Is there a movement for Catholic and Orthodox to join back together?

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It looks to me like it is the Greek EP who has unlawfully embraced the schismatics in Ukraine:
I don’t know.

And I don’t mean that rhetorically; I really don’t know.

The EP statements dispute the claim that the Ukraine is MP territory, and cite the documents in which the EP granted Moscow the “transference” of the see from Kiev to Moscow, and claims authority under that document to alter matters.

The Ukrainian church broke from Moscow centuries ago.

hawk
 
I’ve seen that, but I doubt that we’re going to get anything not grossly one-sided directly from either the EP or the MP . . .

hawk
 
is not all that old. Please read about the Jasenovac concentration camp where Serbian Orthodox were tortured and a Catholic clergyman Miroslav Filipovic was in charge as a commandant. Also, please read about the massacre carried out by the Ustase against people in an Orthodox Church at Glina.
No offense, but who cares and what difference does it make?

Why would a Catholic care and why would it make any difference to them that sinful men who claimed to be Catholic or were baptized Catholic did sinful evil things?

No Catholic cares about Orthodox who did sinful things…

Why do you consistently time after time after time feel the need to rub it in Catholics faces that previous generations of Catholic sinners did sinful evil things?

Maybe it’s a reflection of your own insecurities about something which cause a compulsion in you to repeat previous evil atrocities committed by Catholics and somehow impute the guilt for those things onto modern Catholics and indeed the whole Church.

Honestly, I’ve never even met a Jew who is so hell bent on imputing guilt to all current Germans for the Holocaust as you are hell bent on trying to impute guilt to Catholics about past atrocities. The only Jew who would do such a thing would be one who harbors a disdain for Germans in his heart to begin with… I can’t help but think the only Orthodox who would do what you’re doing would only do such a thing because of the disdain he harbors in his heart for Catholics.

Seriously man, knock it off. Quite frankly, it’s un-Christlike.
 
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either the EP or the MP . . .
Given the track record of both, I would tend to think things coming from the EP are more level headed and objective. The MP and the high ranking politicians and Churchmen connected to it are not well known for their fair and unbiased assessments of things.
 
I’ll readily grant that the EP is more likely to be level headed.

But the statements of either party in a vicious spat tend to be one sided.

hawk
 
But the statements of either party in a vicious spat tend to be one sided.
That’s true. But knowing how much influence Metropolitan Hilarion wields (I won’t be surprised one bit if he becomes Patriarch when Kirill goes home) in the Russian Church, and knowing what I’ve seen him say and do in the past, I am EXTREMELY skeptical of anything coming from Russia - whether it’s the Russian Church or Russian Government, they are both so closely connected they just about speak with one voice. I take anything coming from Russia with a boulder of salt.

I thank God from the bottom of my heart that he led me to revert to the Catholic Church just 1 week before I was re baptized into the Russian Orthodox Church. I spent 9 months as a RO catechuman and had an epiphany of the massive error I was being led into a week before sealing the deal - I believe this was Providence. It would have destroyed me spiritually if I had carried through.
 
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It has been the goal of Vatican II to bring not just Orthodox, but all Christians under the Pope. Many Protestants have already embraced the Pope.

The Ecumenical Movement: A School for Virtue​

“The restoration of unity among all Christians is one of the principal concerns of the Second Vatican Council.” This first sentence of Unitatis Redintegratio , the Decree on Ecumenism (1964, #1) is still surprising to many Catholics."

http://www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-te...us/vatican-ii-and-the-ecumenical-movement.cfm
 
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Part of the reason this problem persists is that reunification is held up by the constant dredging up of old, old actions. Why? Who cares why? What can we do now? That’s the real question.
Agree fully. Always felt it is a stupid idea to ask the children of long dead men to apologize for the actions of those long dead men against other long dead men.
 
Seriously man, knock it off.
If you would go to some of the Orthodox websites, you would read that that these are issues which disturb some of them. So, I don’t think it would be advisable to ignore this if you are talking about a movement for Catholic and Orthodox to join back together. It is going to be difficult, not only because of the theological differences. You need to have a situation where both sides feel comfortable with the other.
who cares and what difference does it make?
It makes a difference because if these things happened in the past, what is to prevent them from happening in the future? Already we have seen things flare up in 1992, when neighbors who were previously friends, all of a sudden became hostile enemies.
No Catholic cares about Orthodox who did sinful things…
I was in Eastern Europe and there was an Eastern Catholic Church which was taken over by the Orthodox shortly after WWII. I have heard Catholic priests say that this was wrong and they wanted their church building back. So contrary to what you say, there are Catholics who care about these things.
 
WWII is not all that old. Please read about the Jasenovac concentration camp where Serbian Orthodox were tortured and a Catholic clergyman Miroslav Filipovic was in charge as a commandant. Also, please read about the massacre carried out by the Ustase against people in an Orthodox Church at Glina.
People are sinful. Part of that sinful nature is to reduce their religion to tribalism on occasion. That doesn’t reflect on the religions itself, by why, in fact such divisions should not be maintained.

Frankly, for most people in most places World War Two is a long time ago. The vast, vast majority of people who committed atrocities of any kind in World War Two are dead. Their children are now old. Most living human beings were not alive during World War Two. Moreover, most Catholics were not involved in these events, nor were most Orthodox. If people of various tribal stripes were killing each other in the Balkans during World War Two, which they undoubtedly were, that says more about tribalism in the region than it does about their respective Faiths.

Every single people on earth has a grudge against somebody, often based on violence. Keeping the grudges going contributes to that. With both the Orthodox and the Catholic faith, to cite examples of particular events of this type serves no purpose at all. Nobody I’m related to participated in these events or any other such event you can name. There’s a lot more Catholics in my position than those in the position you are citing, most of whom will in fact remain in the Balkans. I’m not burdened by these actions I did not commit, and would not approve of, but I’m burdened by my own sins of commission and omission in my own era. That’s enough.
 
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I thank God from the bottom of my heart that he led me to revert to the Catholic Church just 1 week before I was re baptized into the Russian Orthodox Church. I spent 9 months as a RO catechuman and had an epiphany of the massive error I was being led into a week before sealing the deal - I believe this was Providence. It would have destroyed me spiritually if I had carried through.
Was an actual rebaptism required?

That’s very interesting as the Catholic Church recognizes all baptisms as valid as long as they are with the proper formula and done with the proper intent (not a theologian here, so I’m probably putting that incorrectly). We recognize most Christian Protestant baptisms and certainly recognize all Orthodox baptisms. It’d be quite odd to learn that a converting Catholic would require a new baptism unless there was some doubt about his first having been done.
 
It makes a difference because if these things happened in the past, what is to prevent them from happening in the future? Already we have seen things flare up in 1992, when neighbors who were previously friends, all of a sudden became hostile enemies.
What keeps them from happening in the future is not to hold on to them. What has kept them going on is holding on to them.

It’s a lot harder to hate a co-religious than it is one who regards you as a schismatic (which is true going both ways). People generally don’t shoot somebody whose weddings and baptisms they’ve participated in. If people fear each other, they latch onto whatever divides them. It’s a lot easier to argue that there’s a real difference because somebody is a member of another Faith, although I’d wager that a fairly significant number of the people we’re discussing weren’t practicing members of any Faith, the former Yugoslavia having been only recently Communist, and their religion just a means of achieving an identifiable tribal status.

If we want such assurances that these things don’t happen again, ending the schism would go leagues in that direction. If we want to assure that such things can happen again, continuing to maintain that all old wounds are still open, and all the old arguments are still fresh, goes a long way towards keeping that possible.
I was in Eastern Europe and there was an Eastern Catholic Church which was taken over by the Orthodox shortly after WWII. I have heard Catholic priests say that this was wrong and they wanted their church building back. So contrary to what you say, there are Catholics who care about these things.
There’s been a lot of adjustment of all types since Communism fell in the East. Restoring church buildings to their original owners of all kinds has occurred, and new churches have been built. If locally somebody pushes a point, that doesn’t mean that it’s the entire Church in an argument with the Orthodox.

Indeed, I’ve read that in the UK more Catholics attend Mass every weekend than members of the Church of England. Lots of churches were built by Catholics, but nobody is demanding them back. At some point I suspect some might end up being bought back, which is different, but that’s mere speculation on my part. Anyhow, that’s more likely a better example as its more typical.

Indeed, in my area there’s a church which up until recently had two names. . . because it served a Catholic and a Lutheran congregation that shared it. A better example yet.
 
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