Is the Eucharist A Sacrifice or a Commemoration?

[Vince1022]

THE WORLD’S TOUGHEST CATHOLIC QUIZ
By KARL KEATING

Some call it “the pop quiz from hell.” Others call it things we can’t print in a family magazine.

You are about to find out if you know as much about your faith as you claim to know. Take it from me: Your ego will suffer. But don’t fall into despair. Most Catholics (some priests included, alas) will answer most of these questions incorrectly.

15. At the Crucifixion

a. Jesus’ human nature died on the cross.

b. Only the human person of Jesus, not the divine person of Jesus, died on the cross.

c. God died on the cross.

d. Jesus’ human and divine natures both died on the cross, but the universe was kept going by the Father and the Holy Spirit until Jesus’ Resurrection.

e. None of the above.

Question 15

a. Wrong, because natures aren’t put to death–persons are. When you die, it is not your human nature which dies, but you as a distinct person.

b. Wrong, because there is no human person in Jesus. There is only one Person, the divine, who already (by definition) had a divine nature and who took on a human nature.

c. Correct, because the Person who died on the cross was a divine Person, commonly called the Son of God. Since that Person is God, it is proper to say God died on the cross, even though that sounds odd and may make some unthinking people conclude that it means that God ceased to exists, which, of course, was not the case. (If you were sure this answer could not be right, don’t fret–you’re in good company. Most people miss this question because the correct answer “just doesn’t sound right.”)

d. Wrong, first because natures don’t die, persons do, and second because the answer suggest Jesus couldn’t keep the universe going, as though he ceased to be God between the time of his death and his Resurrection.

e. Wrong, because 15c is correct.

Are you saying you agree that God did not die, or that God did die?

If you are contending that God died, please provide some Catholic teaching to support such.

Thanks.

 

[JimG]

As the Karl Keating quiz makes clear, the answer is “C—God died on the cross.” How can that be?

First off, death, for all of us, is the violent separation of body and soul—that is, the human soul is separated from the human body.

And Jesus had a human body and a human soul. So he could, and did, die.
But he was also God. The Person whose human body and soul Jesus possessed, was not a human person but a divine Person—the Second Person of the Holy Trinity.

God could die on the cross because of the Incarnation–the Second Person of the Trinity assuming a human nature, with a human body and soul. But he was and is, one person, not two. And the Person is Divine.

That doesn’t mean that God ceased to exist. God is eternal, and the Son possesses the fullness of the divine nature.

It may be confusing. But remember that in a similar way we can call Mary, “Mother of God,” even though God created her, because the Person she bore in her womb was God.

 

[Vince1022]

The Person whose human body and soul Jesus possessed, was not a human person but a divine Person—the Second Person of the Holy Trinity.

The Catholic faith teaches that Jesus Christ was both fully human and fully divine. Not a human body that the soul Jesus possessed.

God could die on the cross because of the Incarnation–the Second Person of the Trinity assuming a human nature, with a human body and soul. But he was and is, one person, not two. And the Person is Divine.

So, God died? Again, where does the Catholic Church teach such?

 

[ryanoneil]

We must conclude that it is a sacrifice that occurs over and over again and since it is said to be a true and proper sacrifice that is propitiatory, then logically it must be a re-sacrifice of Christ.

If it is not, then how can it be called a sacrifice of Christ?

Also, how could it be propitiatory if it is not a sacrifice of Christ since it is Christ’s offering on the cross that is itself propitiatory?

Is our sun re-ignited everytime it’s rays crest the horizon each morning. No! The sun is re-presented to us. We simply participate in what is already there; Christ’s once for all sacrifice.

** The cup of blessing that we bless, is it not a participation in the blood of Christ? The bread that we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ? (1 Cor 10:16) **

 

[JimG]

The Catholic faith teaches that Jesus Christ was both fully human and fully divine. Not a human body that the soul Jesus possessed.

Yes, and it’s only because Jesus was fully human that he could die–in the same way we do, our body and soul ripped apart.

So, God died? Again, where does the Catholic Church teach such?

Jesus died. And Jesus is God, the Second Person of the Trinity.

 

[Vince1022]

Y
Jesus died. And Jesus is God, the Second Person of the Trinity.

That logic doesn’t hold, though, when discussing the mystery of God.

Jesus was born at a certain time and place. Jesus is God, the Second Person of the Trinity.

That does not mean, simply, that God was born at a certain time and place. As our fatih teaches us, God is eternal, without beginning or end.

 

[JimG]

That logic doesn’t hold, though, when discussing the mystery of God.

Jesus was born at a certain time and place. Jesus is God, the Second Person of the Trinity.

That does not mean, simply, that God was born at a certain time and place. As our fatih teaches us, God is eternal, without beginning or end.

Yes, God is eternal, without beginning or end. And human beings die. Jesus is both human and divine in nature, one divine person.

Persons die, not natures. And the Person who died on Good Friday, was the Second Person of the Trinity. To die does not mean to cease to exist, either for us or for Jesus.

 

[Vince1022]

Yes, God is eternal, without beginning or end. And human beings die. Jesus is both human and divine in nature, one divine person.

One person, with both human and divine natures. Not simply one divine person.

 

[davidv]

One person, with both human and divine natures. Not simply one divine person.

But He is simply one person. Not two persons merged together. Not two partial persons put together. Simply one person, irrespective of having two natures. That we cannot rap our minds around this fact is due to the Incarnation being a core mystery of Church. We can partially explain it. We can partially understand it, but not completely.

 

[Vince1022]

But He is simply one person. Not two persons merged together. Not two partial persons put together. Simply one person, irrespective of having two natures. That we cannot rap our minds around this fact is due to the Incarnation being a core mystery of Church. We can partially explain it. We can partially understand it, but not completely.

Right.

 

[ryanoneil]

I have heard it said both ways that 1. Communion at Mass is a sacrifice, or 2, That it commemorates the sacrifice that was done once and for all by Jesus, that it can never be re-done by us or by anyone else.
I am still confused as to what the official Catholic Church view on this is.
It would seem to me that Jesus Christ’s one-time sacrifice cannot be done over and over again except in a commemoration of that one event, where He gave His life so that you and I may live.
I’m not talking specifically about transubstantiation here, just the “sacrifice” aspect of the communion and the Mass.

Then he took the bread, said the blessing, broke it, and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body, which will be given for you; do this in memory of me.” (Lk 22:19)

The translation of Jesus’ words is “touto poieite tan eman anamnasin.” Jesus literally said “offer this as my memorial sacrifice.” The word “poiein” (do) refers to offering a sacrifice (see, e.g., Exodus 29:38-39, where God uses the same word – poieseis – regarding the sacrifice of the lambs on the altar). The word “anamnesis” (remembrance) also refers to a sacrifice which is really or actually made present in time by the power of God, as it reminds God of the actual event (see, e.g., Heb. 10:3; Num. 10:10). It is not just a memorial of a past event, but a past event made present in time.

Luke did not use the word “mnemosunon” (which is the word used to describe a nonsacrificial memorial. See, for example, Matt. 26:13; Mark 14:9; and especially Acts 10:4). So there are two memorials, one sacrificial (which Jesus instituted), and one non-sacrificial.

 

[steve_b]

If He is not re-sacrificed at each Mass, then how is it a “sacrifice” at all?

Because Jesus is God, His sacrifice is eternal. There is no past present or future with God, it’s the eternal present. He is outside of time, we are IN time. Therefore, when we celebrate the sacrifice today, that took place 2000 years ago, Jesus sacrifice that took place 2000 yrs ago, is actually eternally present to the Father.

Heb 10:
23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful; 24 and let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, 25 not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near. 26 For if we sin deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27* but a fearful prospect of judgment, and a fury of fire which will consume the adversaries. 28* A man who has violated the law of Moses dies without mercy at the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29* How much worse punishment do you think will be deserved by the man who has spurned the Son of God, and profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and outraged the Spirit of grace?

Notice the points being made?

• Don’t waver off this instruction which is about to be given
• Don’t miss mass on Sunday. That’s already a law and they are being reminded not to break it.
• Deliberately missing mass is wrong why? A person misses the sacrifice for sin, and blood of the covenant. What are those terms refering to? The Eucharist.* **Matthew 26:28 *This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus said those words while instituting the Eucharist which we celebrate everytime we meet. Jesus further describes what the Eucharist means for the soul.Jn 6:53 unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. IOW, the Eucharist is THE sacrifice made eternally present to us everytime we celebrate mass.
• Those who blow off mass on purpose spurn the son of God and profane the blood of the covenant and they outrage the spirit of grace. WOW!!!
• To rephrase your question, How does one profane the once and for all sacrifice today by failing to meet for the Eucharist? If the sacrifice was done and over with 2000 years ago why are we profaning blood of the covenant by failing to go to the Eucharist on Sunday?
• The answer is, the Eucharist is Jesus once and for all sacrifice represented to the Father in the Eucharist, in real time, each and every time it is celebrated at mass. And we consume the body blood soul and divinity of Jesus everytime we consume the Eucharist.