Is telling a "fib" a sin?

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workinprogress8

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Hello all,
I was just wondering what the Catholic church teaches on white lies or fibbing. I often find myself in situations where a fib here and there doesn’t seem to harm anyone, and makes the whole situation better. Of course I’m trying to cut down, but I was just wondering… is it a sin?
 
work(name removed by moderator)rogress8:
Hello all,
I was just wondering what the Catholic church teaches on white lies or fibbing. I often find myself in situations where a fib here and there doesn’t seem to harm anyone, and makes the whole situation better. Of course I’m trying to cut down, but I was just wondering… is it a sin?
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Yes, it is a sin. We call it a “fib” or a “white lie” to ease our conscience, but that does not change the fact that what we have said is not true. It is a venial sin, not a mortal one, but committing venial sins “softens us up” for more serious sins, so we should stop.

Wanting to make a situation better is fine - we just need to find a way to say or do something that is true. This may be difficult at the start, because many of us find it hard to think of the right thing to say on the spur of the moment. But, with practice it will get easier.
 
I know telling one lie leads to telling another, but rather than argue with someone sometimes I will tell a fib or a lie. Like if you don’t want to go to the bar because of the people that may have asked you, are not the greatest at driving drunk, or not the best thing for your life. I will sometimes say I have other plans or something like that.
 
There’s a great line in one of my favorite movies-“Meet Me In St. Louis” -that goes liked this:

“A lie’s a lie and dressin’ it in white don’t help it.”

I just love that!

Scout :tiphat:
 
What would Jesus do?

Would Jesus ever fib? even for a moment? to help out? just once?
 
A lie is a lie, as it has been said, I like to use the my what a tangled web we weave when we practice to deceive line.
 
work(name removed by moderator)rogress8:
Hello all,
I was just wondering what the Catholic church teaches on white lies or fibbing. I often find myself in situations where a fib here and there doesn’t seem to harm anyone, and makes the whole situation better. Of course I’m trying to cut down, but I was just wondering… is it a sin?
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I voted yes. A sin is a sin. However, I have told some ‘fibs’ to spare someone’s feelings… Example: If I am asked if somebody has said something bad about them… Wouldn’t it be worse if I told them the truth? :confused: Annunciata:)
 
Dear friends

Sometime’s for the good of the person it is better to tell them a truth and not lie…such as ‘hey don’t take those drugs it’ll kill you’, they may not want to hear it, but it’s a truth said for their own good. However it is sometimes necessary to withold the truth, why? well Jesus did it, how did He do it? He knew the person already knew what they were doing was a sin, for example, the woman who committed adultery and was about to be stoned, Jesus stopped the stoning, but He didn’t debate the ins and outs of her sin with her, He simply told her not to sin again. Sometimes the more love shown and the least said is the best way to illuminate the truth to someone. If this is classed as a lie then lies it is in this case.

I don’t think it is a lie, I think it is a ‘different’ approach that we would all do well to adopt and copy, rather than be fixed on expounding the truth, the showing of kindness and compassion expounds it in a way that our arguing and spouting of words can ever do.

Rather to be compassionate and love than expound the truth only to alienate, it is a fine balance and judgement call to know in each situation how to ‘softly softly catchy monkey’, brashness of truth never won a single heart! This doesn’t mean we lie, it means we withold.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa
 
A wise priest once admonished my class to “define our terms” when speaking. I feel a definition in the context here has been somewhat defined, but not entirely.

A lie is an untruth, and defined by Natural Law ethics, a Lie is information either withheld or contradicted to a person who has a right to that knowledge.

So a lie can be an omission (ie sins of omission–related topic) or a direct contradiction to the truth.

Now, a “white lie” so called is a little different. I see this as sometimes being related to tact, and this is not a sin.

Men, when your wives or girlfriends, or female family members ask you if they look fat in something…do you speak honestly? Maybe…or maybe you really don’t tell them the whole truth. You either lie directly and tell them they look fine or “fib” a bit and suggest that the pants they wore last weekend were a more flattering style. An intelligent woman would take the hint and change cloths…unless you assure her she looks fine. Then she goes out to face the world in pants that make her look like a blimp because you LIED.

At the same time, however, even if she is a bit overweight, do you call her fat? If you tell her she looks beautiful to you, then you are telling a white lie as you know full well that although you find her attractive, she is in fact, overweight.

This goes for female friends as well.

Now…as far as witholding information that someone has a right to know being a lie…this is an omission. Now, if someone asks you some personal questions and you dont’ want to answer and deny the information being sought…this is not a sin if that other party has no right to the knowledge. If however one is say…a doctor…and you don’t tell a patient that he/she has a particular illness which is treatable…because maybe you think they deserve what they got, etc…then this is a direct LIE of omission.

I “fib” on a daily basis at work and I don’t feel a bit bad about it, nor do I believe I have sinned. My job is to investigate fraud, and those parties being investigated do not have a right to the knowledge that I obtain…or at least not during the investigation. However, if their claim is denied, then morally and legally I have an obligation to provide the reasons and the information as to why.

So I did not actually answer your poll but instead submit my essay…this is an interesting discussion!
 
Funny little story. A couple of years ago, I had to take my kids to the lab, one of them needed bloodwork. It was a crappy rainy day, and it was getting late…I couldn’t wait to just get home. My son was 3, my one daughter was 2, other daughter was 1 and my other daughter was a newborn (something along those lines…they were little). Well, the lab is across the street from the mall.

My son kept begging me to go to the mall. So, I said to him “honey, the mall is closed right now…maybe another day we will go to the mall”. Don’t know why he wanted to go there, so with that he said “Well, just ask Jesus to open it up for us!!”

Taught me that I was teaching my kids right, that all things are possible with God, with Jesus, miracles happen, and never tell, even a small “white” lie.

My thoughts are a lie is a lie, regardless of what you are lying about. I have wondered about this as well, until I had this conversation with my son…
 
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all4life:
My son kept begging me to go to the mall. So, I said to him “honey, the mall is closed right now…maybe another day we will go to the mall”. Don’t know why he wanted to go there, so with that he said “Well, just ask Jesus to open it up for us!!”

Taught me that I was teaching my kids right, that all things are possible with God, with Jesus, miracles happen, and never tell, even a small “white” lie.

My thoughts are a lie is a lie, regardless of what you are lying about. I have wondered about this as well, until I had this conversation with my son…
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I’m sorry…I guess I just don’t see what the lie is here. All things ARE possible with God…this is not a lie. Your son’s expression of this teaching is his internalization of it, and the reason we are all admonished to be like these little ones. It also teaches us care to censor what we say around them as they do not have the ability to understand the abstract.

At that age all children adhere to concrete reality. Therefore what Mom teaches is true, and absolutely true. If Mom says Jesus can do anything, then little boy/girl expects any issue to be resolved that way. This is basic psychology and all children develop through degrees of this.

A “white lie” is in the category of abstract thought, which adults understand to be shades of gray in the realm of discussion.

Don’t tell white lies to children as they will not undestand…but as a parent, do you not “hedge” the truth so as to protect them? When they ask you where babies come from do you give them the gory detail or do you tell them about the birds and the bees or some variation therof? If you avoid the reality of sexual relations in a discussion with a 4 year old then you are telling a white lie. You are omitting facts for their well being as they would not be able to understand hard core truth in that case.
 
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JCPhoenix:
Don’t tell white lies to children as they will not undestand…but as a parent, do you not “hedge” the truth so as to protect them? When they ask you where babies come from do you give them the gory detail or do you tell them about the birds and the bees or some variation therof? If you avoid the reality of sexual relations in a discussion with a 4 year old then you are telling a white lie. You are omitting facts for their well being as they would not be able to understand hard core truth in that case.
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I don’t think it’s a lie to withhold adult information from children. Like the previous poster said, it is only a lie if the person from whom you are withholding the truth has a right to that knowledge. I believe that not only do small children not have a right to carnal knowledge, but that it it damaging to their sexuality.

I was listening to a tape from the Mary Foundation called “How to Raise Great Kids.” The speaker, a Catholic psychologist, talked about how in children who were sexually abused, the form of the abuse wasn’t as important as the fact that they were “sexualized” before they were ready. They were introduced to something that was not appropriate for their age.

The speaker stressed that we should never lie to our children, but give them just what they are ready for. When a child asks, “Where did I come from?” Or when mommy gets pregnant, and an older sibling asks, “How did the baby get in there?” don’t make up some lie about the cabbage patch or the stork. Tell them that Daddy put his seed in Mommy, where it joined with her egg to make a baby. When they ask how Daddy’s seed got in there, tell them that because Mommy and Daddy are married, they can love each other in a special way that allows Daddy to put his seed there. If they persist in asking how, you can give a little more detail. Just a little at a time, as they get older and are ready to learn about it, building truth upon truth, and never lying.
 
Sorry that nobody mentioned “Moral Reservation.” If someone were trying to kill your friend and he was in the next room, it is not a sin or lie to tell the potential killer that you don’t know where your friend is. In other words, as far as this killer is concerned, you don’t know.

Other cases may involve simple thigs such as courtesy. You sample some special treat that a neighbor made. You say, “Not too bad.” Actually it is “Yuk!” You are not compelled to hurt their feelings.

May God bless all. Jesus taught often enough that all is not black and white.
Deacon Tony SFO
 
That is what I was thinking of when I voted that a fib is not a sin. If my daughter is crying over a terrible haircut saying, “Oh I look terrible don’t I??” I would never agree with her, even if she did. I would say something like, “Oh, you are so pretty… you could never look terrible!” Which… now that I think about it… is actually true. 🙂
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Deacon Tony and Carol, wonderful posts.

In my previous post, I knew the mall was open, but due to the weather, being in the lab for a couple of hours with 4 kids, and it being late in the afternoon, I told my son it was closed.

Total opposites there. He did ask me questions about where the baby came from and how she got in my tummy right after she was born. He was four at the time (the baby is almost a year old). I used Dr. Bob’s advise (How to Raise Great Kids…love that talk) on answering his questions. I told him a small truth…babies come from God. How did the baby get into your tummy, God let daddy plant a seed in my tummy and that seed grew into a baby…But HOW did the baby get in your tummy…because mommy and daddy are married, and love each other very much, God let daddy put the seed in mommy’s tummy and that seed grew into a baby…you get the idea. One truth led to another, led to another.

I know that the above is off topic, but it is important to tell our kids the truth. Of course, in Carol’s example, I would tell my child the same thing as in her example.
 
work(name removed by moderator)rogress8:
Hello all,
I was just wondering what the Catholic church teaches on white lies or fibbing. I often find myself in situations where a fib here and there doesn’t seem to harm anyone, and makes the whole situation better. Of course I’m trying to cut down, but I was just wondering… is it a sin?
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1. The guilt incurred by a sin varies according a lot of things - moral consciousness, moral insight, opportunities to inform one’s moral character, temperament, temptations, and so on -​

BUT
  1. Some acts are always wrong: and lying is one of them. And that includes “white lies”.
A doctor who tells a white lie to spare a patient who has a heart problem and could die of a sudden shock, is in a different moral position from a priest who coomits a crime and tries to conceal it. And a child without moral education is in a different position again.

Examples of difference like that are not very good - they are rather static; but, they do make the important point that we are all individuals - so our moral awareness will be very different in many ways. That’s why advice in Confession that may be just what one person needs, won’t be suitable to a different person’s needs.

So, there are differences in people’s moral “furniture”; but, equally, we are obliged to follow our consciences; if they hint that fibbing is wrong, and we fib nonetheless, we have done what is objectively sinful, and, subjectively sinful too. If we know that fibbing is wrong, and do it, that is even worse.

Because when we sin, we distort our consciences - they become like poorly functioning radio antennae; they cease to be as sensitive as they should be. And that makes moral sensitivity harder in the future. “Following conscience” is always obligatory - and doing so, is definitely not another way of “doing what one wants to do”;because what we want, is not always morally good - and our moral make-up is there to help us to be morally good; our moral sense is a very great gift. It’s one of several, all given to help us to to become more like Christ. ##
 
This is a very interesting thread. I tend to go with the folks who feel that a fib is not a mortal sin, mainly because fibs are usually told to spare the feelings of others. Perhaps they are venial sins, but again, I tend to think that fibs are often necessary in getting along with others in close quarters. I’m not sure if I’ve ever met a person who doesn’t fib from time to time!
 
I’d voted the ‘depends on the situation’ because honestly, the line between moral reservation and fibbing seems very thin at times.
 
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