Is the KJB banned?

[patrick457]

So why isn’t Jacob son of Isaac not called James son of Isaac, its a bluff, King James deliberately used his own name, Jacob and James are utter different.

From John Wycliff’s 1380s translation of the Bible (Exodus 3:5-6; Matthew 4:21):

And he, Ne come thow, he seith, no nerre hidur, but lowse thow thi shoyng fro thi feyt; the place forsothe that thow stondist yn is an holi loond. And he seith, Y am the God of thi fader, God of Abraham, and God of Ysaac, and God of Iacob. Moises hidde his face, forsothe he dorst not loke agens God.

=====

And he yede forth fro that place, and saie tweyne othere britheren, Iames of Zebede, and Ioon, his brother, in a schip with Zebede, her fadir, amendynge her nettis, and he clepide hem.
As you can see, the convention of using ‘James’ for the NT personages with the name Yaqob/Iakobos existed long before the Authorized Version, going way back to one of the earliest English translations. (And yes, I know that that’s James of Zebedee rather than James the Just, ‘brother of the Lord’)

Still not convinced?

Tyndale (1525): And he went forthe from thence / and sawe other twoo brethren / Iames the sonne of zebede / and Ihon his brother / in the shippe with zebede their father / mendynge their nettes / & called them.

Coverdale (1535): And whan he went forth from thence, he sawe other two brethren, Iames the sonne of zebede, and Ihon his brother, in the ship with zebede their father, mendynge their nettes, and called them.

Great Bible (1539): And when he was gone forth from thence, he sawe other two brethren, Iames the sonne of Zebede, & Iohn his brother, in the shyp [wt] Zebede their father, mending their nettes, & he called them.

Thomas Matthew (1537): And he went forth from thence, and sawe other two brethren, Iames the sonne of Zebede, and Ihon his brother, in the shippe wyth Zebede their father, mending their nets, and called them.

Bishop’s Bible (1568): And when he was gone foorth from thence, he sawe other two brethren, Iames, the sonne of Zebedee, & Iohn his brother, in the shippe with Zebedee their father, mendyng their nettes, and he called them.

Rheims New Testament (1582): And going forvvard from thence, he savv other tvvo brethren, Iames of Zebedee & Iohn his brother in a shippe vvith Zebedee their father, repayring their nettes: and he called them.

Geneva Bible (1560): And when he was gone forth from thence, he saw other two brethren, Iames the sonne of Zebedeus, and Iohn his brother in a ship [wt] Zebedeus their father, mending their nets, & he called them.

Authorized Version, aka King James Version (1611): And when he was gone foorth from thence, he sawe other two brethren, Iames, the sonne of Zebedee, & Iohn his brother, in the shippe with Zebedee their father, mendyng their nettes, and he called them.

Antichrist

1 John 2:22 KJV
Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denieth the Father and the Son.

should be

1 John 2:22 Personal Translation
Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is against Christ who denieth the Father and the Son.

1 John 2:18 KJV
Little children, it is the last time. And as ye have heard that Antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists, whereby we know that this is the last time

1 John 2:18 Personal Translation, more precise
Little children, it is the last time. And as ye have heard those Against the Christ shall come, even now are there many Against Christ , whereby we know that this is the last time

–Correct Translation crushed the antichrist

Not exactly. I mean it still means the same thing (anti- + christos), you just rendered it differently. Preserving ho antichristos as ‘Antichrist’ is another translation convention.

 

[patrick457]

Lucifer
Isaiah 14:12 KJV - How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How art thou cut down to the ground, who didst weaken the nations!

Lucifer is a Roman Goddess, no reason to appear in there

While in the literal sense the passage talks about the king of Babylon, since the early Fathers the passage is also applied in an accomodated sense as a reference to Satan. The Hebrew form is Helel ben-Shachar ‘Day-star son of Dawn’. Helel is the term for the day-star, the morning star (i.e. Venus), so in the Greek Septuagint and the Latin Vulgate the term is rendered with the respective Greek and Latin terms for it: Phosphoros / Lucifer ‘light-bringer’. It is under the influence of early Christian typology that the translators of the Authorized Version chose to render it in a proper name-ish fashion.

Jude = Judas
Joses = Joseph

Some Greek manuscripts do spell the name as Ioses (variant of Ioseph) so ‘Joses’ is not totally wrong.

 

[Miriam1947]

They’re easy to find. Just look for “1611 KJV”. It’s available at Barnes&Boble, Amazon, etc.

Thanks, I never thought to look on Amazon.

amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=1611+KJV&x=16&y=18

 

[rotlex]

I wish you lots of luck finding one with the Deuterocanon. In fact, if you know of a source I wish you would pm me with it. None of the major publishers of the KJV include it any more.

Here you go. A number of editions with the Apocrypha. My favorite being the Cameo.

cambridgebibles.com/ME2/Audiences/dirmod.asp?sid=0477683E4046471488BD7BAC8DCFB004&nm=&type=PubCom&mod=PubComProductCatalog&mid=BF1316AF9E334B7BA1C33CB61CF48A4E&AudId=116B299113AB4B03B40CDA7EB43417EC&tier=2&TierId=2730F71F8806468BB1BBFEA86BC711BC

Personally, I love the KJV. It is my favorite daily reading translation. I prefer it over the DR as it has the more common names of people, books and Psalm numberings. I also think it reads far better, and frankly, anything that even MIGHT be questionable, I am already aware of from having read through all the Catholic approved translations previously.

Besides, you can’t help but love a Bible of the quality from Cambridge or Allen. There are no Catholic publishers that even come close!

 

[Suetonius]

Not exactly. I mean it still means the same thing (anti- + christos

), you just rendered it differently. Preserving ho antichristos as ‘Antichrist’ is another translation convention.

antichrist should not be “One Word”, “Anti” is Greek, and since it appear as ANTIChrist, its a mistranslation, because they dont “Translate” “Anti” into English, it translates as “Against”, henceforth “Against Christ” or “Against the Christ” and not “Antichrist”.

James
The Translations all follow suit’ with KJV and they convinced that Jacobus is James, why dont they correct the New Testement and use the proper name “Jacob”, remember, New Testement was written in Greek and Aramiac, not Latin. The Tongue of Titus Josephus.

 

[x1980x]

I wish you lots of luck finding one with the Deuterocanon. In fact, if you know of a source I wish you would pm me with it. None of the major publishers of the KJV include it any more.

I bought one off the shelf from Family Christian Stores (huge Evangelical chain of bookstores in the US). No problem at all.

I’ll see if I can find one online.

 

[Jerusha]

Not true. The KJV DOES have the Deuterocanon (and puts it under the section called “Apocrypha”). The issue is that most PRINTINGS of the KJV omit it, but the true, full KJV DOES have all those books, plus 1 and 2 Esdras.

The King James used by most Protestants does not have the Deuterocanon. I have used the KJV “Apocrypha” for my research, so I know it exists. But they still call those books “Apocrypha,” therefore non-canonical.

However, perhaps I ought to mellow out on my attitude that Protestants don’t have “access” to those books.

 

[Julia_Mae]

They’re easy to find. Just look for “1611 KJV”. It’s available at Barnes&Boble, Amazon, etc.

Here’s one now:

amazon.com/Bible-Authorized-Version-Oxford-Classics/dp/0199535949

 

[patrick457]

antichrist should not be “One Word”, “Anti” is Greek, and since it appear as ANTIChrist, its a mistranslation, because they dont “Translate” “Anti” into English, it translates as “Against”, henceforth “Against Christ” or “Against the Christ” and not “Antichrist”.

The Greek prefix αντί- could mean “against” / “opposite of” / “in place of". The word ἀντίχριστος is transliterated as it is: antichrist. It’s not so much a ‘mistranslation’ but a carryover.

James
The Translations all follow suit’ with KJV and they convinced that Jacobus is James, why dont they correct the New Testement and use the proper name “Jacob”, remember, New Testement was written in Greek and Aramiac, not Latin. The Tongue of Titus Josephus.

Upside-down it is, man, upside-down. The earlier translations influenced the AV.

While I too would find it interesting if Ιάκωβος is rendered straight as ‘Jacob’, the idea of rendering the OT and NT versions of the name is a deeply-ingrained tradition, and not just in English. For instance, in Spanish, Portuguese and Galician, the patriarch is called Jacob/Jacó/Xacobe respectively but the NT characters are called Santiago (from Sant ‘Saint’ + Iago from Latin Iacobus). In French, you have Jacob for the OT and Jacques for the NT. So in Italian: Giacobbe - Giacomo. The German forms are not too different from one another: Jakob - Jakobus. Breton has Jacob - Jakez. Catalan has Jacob - Jaume. Occitan has Jacòb - Jacme. You get the drift. (That is not to say that languages where the names are similar do not exist: you have Dutch, Danish, Swedish and Norse for instance.)

 

[Zenas]

They’re easy to find. Just look for “1611 KJV”. It’s available at Barnes&Boble, Amazon, etc.

Have you ever looked at a 1611 King James Bible? It’s barely recognizable as being in English.

 

[patrick457]

Have you ever looked at a 1611 King James Bible? It’s barely recognizable as being in English.

Here you go.

 

[Zenkai]

Have you ever looked at a 1611 King James Bible? It’s barely recognizable as being in English.

Haha, yeah, they are quite confusing. But that was just an example of how easy they are to find with the Deuterocanonical books,