Is The Sat. Vigil Mass Just Convenience To You?

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You need to move to be near our parish.
This is our Mass schedule:
4:30 pm Saturday Vigil Mass

Sunday Mass Schedule
7:30 AM
9:30 AM
11:30 AM
1:30 PM
6:30 PM
8:30 PM (our pastor calls this “the last chance Mass”)😃

We majority of the time we attend the 8:30 pm Mass. We like to spend a relaxing Sunday (it is the day of rest) and end the day with Holy Mass. And yes this is the most convenient.

To **anniemart **I would humbly suggest you not concern yourself with judging other peoples motives, or placing value judgements on when others choose to attend. The church allows the faithful to attend either the Sat. Vigil or on Sunday. It makes no value judgements on the superiority of one day over another. Please consider that this attitude comes across as as being “more Catholic than the Pope”.
is your level of comfort disturbed? well, if so, then that is for you to deal with…I said from the beginning that I wasn’t judging anyone but yes, yes, yes…people will take advantage of the Saturday Vigil for selfish reasons and if you don’t want to accept this then so be it…did you not read John Hiner’s posting or the apostolic letter provided by Bibbit? Does JPII’s words of the heart mean nothing to you other than it is YOUR OPTION? I tried to explain myself and I didn’t have to…I tried to carry on CHRISTIAN rapport but that went out the window with puzzleannie’s response as the cherry on top…your response does not suprise me in the least…those rose colored glasses are welded on…

one more thing…I do pray for humility every night…do you?
 
is your level of comfort disturbed? well, if so, then that is for you to deal with…I said from the beginning that I wasn’t judging anyone but yes, yes, yes…people will take advantage of the Saturday Vigil for selfish reasons and if you don’t want to accept this then so be it…did you not read John Hiner’s posting or the apostolic letter provided by Bibbit? Does JPII’s words of the heart mean nothing to you other than it is YOUR OPTION? I tried to explain myself and I didn’t have to…I tried to carry on CHRISTIAN rapport but that went out the window with puzzleannie’s response as the cherry on top…your response does not suprise me in the least…those rose colored glasses are welded on…

one more thing…I do pray for humility every night…do you?
Wow I’m sorry if I offended you that was my not my intent. Yes I did read everything on this thread. Nothing in my post contradicts His Holiness Pope John Paul. I think you are reading things that aren’t there. Again you’re accusing me -why do you feel the need to do that? According to your replies you zero in on the two posters who agree with you and ignore the rest.

I have no idea what this level of comfort comment means? My level of comfort is fine.

Did I come across as arrogant? I said “humbly request” because that is what I meant -who am I to tell you what to do? It was a humble suggestion. I try very hard not judge peoples hearts. Everyone is in different places in their walk with Christ. I am not in a place to judge whether someone is being lazy or not. I really don’t think that’s my job.

What is this rose colored glasses comment? I go to Mass, I do my best to live my faith -I try very hard not to look around at what others are doing. I really don’t understand the need to contemplate others spiritual lives. I have enough of my own sins and failings to worry about.

Yes I pray for humility -if I came across as prideful or arrogant that was not my intent, and I am very sorry.

God bless you.
 
Come to my parish and see with your own eyes, the Saturday Vigil Mass is not at all like our 3 Sunday Masses. It has no where near the sense of the sacred that our late Sunday morning Mass has. And that’s not because our pastor changes things. It’s because of those who attend.
I see this sort of difference between Masses at various parishes even WITHIN a Sunday morning/afternoon/early evening.

The simplest way to state my point is that many who attend my parish’s Vigil Mass see it as an easy way to not break up the weekend. Sunday for them is an extension of Saturday.

While I can’t speak specifically to those at your parish, I would ask if, perhaps, they are, rather, seeing it as something of an extension of Sunday?

The pope, afterall, wasn’t knocking the “weekend”, but just saying that the ideology of the weekend ought not obscure the importance of Sunday’s inherant meaning.
To be sure there are those who attend Sunday Mass who have the same attitude, but to me that’s different, and it’s not in the same numbers.
I disagree and fail to see how it is, ultimately, any different in attitude, anyway.
 
Of these people, SOME tell me flat out that they either don’t go to Mass at all, or go to Saturday to “Get it over with”.
I know a fair amount of people who go to the earliest Sunday morning Mass for precisely the same reason.
I also have eyes, and I can see them arriving very late for Vigil and leaving early, often not even staying for communion. Yes, people do that on Sunday too, but not in the same numbers, certainly not at my parish. Again, this is some people. The point of this entire thread is that for SOME people the Saturday Vigil Mass is used as a way ef easily extending the weekend, something which the Apostolic Letter said is wrong.
It seems that you are extrapolating experience at your parish with a particular concern over “Sunday celebration of the Eucharist” which may not be entirely congruent with what happens everywhere else. As has been well noted, the same can happen every bit as much at various Masses on Sunday in other places.
I can’t tell you how many kids at my parish are getting confirmed from families that don’t even attend Mass (the confirmation class kids actually have to sign in on the weekends to show they went). And of these kids, not surprisingly, once they are confirmed we don’t see them again. These people need to be reached about the beauty of the Mass and the significance of Sunday. Actually, we all need to be reminded. But some, maybe, some more than others?
I don’t think that there would be any argument with this common concern. Yet if these people were, then, inspired to devoutly attend the evening Mass on Saturday would you still have the same complaint?
 
Now folks do also misuse Sunday Mass, but the point is that it is not unreasonable to say folks do it to a higher degree at the Saturday Vigil. That’s all.
I think it is unreasonable, actually. At least as a generalization.
 
OK, if we want to judge the motives of others–how’s this?!

We have a 12:30 pm Mass on Sunday. Our priests call it “the Hangover Mass.” They call it this DURING the Mass.

IOW, people are going out Saturday night, getting drunk, sleeping until the last minute, then dragging themselves to Mass.

I think that’s kind of bad myself.

But our priests don’t say it’s bad to come to “Hangover Mass.” They just chuckle and welcome everyone to Mass. After all, probably the vast majority of people who come to the 12:30 Mass did NOT go out and get drunk on Saturday night. I’m sure SOME of them do.

But that’s not my business. My business is to keep my own soul in order.

I don’t understand the reference to “rose-colored glasses?” Are you saying that we all need to keep an eye out on the sins of others? Or ourselves? I appreciate the warning, but like the vast majority of people who attend Sat. vigil Mass, my conscience is clear.
 
**GENERAL REMINDER

This thread will remain open based on a high increase in the level of charity and civility to one another, which includes but is not limited to:

Editing posts for tone and content removing from them all personalized remarks.

Cessation of critiquing posters rather than discussing the content of their posts.

Imputing motives to others which are speculative assertions.
**

Rreference: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=132852
 
As has been pointed out:

A) The Church permits, without qualification, the obligation to be met with the Vigil Mass on Saturday. If someone goes to that Mass, it’s none of anyone else’s business as to why.

B) Sunday begins on Saturday evening and the timing of the Mass that counts as the Vigil and thus fufills the obligation is left to the local ordinary. So even if those who don’t feel themselves fully engaged in being Catholis unless they are closely examining the spritual lives of their brethren cannot find fault with those who attend that Mass. It’s a part of the Sunday liturgy, just as the 6:30 AM Sunday Mass is.

We should be mindful to look to the beam in our own eyes rather than the mote in our brother’s.
 
The larger, and I think more central, topic of “Sunday”, it’s meaning, how it ought to be understood both culturally as well as Liturgically (and even in matter of “time”), and how it fits into or is distinct from “The Weeked” really does deserve it’s own discussion thread where those issues can be addressed apart from entanglement with concerns over the whys and wherefores of those who attend a Saturday night Mass or a continual pronoucement of it’s own legal legitimacy.
 
When I was younger I used to go to the first Mass on Sunday morning.

When I got older, I acquired additional responsibilities … elder care, for example. And sometimes we would go to Saturday evening Mass … because it wouldn’t be possible to carry out the other responsibilities AND go to Sunday Mass.

Finally, as I got older still, much of the morning is taken up with attempting to wake up. It just takes longer to do things. So, maybe Saturday evening or maybe the noon Mass on Sunday.

Everybody’s personal situation is different. And it changes from time to time.
 
Al Masetti, thanks for posting.

I was thinking about how hard it is for some people to get up and out of bed and ready for the day.

After I had surgery in March, it took me a LONG time to get going in the morning. I had to stump around the house using a walker and eventually crutches. Taking a shower and getting dressed took about an hour. And I was sooooooo slow at everything. And sometimes, I got dizzy or faint-feeling.

I’m much better now, but it still takes me a longer time to get ready because of the orthopedic acoutrements!

I know that the elderly often have to move slowly, eat carefully, and have lots of “rituals” to make sure they take all their meds. And then there’s the “bathroom” thing–sometimes it takes a while to get everything working in the morning!

Again, I think we ought not try to judge anyone for their Mass of choice, but just be glad that we have so many options.
 
As has been pointed out:

A) The Church permits, without qualification, the obligation to be met with the Vigil Mass on Saturday. If someone goes to that Mass, it’s none of anyone else’s business as to why.

B) Sunday begins on Saturday evening and the timing of the Mass that counts as the Vigil and thus fufills the obligation is left to the local ordinary. So even if those who don’t feel themselves fully engaged in being Catholis unless they are closely examining the spritual lives of their brethren cannot find fault with those who attend that Mass. It’s a part of the Sunday liturgy, just as the 6:30 AM Sunday Mass is.

We should be mindful to look to the beam in our own eyes rather than the mote in our brother’s.
From Jimmy Akin himself:
Monday, March 1, 2004
The Liturgical Day


People seem to be having a lot of questions right now about time and the calendar. A reader writes:I’ve had frog legs before. Those are pretty good. Tastes like chicken. Days of abstinence last from 12am-12am, right. I’ve always assumed that, but i guess i’m still not completely sure, cuz Sundays start at sundown the previous day, right.

According to the Code of Canon Law:In law, a day is understood as a period consisting of 24 continuous hours and begins at midnight unless other provision is expressly made; a week is a period of 7 days; a month is a period of 30 days, and a year is a period of 365 days unless a month and a year are said to be taken as they are in the calendar (Can. 202 §1).

So you’re right that days are reckoned from midnight to midnight (I’ll set aside the technical issue of whether the day begins at 12:00:00 or 12:00:01 or 12:01:00 or 12:01:01). However, it isn’t quite correct to say that Sunday begins at sundown on Saturday. According to the General Norms for the Liturgical Year and the Calendar:The liturgical day runs from midnight to midnight, but the observance of Sunday and solemnities begins with the evening of the preceding day (Ia:3).Sunday, considered as a legal day (per the Code) or as a liturgical day (per the General Norms) is still midnight to midnight, but its “observance” begins late in the day on Saturday. What precisely counts as “observance” seems to be unclear, though it has special prayers in the Liturgy of the Hours and it is possible to fulfill the obligation to attend Mass during the period of “observance.”
That period, which begins “with the evening,” also is not precisely defined in the current law. Evening isn’t sundown (which varies depending on the time of year and what latitude you are at–in Alaska Saturday may not even* have *a sundown!), but the law doesn’t say just when it begins. In the absence of that, the matter is somewhat debatable. The commentary on the Code of Canon Law put out by the Canon Law Society of Great Britain and Ireland takes the position that without further specification, evening begins at noon (and, indeed, people often do speak of the afternoon as evening, at least in some places). The new commentary by the Canon Law Society of America takes a different position. It would be nice if Rome gave us further guidance on this, and they may well do so as part of the liturgical renewal begun in the last few years.
Incidentally, what applies to Sunday in this regard also applies to all solemnities (which include the other holy days of obligation, plus a few more).

I have more, I’ll try to post i later. It’s from Paul VI, and it is interesting. But from this note that Sunday is Sunday, and Saturday is Saturday. Sunday does not begin on Saturday, and sundown is only important for the Easter Vigil (see the notes for it in the GIRM).
 
From Eucharisticum Mysterium

28. Anticipating the Sunday and Feast Day Masses on the Previous Evening
Where permission has been granted by the Apostolic See to fulfill the Sunday obligation on the preceding Saturday evening, pastors should explain the meaning of this permission carefully to the faithful and should ensure that the significance of Sunday is not thereby obscured. The purpose of this concession is in fact to enable the Christians of today to celebrate more easily the day of the resurrection of the Lord.

All concessions and contrary customs notwithstanding, when celebrated on Saturday this Mass may be celebrated only in the evening, at times determined by the local Ordinary.

In these cases the Mass celebrated is that assigned in the calendar to Sunday, the homily and the prayer of the faithful are not to be omitted.

What has been said above is equally valid for the Mass on holy days of obligation which for the same reason has been transferred to the preceding evening.

(I added the emphasis.) From what I’ve seen reading various liturgical sites, there was indeed worry that allowing a Saturday ANTICIPATORY MASS would obscure Sunday and its meaning. I imagine JP II had this in mind when he wrote his letter.

Now, all I myself and the OP have been saying is it makes sense that that was a valid concern and that, at least where we live, we are seeing that concern come to fruition. That’s it. I hope now folks will understand we have no intent on judging folks. We simply have the same concern as the council fathers and Paul VI.
 
From Eucharisticum Mysterium

28. Anticipating the Sunday and Feast Day Masses on the Previous Evening
Where permission has been granted by the Apostolic See to fulfill the Sunday obligation on the preceding Saturday evening, pastors should explain the meaning of this permission carefully to the faithful and should ensure that the significance of Sunday is not thereby obscured. The purpose of this concession is in fact to enable the Christians of today to celebrate more easily the day of the resurrection of the Lord.

All concessions and contrary customs notwithstanding, when celebrated on Saturday this Mass may be celebrated only in the evening, at times determined by the local Ordinary.

In these cases the Mass celebrated is that assigned in the calendar to Sunday, the homily and the prayer of the faithful are not to be omitted.

What has been said above is equally valid for the Mass on holy days of obligation which for the same reason has been transferred to the preceding evening.

(I added the emphasis.) From what I’ve seen reading various liturgical sites, there was indeed worry that allowing a Saturday ANTICIPATORY MASS would obscure Sunday and its meaning. I imagine JP II had this in mind when he wrote his letter.

Now, all I myself and the OP have been saying is it makes sense that that was a valid concern and that, at least where we live, we are seeing that concern come to fruition. That’s it. I hope now folks will understand we have no intent on judging folks. We simply have the same concern as the council fathers and Paul VI.
I think the Church has dealt with it and it’s a non-issue and that instead of picking at people, we should be thankful that they attend Mass. Let it go. We have far too much worrying about what others are doing, why they’re doing it, when they’re doing it, what they’re wearing when they’re doing it, in what language they’re doing it. I think it’s Pharisaical.
 
Now, all I myself and the OP have been saying is it makes sense that that was a valid concern and that, at least where we live, we are seeing that concern come to fruition. That’s it. I hope now folks will understand we have no intent on judging folks. We simply have the same concern as the council fathers and Paul VI.
I would argue that what is being seen “come to fruition” is really nothing less than what already may have existed among many Catholics, but just with a particular sensitivity which concerns itself over the hours which define “Sunday”.

Ironically, I sometimes hear a similar argument about people who attend anything but a morning Mass on Sunday (for this argument early afternoon would also be considered morning) because the same were supposedly not honoring the day properly by failing to get out of bed early and offer the “first fruits” or because they may have been up and out late Saturday night, “up to no good”.

Ultimately, how would it necessarily be all that better if the same people about whom one might have concerns over their attending the anticipated Mass were to instead attend on Sunday night - or even the first Mass of Sunday morning - with the same implied mentality of easily disposing of an obligation at their own convenience without thought of much more?
 
When I first became Catholic, I never went to the vigil mass. Later on, it became necessary. The result was confusion for me. I was confused about if I was then supposed to rest and do holy stuff on Saturday instead of on Sunday. I naively figured that I was supposed to do those things on the day that I went to mass. I eventually asked a priest and he straightened me out.

I still find it less than ideal for me to go to mass on a different day from the day that I am trying to avoid shopping and do holy reading and stuff. Sunday feels like it is missing something.

I think care ought to be given so that people are aware of how they are to go on and why. Perhaps my problem was that I was a convert, and wasn’t raised going to services on Saturday. I think catechesis has been weak about how we are to conduct ourselves on Holy Days of Obligation. For example, it was relatively recently that I realized that the old prohibitions stated “servile” work. That one threw me for a loop. I’d been trying to avoid any work, including mental. So, then I had to think about what that meant for me. And I had no idea. No one had ever told me. This seems to be the sort of thing you learn from your parents or your culture. But there is no Catholic “culture” now (around this country, anyway), so we need to find new ways to pass on this information. 🙂
 
For example, it was relatively recently that I realized that the old prohibitions stated “servile” work. That one threw me for a loop. I’d been trying to avoid any work, including mental. So, then I had to think about what that meant for me. And I had no idea. No one had ever told me. This seems to be the sort of thing you learn from your parents or your culture. But there is no Catholic “culture” now (around this country, anyway), so we need to find new ways to pass on this information. 🙂
And that would be a worthwhile thread: how do we observe the Sabbath so that it honors God and what God intended the Sabbath to be (OUR sabbath, each Sunday Feast of the Resurection)? Your point about servile work is a good one. I don’t do servile work on Sunday, nor do I allow (as an example) my nephew to do the weekly yard work for which I pay him on that day. BUT…I do stop off for fried chicken, thus ensuring that SOMEONE is doing servile work. I feel a little guilty about this.
 
I started the thread EDIT. It’s called “The Sabbath vs. the weekend.”

Please go there and talk! I think the subject is an interesting and confusing one, and needs more clarification.

Thanks!
 
I’m not pleased about this but there are many families I know that attend the Saturday Vigil Mass because it’s a convenience and they want to have Sunday free–completely free from any obligations. Wasn’t this mass created for those who otherwise were unable to attend Sunday mass because of work? :confused:
What mass do you go to? Is it convenient to you
 
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