Is sperm donating a sin?

[yochumjy]

@ex-mormon: Masturbation leading to ejaculation outside of the wife’s vagina is still sinful. This is one. Next, masturbation defeats the purpose of marital union. It’s a selfish act and contradicts self-giving. Autoerotic motives have no place in the celebration of a total union. I don’t know who first came up with the idea it can be licit as a kind of foreplay, but it sounds wrong. Any papal document ever confirming something like that? The Catechism doesn’t make such differentiation.

I believe ex-mormon was speaking of masturbation pre-ejaculation or for the woman before the actual act. Depending on the situation it can be done “together” to make sure that the final act is best for both man and woman. My guess would be, for the most part, the act would be on the woman, as opposed to the man, which can be to her benefit, depending on her system. I assume depending on the couple, the roles could be reversed (him having a hard time before the act {no pun intended})
That was my take.

 

[chevalier]

But people claim that it’s licit for a woman to masturbate herself into orgasm if the man doesn’t do his job, so long as there was penetration with ejaculation before. That just doesn’t sound right. I can’t fathom how one could even want to touch himself or herself like that.

 

[cove]

Just a thought for all those college students out there who think they can make a quick buck. I heard a guy on TV once say how much he regreted doing this during his college years. He had not condisdered at the time how many children could be conceived through his donations. He figures that it is possible that he has fathered well over 60 children and his fear is that they will come looking for him someday.

My recent encounter with one of these stories was a woman who inseminated herself with her gay brother’s partner’s sperm. She has given birth to two children for them. She is their real mother. Could anyone here who is a mother imagine doing such a thing. Giving away your own child in this manner (I don’t consider this the same as adoption). The story was made to look like such a wonderful and unselfish act. Yet, my feeling was that it was the most selfish act I had ever witnessed. No one seemed to considered how this will effect these two girls in the furture. As long as her brother was happy that is all that mattered. She gave birth to them and then handed them over to these two men. It just seemed cruel to me. She is their mommy. And yet, think about it, how confusing for these girls because their real mother will still be in their lives but in an Aunt roll. To me that is the where the real sin comes in.

Sperm donating is playing God with innocent human lives. It is just wrong.

 

[PiusXIII]

cove:

Just a thought for all those college students out there who think they can make a quick buck. I heard a guy on TV once say how much he regreted doing this during his college years. He had not condisdered at the time how many children could be conceived through his donations. He figures that it is possible that he has fathered well over 60 children and his fear is that they will come looking for him someday.

I would think—just as a Catholic—when it comes to judgment day, we will be judged on how well we took care of the lives we brought into this world. I would think if you brought 60 lives into this world and didn’t even know/care who they were or what kind of lives they had, you would be in for a very harsh judgment someday.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

ex-mormon:

Masturbation is a sin, except when used as a prelude to intercourse in a marital union. Is masturbation allowed in marriage?

ex-mo

OMG!

I never would have guessed the Church would allow “crank yanking” under any circumstances. :whacky:

Then I guess it really isn’t about blindness?

Alan

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

Edited quote of vulgar terms

When it is said that is is allowable as a prelude to intercourse, they mean that you…how to put this delicately???

You can start, but you can’t finish (if you are a male). The man has to finish where he is supposed to.

Now, women on the other hand are given a bit more leeway so they can as long as it takes place as a part of the marital act.

Malia

 

[sweetchuck]

there is no question that donating sperm is a sin. It’s adultery on so many levels – in the adultery a person commits in their heart when mastubrating to donate, in entering into conjugal creation with a woman not your wife who you will probably never meet. In donation, YOUR children with this woman you will never meet will not know you, their real father. Would you give your own children to couples who cannot conceive? Sounds ridiculous to ask it that way, but that’s what you do in sending your sperm out into the world. It is reckless abandonment of the duty of a parent.

Additionally, you risk becoming a co-conspirator in procuring an abortion, because frequently, with in-vitro, embryos will be fertilized and “extras” will be destroyed.

Worst of all, donating sperm and engaging in this creative human act is the assertion of humans’ finite will over God’s infinite will – the opposite of what Jesus agreed to do (“My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from me; yet, not as I will, but as you will.”) in the Garden of Gethsemane. God made some men and some women infertile.

In-vitro fertilization, sperm donation, it’s all morally reprehensible. And each day I pray its practice will end.

 

[siamesecat]

sweetchuck:

there is no question that donating sperm is a sin. It’s adultery on so many levels – in the adultery a person commits in their heart when mastubrating to donate, in entering into conjugal creation with a woman not your wife who you will probably never meet. In donation, YOUR children with this woman you will never meet will not know you, their real father. Would you give your own children to couples who cannot conceive? Sounds ridiculous to ask it that way, but that’s what you do in sending your sperm out into the world. It is reckless abandonment of the duty of a parent.

Additionally, you risk becoming a co-conspirator in procuring an abortion, because frequently, with in-vitro, embryos will be fertilized and “extras” will be destroyed.

Worst of all, donating sperm and engaging in this creative human act is the assertion of humans’ finite will over God’s infinite will – the opposite of what Jesus agreed to do (“My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from me; yet, not as I will, but as you will.”) in the Garden of Gethsemane. God made some men and some women infertile.

In-vitro fertilization, sperm donation, it’s all morally reprehensible. And each day I pray its practice will end.

So adoption is wrong? You cant give up a child to someone who wants one? And the sperm donor is the real father? What about the man who’s wife will be come pregnant. I understand the other teachings on masturbation and separating the conjugal act, but I think the giving away your children thing is out of line. You are helping another couple have a child, not abandoning parental duties

 

[AlanFromWichita]

siamesecat:

So adoption is wrong? You cant give up a child to someone who wants one? And the sperm donor is the real father? What about the man who’s wife will be come pregnant. I understand the other teachings on masturbation and separating the conjugal act, but I think the giving away your children thing is out of line. You are helping another couple have a child, not abandoning parental duties

I think once a child is conceived, it becomes a slightly different issue. Then it needs the right to life, and if adoption is how it finds a home, then praise God for those adopting.

From what y’all have said, I’m guessing there is no problem of adoption per se, but if you adopt a baby that you had specifically “made” for you as with surrogate motherhood or sperm donations then that could be a problem. It seems strange that there would be a market for these babies, when there are so many alleged “unwanted” children who are killed every day, conceived by natural sinful means and now unwanted. It’s like we want to custom order from the factory, when we are destroying all the product in the show room.

If this is right, I’m guessing it would be a very difficult issue for Catholics when one spouse turns out to be infertile, or am I just hearing the “worldly” voices say “at least the child can have been made by one of us?”

Alan

 

[sweetchuck]

siamesecat:

So adoption is wrong? You cant give up a child to someone who wants one? And the sperm donor is the real father? What about the man who’s wife will be come pregnant. I understand the other teachings on masturbation and separating the conjugal act, but I think the giving away your children thing is out of line. You are helping another couple have a child, not abandoning parental duties

you miss my point. sorry I was unclear. I find that so often when I try to explain something theologically, my human limitations cause me to fall flat on my face.

There’s nothing wrong with adoption. There’s a BIG difference between adoption and sperm donation for IVF. In adoption, you (when I say you from here on out in this post, I am referring to a hypothetical person, not the person to whom I am responding) trust that your child is going to a good family. If adoption were like sperm donation, you would bring your child in, hand her to the nurse, who would pay you some money, and you would leave. However, in adoption you will likely work through an adoption agency you trust. In sperm donation, you are sending an unknown number of your children out into the world. In adoption, you are handing over your child to an organization you trust. In sperm donation, you fill the cup and out the door you go, sending your as-yet uncreated children into lesbian homes and God knows what other situations. Do you like the chances that YOUR sons and daughters won’t be raised in immoral households by people who may view children in a materialist light – as something to be possessed? I wouldn’t send my children off into that kind of environment. You have a duty as a parent to see to it that your children are raised in an environment that will foster their spiritual development. In sperm donation, are you SURE that you are not sending your children into the 7th circle of Hell to be raised by the devil himself? You do not know. You give the cup to the nurse and sell your children off for 30 pieces of silver.

That is what’s wrong with sperm donation (in addition to all the other stuff, of course). It is false compassion defined. You think you are doing something good and noble when in reality you enter a new dimension of depravity.

 

[Ruthie]

“sending your as-yet uncreated children into lesbian homes”
I can vouch for this. I had a lesbian friend who got pregnant by artificial insemination. She had a little boy. I pray for them. She couldn’t even bring herself to put a leash on her untrained dogs to keep them out of traffic; how’s she gonna “raise a child up in the way he should go?”

There apparently was no investigation at all, just pay the bucks and get the sperm. Animal shelters do more investigating than that sperm bank did.

:banghead:

 

[sweetchuck]

“sending your as-yet uncreated children into lesbian homes”
I can vouch for this. I had a lesbian friend who got pregnant by artificial insemination. She had a little boy. I pray for them. She couldn’t even bring herself to put a leash on her untrained dogs to keep them out of traffic; how’s she gonna “raise a child up in the way he should go?”

There apparently was no investigation at all, just pay the bucks and get the sperm. Animal shelters do more investigating than that sperm bank did.

:banghead:

thanks for sharing that. People truly don’t consider where their children are going to end up when they donate sperm. Consider our “modern” and “progressive” society.

 

[siamesecat]

But there are plenty of good homes. Our close friends were infertile because of the husband’s childhood radiation treatments for hodgkins. They used a sperm donor who looked like the father, and was a doctor like him. Ive heard that med students often donate. They wanted children that were biologically the mothers, so thats why they chose it. I dont think its immoral. They are a doctor and a lawyer who are able to care for their children in a stable, supportive home.

 

[sweetchuck]

siamesecat:

I dont think its immoral.

It most definitely is. It is immoral on so many levels. You are confusing the good end with the evil means. The end does not justify the means. But that’s why God is God. God allows evil to bring a good out of it. This doesn’t mean that people should do evil. God can bring ultimate good out of people who are faithful to his will.

There are probably also a lot of things you don’t know about your friend’s situation. Did your friend end up having to abort “leftover” embryos in the IVF process?

Abraham and Sarah had this same problem. Abraham did not exhibit faith in God’s promise and used Hagar the Egyptian slave girl to have a child since Sarah was barren. Ultimately it led to pain and abandonment. God honored his promise to Abraham by giving him Isaac through Sarah.

 

[mlchance]

siamesecat:

I dont think its immoral.

Which doesn’t alter the fact that IVF is immoral. Intentions are irrelevant. The parents’ ability to support their children is irrelevant. IVF is an abuse of human sexuality. After the fact rationalizations don’t change this.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[TOME]

As I understand it, I would say that in it self, sperm donation, even if one intends to use the spem himself (example, a man has to undergo radiation treatment which will, most likely make him sterile). I see this as being immoral for several reasons, most if not all have already been mentioned.

First, just the method of IVF is immoral. I think many believe that what happens in invetro fertilization, is one sperm fertilizes one egg and the embryo is then implanted into the uterus. This does happen but not in isolation. Multiple eggs are fertilized (thus we have a Human Being - Body & Soul). Several of these human beings, in the earliest of embrionic stage are implanted knowing that the probrability of all reaching birth is very low. What happens to the other embryos that are not implanted? They are frozen and or are used for experimentation or eventually destroyed. Remember, even though these embryos are microscoptic they are Human Beings. Therefore, IVF is immoral even for married couples using the wife’s eggs and husband’s sperm.

That said, other uses of IVF simple goes agains the sanctity of marriage because the life created in marriage must come from the love of the parents expressed in the physical union of sex that is opened to the natural process of fertilization.

Conception, outside of marriage is morally wrong (but that is matter for another thread) and especially by means of IVF because of the process stated above. An unintended pregency outside of marriage carries its own culpability which I believe can be less in some cases than a pregency that is acheive knowingly and willingly either through the natural of sexual intercoarse and pregency, or through an artifical means - IVF.

 

[PiusXIII]

“sending your as-yet uncreated children into lesbian homes”
I can vouch for this. I had a lesbian friend who got pregnant by artificial insemination. She had a little boy. I pray for them. She couldn’t even bring herself to put a leash on her untrained dogs to keep them out of traffic; how’s she gonna “raise a child up in the way he should go?”

There’s the problem–she’s going to raise him up to be an immoral gay who goes around selling sperm. It’s a vicious cycle.