Is the Old Covenant still in effect?

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CCC 121 says, “…the Old Covenant has never been revoked.” This causes me to raise the following question: is the morality of the Old Covenant (everything from kosher dietary laws to killing of the Amalekites) still in effect for anybody, Jew or Gentile?
 
Absolutely not still in effect. The Ten commandments, yes, as Jesus allowed.

But if you read the account of the Council of Jerusalem in Acts you will see that the Church early on was breaking with many of the minor provisions of the Covenant with Moses. Jesus provided for this when he told the apostles that whatever they pronounced on earth would be pronounced in heaven.
 
Justin Martyr (100 - 165 AD), Dialogue with Trypho, Chapter 11:
“There will be no other God, O Trypho, nor was there from eternity any other existing” (I thus addressed him), "but He who made and disposed all this universe. Nor do we think that there is one God for us, another for you, but that He alone is God who led your fathers out from Egypt with a strong hand and a high arm.
Nor have we trusted in any other (for there is no other), but in Him in whom you also have trusted, the God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob. But we do not trust through Moses or through the law; for then we would do the same as yourselves.
But now–(for I have read that there shall be a final law, and a covenant, the chiefest of all, which it is now incumbent on all men to observe, as many as are seeking after the inheritance of God. For the law promulgated on Horeb is now old, and belongs to yourselves alone; but this is for all universally. Now, law placed against law has abrogated that which is before it, and a covenant which comes after in like manner has put an end to the previous one; and an eternal and final law–namely, Christ–has been given to us, and the covenant is trustworthy, after which there shall be no law, no commandment, no ordinance. Have you not read this which Isaiah says: ‘Hearken unto Me, hearken unto Me, my people; and, ye kings, give ear unto Me: for a law shall go forth from Me, and My judgment shall be for a light to the nations. My righteousness approaches swiftly, and My salvation shall go forth, and nations shall trust in Mine arm?’ And by Jeremiah, concerning this same new covenant, He thus speaks: ‘Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah; not according to the covenant which I made with their fathers, in the day that I took them by the hand, to bring them out of the land of Egypt’).
If, therefore, God proclaimed a new covenant which was to be instituted, and this for a light of the nations, we see and are persuaded that men approach God, leaving their idols and other unrighteousness, through the name of Him who was crucified, Jesus Christ, and abide by their confession even unto death, and maintain piety.
Moreover, by the works and by the attendant miracles, it is possible for all to understand that He is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God.
For the true spiritual Israel, and descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ, as shall be demonstrated while we proceed.
 
CCC 121 says, “…the Old Covenant has never been revoked.” This causes me to raise the following question: is the morality of the Old Covenant (everything from kosher dietary laws to killing of the Amalekites) still in effect for anybody, Jew or Gentile?
It was made obsolete by a new and better covenant but never revoked, dismissed, abolished, or otherwise done away with. The law must still be fulfilled but fulfilled by hearts that have been changed, first of all, as per Jer 31 & Ez 36, fulfilled by hearts that have been molded by the divine Potter into hearts that love, love being that virtue which fulfills the Law-but the* right* way. This begins with faith as a response to grace,which restores communion with God and man so He may do His work of justification/salvation in us.
 
Justin Martyr (100 - 165 AD), Dialogue with Trypho, Chapter 11:
The interpretation of the New Covenant according to Jewish teaching is that of a “Renewed Covenant” that will be instituted at the end of days during the Messianic age, when all peoples shall of their own free will worship the G-d of Abraham (that is, no forced conversion to Judaism) and peace among the nations will reign. G-d has proclaimed time after time in the Hebrew Bible that the Covenant He gave to the Jewish people via Moses is an Eternal Covenant, never to be changed or replaced by another.
 
In the OT, the covenant is always being upgraded as it is being renewed. That is, as Scott Hahn has put it, that the covenants were respectively:
1-a marriage covenant (Adam and Eve)
2- a family covenant (Noah)
3- a tribal covenant (Abraham)
4-a nation covenant (Isreal/Jacob)
5-a kingdom covenant (David)

Each covenant is “New”, yet still the same covenant…still the same plan for our salvation.

It is said (can’t remember by whom) that the new covenant is concealed in the old, while the old covenent is revealed in the new.

The Jewish people still follow the dictates of the old covenent. It is still valid, but (for them) not yet fulfilled.
 
In the OT, the covenant is always being upgraded as it is being renewed. That is, as Scott Hahn has put it, that the covenants were respectively:
1-a marriage covenant (Adam and Eve)
2- a family covenant (Noah)
3- a tribal covenant (Abraham)
4-a nation covenant (Isreal/Jacob)
5-a kingdom covenant (David)

Each covenant is “New”, yet still the same covenant…still the same plan for our salvation.

It is said (can’t remember by whom) that the new covenant is concealed in the old, while the old covenent is revealed in the new.

The Jewish people still follow the dictates of the old covenent. It is still valid, but (for them) not yet fulfilled.
Judaism believes that G-d too follows the dictates of the Covenants He has established as in a partnership: that is, G-d is bound by His Covenant. This is why Abraham, even before the Mosaic Covenant (Torah) was established, has enough chutzpah to challenge G-d for being unjust in seeking to destroy Sodom and why Abraham fails the test by NOT disobeying G-d when He tells him to slay his son. G-d limits Himself according to this covenantal partnership with humanity by promising not to destroy the earth again with another flood and by not destroying Adam and Eve after they committed the sin of disobedience.
 
Judaism believes that G-d too follows the dictates of the Covenants He has established as in a partnership: that is, G-d is bound by His Covenant. This is why Abraham, even before the Mosaic Covenant (Torah) was established, has enough chutzpah to challenge G-d for being unjust in seeking to destroy Sodom and why Abraham fails the test by NOT disobeying G-d when He tells him to slay his son. G-d limits Himself according to this covenantal partnership with humanity by promising not to destroy the earth again with another flood and by not destroying Adam and Eve after they committed the sin of disobedience.
That’s correct. And He is ALWAYS FAITHFUL to them. One covenent does not override another, or replace another. But each covenent brings the previous one to a more perfect fulfillment.
 
The interpretation of the New Covenant according to Jewish teaching is that of a “Renewed Covenant” that will be instituted at the end of days during the Messianic age, when all peoples shall of their own free will worship the G-d of Abraham (that is, no forced conversion to Judaism) and peace among the nations will reign. G-d has proclaimed time after time in the Hebrew Bible that the Covenant He gave to the Jewish people via Moses is an Eternal Covenant, never to be changed or replaced by another.
👍
 
The interpretation of the New Covenant according to Jewish teaching is that of a “Renewed Covenant” that will be instituted at the end of days during the Messianic age, when all peoples shall of their own free will worship the G-d of Abraham (that is, no forced conversion to Judaism) and peace among the nations will reign. G-d has proclaimed time after time in the Hebrew Bible that the Covenant He gave to the Jewish people via Moses is an Eternal Covenant, never to be changed or replaced by another.
Just wondering about that.

Is this covenant with Moses a covenant that Jesus fulfilled? Apparently not, according to Jews. But according to Jesus that old covenant has been transcended by a new teaching (not abolished but transcended or continued with modifications) and designed for** all **nations, not just the Jews. God in that sense is offering not just the Jews, but the entire world his mercy and his justice through the atonement of Jesus for all sins committed by all nations, but especially for the sin of Adam and Eve.
 
Hope this helps!

The Jewish People and their Sacred Scriptures in the Christian Bible
INTRODUCTION BY CARDINAL WALTER KASPER
Jerusalem, 31 October 2007

(p. 5-6) Instead of speaking of replacement the Second Vatican Council states in accordance with Saint Paul that the covenant with the Jewish people is unbroken (cf. Rom 11:29)….“Israel continues to be in a covenant relationship with God, because the covenant-promise is definitive and cannot be abolished” (n.42)…

…“The definitive fulfillment will be at the end with the resurrection of the dead, a new heaven and a new earth. (n. 21).

THE PONTIFICAL BIBLICAL COMMISSION
THE JEWISH PEOPLE AND THEIR SACRED SCRIPTURES IN THE CHRISTIAN BIBLE

II:B:5a (I don’t know how to cite this. I hope you can figure this out! 😊 )

(From Part 38) 128 …David and his house from now on enjoy the favour of God who commits himself by oath to an “eternal covenant”…130 Being an unconditional promise, the covenant with the house of David cannot be broken (Ps 89:29-38). **If David’s successor sins, God will punish him like a father punishes his sons, but he will not withdraw his favour **(2 S 7:14-15)…

(From Part 42) The conclusion which flows from all these texts is that the early Christians were conscious of being in profound continuity with the covenant plan manifested and realized by the God of Israel in the Old Testament. Israel continues to be in a covenant relationship with God, because the covenant-promise is definitive and cannot be abolished. But the early Christians were also conscious of living in a new phase of that plan, announced by the prophets and inaugurated by the blood of Jesus, “blood of the covenant”, because it was shed out of love (cf. Rv 1:5(b)-6).
 
Just wondering about that.

Is this covenant with Moses a covenant that Jesus fulfilled? Apparently not, according to Jews. But according to Jesus that old covenant has been transcended by a new teaching (not abolished but transcended or continued with modifications) and designed for** all **nations, not just the Jews. God in that sense is offering not just the Jews, but the entire world his mercy and his justice through the atonement of Jesus for all sins committed by all nations, but especially for the sin of Adam and Eve.
Here’s the thing: Judaism does not believe that the Covenant has to be fulfilled by the Messiah or anyone else. The Covenant is the Law, a partnership between humanity and G-d, which is to be maintained even during the Messianic era. Actually, it is to be practiced with even more devotion at that time. The job of the Messiah, according to Judaism, is not to save the Jewish people and the rest of humanity from their sins as in the Christian sense so that they may go to heaven, since there is nothing to be saved from. (The Hebrew word “Moshiach” most definitely does not mean Savior.) The sins one commits can be atoned for by means of prayer if directly against G-d and by means of making amends toward one’s neighbors if committed against them. And at the end of days, all nations will be redeemed by their worship of G-d and thus live together in peace. In the meantime, before the Messiah comes, the Jews have the responsibility of acting as a priestly people who carry the Word of G-d to the other nations by their example, and so do the Christians, who have already successfully spread the morality taught by Jesus and contained in the Torah throughout the earth.
 
Here’s the thing: Judaism does not believe that the Covenant has to be fulfilled by the Messiah or anyone else. The Covenant is the Law, a partnership between humanity and G-d, which is to be maintained even during the Messianic era. Actually, it is to be practiced with even more devotion at that time. The job of the Messiah, according to Judaism, is not to save the Jewish people and the rest of humanity from their sins as in the Christian sense so that they may go to heaven, since there is nothing to be saved from. (The Hebrew word “Moshiach” most definitely does not mean Savior.) The sins one commits can be atoned for by means of prayer if directly against G-d and by means of making amends toward one’s neighbors if committed against them. And at the end of days, all nations will be redeemed by their worship of G-d and thus live together in peace. In the meantime, before the Messiah comes, the Jews have the responsibility of acting as a priestly people who carry the Word of G-d to the other nations by their example, and so do the Christians, who have already successfully spread the morality taught by Jesus and contained in the Torah throughout the earth.
The New Testament addresses the salvation of all souls throughout the Earth. And so the Covenant between God and the Jews is certainly valid, but it is specifically between God and the Jews. I’m not aware of any mandate under that covenant to “Go forth and **baptize all nations **in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.” The Jews apostles (all of whom were Jews) clearly broke ground with this New Gospel, and the Jews were not at all pleased about that seeking the persecution of the Christians initially through Paul and others.
 
“But our High Priest [Jesus Christ] has been given a ministry that is far superior to the ministry of those who serve under the old laws, for he is the one who guarantees for us a better covenant with God, based on better promises. If the first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no need for a second covenant to replace it. But God himself found fault with the old one when he said: “The day will come, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and Judah…” (Heb. 8:6)
 
“But our High Priest [Jesus Christ] has been given a ministry that is far superior to the ministry of those who serve under the old laws, for he is the one who guarantees for us a better covenant with God, based on better promises. If the first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no need for a second covenant to replace it. But God himself found fault with the old one when he said: “The day will come, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and Judah…” (Heb. 8:6)
Are you saying that G-d made a mistake by giving the Jews the Old Covenant, even after He had said several times in the Hebrew Bible that the Old Covenant is eternal? That would be an odd interpretation, in my view.
 
Are you saying that G-d made a mistake by giving the Jews the Old Covenant, even after He had said several times in the Hebrew Bible that the Old Covenant is eternal? That would be an odd interpretation, in my view.
No, God never makes mistakes. The Old Testament Covenant with the Jews has simply been amended and offered anew to the whole world. 👍

John 13:33

“Little children, I am with you a little while longer. You will seek Me; and as I said to the Jews, now I also say to you, ‘Where I am going, you cannot come.’ A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”
 
I think of it this way:

The Constitution of the United States is a permanent contract or covenant between all the people of this land. However, any contract can be improved upon by amendment, as there are Amendments to the Constitution that improve the Constitution, yet not resulting in the death of the old Constitution and the creation of a new one.

In that sense, it seems, there is a continuum between the Old Testament and the New Testament.
 
No, God never makes mistakes. The Old Testament Covenant with the Jews has simply been amended and offered anew to the whole world."
I think “amended” is perhaps the wrong term. Nothing has been added to the covenant. Rather, it has transcended the old through the perfect sacrifice of G-d Himself.
 
The sins one commits can be atoned for by means of prayer if directly against G-d and by means of making amends toward one’s neighbors if committed against them.
I’m sure that that is true for Jewish people now. But before the temple was destroyed, sins were atoned for by sacrifice on the Day of Atonement. And I think (???) that the Paschal Sacrifice also atoned for sin.
 
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