead from one puff (not all that different from the arguments we are hearing now), will make you hallucinate when you try to quit, that it will make you incapable of performing sexually (wait a minute! It will make you unable AND a pervert?)

Little has changed. Like the Cato article cited, the war on smoking took a kernal of truth (that cigarettes increase risk of lung cancer) and turned it into a monster undermining government credibility and the rule of law.

Scott

 

[frogman80]

Scott Waddell:

You are right. Example:

http://home.comcast.net/~scottwwaddell/naziprop.gif

Anti-smoking has been around since the begining (1600’s) with blowhards like James I and all sorts of Refer Madness absurdities like tobacco will turn you into a sexual pervert, that you can drop dead from one puff (not all that different from the arguments we are hearing now), will make you hallucinate when you try to quit, that it will make you incapable of performing sexually (wait a minute! It will make you unable AND a pervert?)

Little has changed. Like the Cato article cited, the war on smoking took a kernal of truth (that cigarettes increase risk of lung cancer) and turned it into a monster undermining government credibility and the rule of law.

Scott

Right… you know it amazes me how our government and general society can be so concerned about the “health” of the people with anti-tobacco campaigns… but then turn around and be pro-abortion, pro-pill(contraceptive). Where are the anti-pill campaigns to save women from pill induced cancer?