Is there any point in going to college? Is it even WORTH IT? Please help!

[Jessup]

You will never have anything in your life whit out a college education. A good education,
trades only take you so far, and there are absolutely no employment options for people who don’t have a good hard skill from a university. ( not sociology) If your debating whether or not you want to go to the university, I would suggest working a construction job for a year, and spending time with your co-workers who are most likely strung out on coke, or
" wake and bake" every morning before work. Enjoy the delights of not being able to use a air conditioned bathroom because your considered " contracting trash" have no vacation time, and possibly work for a employer who spends your earnings on dope and asks if you want to get paid in " Bud" ( ie marijuana) but the best part of all things not having an education is the low quality of life you’ll have when you meet your potential spouse who also doesn’t have an education and can’t hold down a job.

I’m a former journeyman,(welding/mechanics) and a 33 year old student, I’ve been to both trade school and I’m at a university. Personally I’d rather be dead then fail at the university. I’d also rather be dead , then to ever be put back in trade school again. so think about that if it helps you make up your mind

 

[Zirconia]

I’m fairly sure I’m going to be bashed for saying this, but the best thing I ever did was to go to college instead of completing high school, completing both undergraduate and graduate degrees in the hard sciences. The graduate work in particular was rewarding and provided many opportunities I otherwise would not have had, and a sense of accomplishment that has stayed with me for years afterward. No debt is typical in this field, because usually graduate work in the hard sciences means a fellowship and a stipend. Not all education is a waste of time and it can definitely be worth it, even if you end up in a different field.

I would add that all the people in the news who have become wildly successful without degrees are by and large the EXCEPTION to the rule–that information would not be specifically noted if it were otherwise.

It is also valuable to remember that whatever path a person takes (with or without college), almost nothing worthwhile in life comes easily or without lots of work and sacrifice.

 

[George_Stegmeir]

I disagree. Your educational focus should rather be on a skill that 1) is going to be in demand for the next 20-30 years; and, 2) is something that you can do. Not everything requires a bachelor’s degree; in fact, many BAs/BSs are a waste of time and money. An EMT certification, for example, can provide a good career. Heck; I may have provided at least two full truck payments for our air conditioning serviceman, and I guarantee that he doesn’t have a BA. HVAC-trained people will always be able to find work. Ditto plumbers, electricians, auto mechanics, computer technicians. Consider enlisting in the military and learning a skill there. But don’t contract the debts involved with a college education just because society says that it’s cool to have a degree.

I agree 2,000% There are many trades in which the people in them earn more than your average college graduate. These would include, but are not limit to: automobile mechanic, body and fender man, bartender (in a fancy restaurant or nightclub), carpenter/cabinet maker, Electrician, heating and airconditioning technician, Plumber, etc. Many of these craftsmen earn as much as many lawyers and some doctors. The certainly earn more than school teachers!
To get started in a trade, I strongly suggest that you seriously consider joining the military, preferably the US Navy. A tour in the Navy is a maturing experience. For starters, it will get you away from home and away from being dependant upon your parents. You will enter as a youth and leave it as a man. In addition, because the Navy is the most technical of all the military services, it is almost impossible to do a hitch in the Navy without learning a trade that will enable you to earn a living on the outside. Lastly, you will get to travel and see a good hunk of the earth, because American Naval Ships are at sea for no more than 50% of the time, and every 10 days to 2 weeks you are in a new place.
You will also be able to enter a program that will finance either a trade school or university education.

 

[ringil]

The military can be a good option for a kid who is inclined- especially with the GI bill.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I’m fairly sure I’m going to be bashed for saying this, but the best thing I ever did was to go to college instead of completing high school, completing both undergraduate and graduate degrees in the hard sciences. The graduate work in particular was rewarding and provided many opportunities I otherwise would not have had, and a sense of accomplishment that has stayed with me for years afterward. No debt is typical in this field, because usually graduate work in the hard sciences means a fellowship and a stipend. Not all education is a waste of time and it can definitely be worth it, even if you end up in a different field.

I would add that all the people in the news who have become wildly successful without degrees are by and large the EXCEPTION to the rule–that information would not be specifically noted if it were otherwise.

It is also valuable to remember that whatever path a person takes (with or without college), almost nothing worthwhile in life comes easily or without lots of work and sacrifice.

Why would you think you are going to be bashed? But I have to say, your experience is very rare, as well. Very few people can get into college without finishing high school, and these days, even a state college ends up costing almost $10,000/year if you live on campus. If someone doesn’t offer you a scholarship (the OP indicated she is just an average student), then that will be debt for someone. Advanced degrees MAY be funded, but let’s let this young girl figure out if she even wants to pursue an undergraduate degree before we start talking about a master’s.

 

[LisaA]

The military can be a good option for a kid who is inclined- especially with the GI bill.

You know this hasn’t been mentioned much but is really an excellent idea for someone like the OP who doesn’t yet have a passion or focus on a career path. The military does a good job of helping people find a future career. The discipline and work habits will last a lifetime and the college benefits are excellent. I was very involved in a troop support group during the Iraq War and had much contact with individual troops. Many of them spoke of not knowing what they wanted after high school, not having the money for college, and that the military was a really good choice to help young adults mature.

Just an example, I used to specialize in supporting Medics. Most if not all were out of high school, no college, no medical training. What they learned in the military training allowed them to move onto positions in the private sphere, plus the college benefits helped if they wanted to go on to become nurses, P.A.s or other medical providers. This is a great area both for many job opportunities and excellent pay.

Good suggestion for the OP if she’s still following the thread. We’ve wandered a bit as usual.

Lisa

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Maria, I hope you are still reading. Several people asked whether you had gotten any counseling in high school, or any vocational testing whatsoever. It would help if someone had guided you even a little bit toward some sort of goal or direction. Maybe you did have some guidance. I hope you will take all of our varied experiences and opinions into consideration, and also sit down and talk to your mom and dad. They know you better than anyone else, and we know you not at all. So talk to them and get their feedback and ideas, OK?

 

[CPC]

“Pray and work.” --St. Benedict
Get a novena and pray it with the special intention of finding your vocation. Ask the old lady at church with twelve kids to pray for getting training for and finding a good job.

Before pulling any educational trigger, take some of those free vocation/aptitude tests online. See where your natural strengths are.

Consider that student loans won’t go away even in bankruptcy. And they will hunt you down through friends and family members if you drop off their radar. Financing your own education is wise. Maybe do a Pell Grant for the first semester then cut the ties with the system and pay-as-you-go, please.

Take the $5 Amen Clinic brain test. Dr. Amen is the guy who does those PBS specials showing scans of brains after drugs, junk food, alcohol, football trauma; and after reparative drug and nutritional therapy. This will show what area of your brain has unique strengths to play on, and what can be beefed up to function better, and if you are an under-fired or over-fired thinker. Handy. Might get you off the NutraSweet. amenclinics.com/

Postal workers, librarians, mechanics, plumbers, these are getting streamlined to the point of being utterly transformed. Internet email punked the post office and internet uber-librarians; electric cars mean they will change tires, lube wheels and swap battery packs, not wrench engines; and plumbing is going plastic so no sweating copper pipes, just crunching connectors which can be done by amateurs.

Portability is good. Recycling, even via thrift stores, will be perpetual. Ditto electrical stuff, with high/low-voltage apps like HVAC and rewiring for low-voltage standard and solar, and vehicles. And there’s always a market for the efficient, creative chef. Beyond that, ask God for details on portable careers so you can walk out of your neighborhood and get a passport and go anywhere with your skill.

Get info on Pell Grants and take all the technical career applicable courses. If it’s an English class writing poetry versus essays, take challenging essays. In fact, most CEO’s are English majors. Get the math that applies to accounting versus theoretical math, writing programs for computers versus history of computers, Latin for medical or legal fields or Spanish for public service, grant writing versus play writing…

Just watched another PBS special on happiness. Harvard scholar studied happiness, gives five disciplines to being happy. Take 21 days to adopt these into your life. Good advice for all:

–Write down 3 gratitudes daily for 21 days. Get out 21 3X5 cards to prep it and make it easy to really do it.

–Focus on the positive. And share it.

–Exercise, and that’s 20 minutes daily, please. Burns off all that snarky cortisol without upregulating cortisol.

–Meditate. Roy Masters Observation Meditation is my favorite, and is a free download at: fhu.com/ I also like Roy Masters’ suggestion to lay aside ambition as being a source of misery. It’s that woulda-coulda-shoulda stuff that hurts. Just do the next thing.

–Write and send a positive message via email or note.

This will ripple through society through a couple of dozen people and will bang into all the other happiness makers’ people. Blessings! And by the way, “You look mah-velous!”

Awesome response! Saved me a lot of trying to write a good one!

 

[Zirconia]

Speaking as the devil’s advocate, depending on the circumstances student loans can be useful tools. Especially if you don’t have a trust fund but want to go to medical school or law school. Or if you can’t work a lot during school because your organic chemistry lab meets four hours a day twice a week and you’ve got three or four other similar classes that are required for your degree and if you don’t take them then, you will have to wait another year before they will be offered again.

However, I would agree that if you don’t have plans to go into a high-paying profession that requires an advanced degree, racking up lots of student loan debt is a bad idea. And of course there are other factors–if, for example, you never marry because it is not your calling, you may be better able to handle some debt.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

Speaking as the devil’s advocate, depending on the circumstances student loans can be useful tools. Especially if you don’t have a trust fund but want to go to medical school or law school. Or if you can’t work a lot during school because your organic chemistry lab meets four hours a day twice a week and you’ve got three or four other similar classes that are required for your degree and if you don’t take them then, you will have to wait another year before they will be offered again.

However, I would agree that if you don’t have plans to go into a high-paying profession that requires an advanced degree, racking up lots of student loan debt is a bad idea. And of course there are other factors–if, for example, you never marry because it is not your calling, you may be better able to handle some debt.

Yes, exactly. I had a few when I left college, but not more than I could pay back comfortably. Some of it is choosing a college with a proper price tag. For example, paying to go to an Ivy League school when you plan to teach might be mentally irregular. The bills won’t match your paycheck. Going to state college, you should be able to pay back the bills. However, an Ivy League school to become a lawyer might make sense because where you went matters more and your paycheck will likely pay the bills. Same with a doctor.

 

[LisaA]

Yes, exactly. I had a few when I left college, but not more than I could pay back comfortably. Some of it is choosing a college with a proper price tag. For example, paying to go to an Ivy League school when you plan to teach might be mentally irregular. The bills won’t match your paycheck. Going to state college, you should be able to pay back the bills. However, an Ivy League school to become a lawyer might make sense because where you went matters more and your paycheck will likely pay the bills. Same with a doctor.

FWIW I believe there are studies that indicate the initial salaries for Ivy League graduates are higher, but those who go to quality state schools…and there are MANY of these universities around the country…catch up within a few years. Whether high tuition is worthwhile from a simply financial standpoint is questionable. As several have said, if you can afford it or get scholarships to cover tuition, go for it. If not, don’t mortgage your future.

Further, if you can parlay a couple years at Community College and THEN transfer to a higher prestige university, you can get the same bang for the buck as someone who spent four years there. I have one friend who graduated from Stanford but spent a single year there and got much of her undergrad at community and state colleges, another who has a PoliSci degree, cum ladue from Boston University but got his first two years at a community college. It’s a less expensive route to the sime gold plated sheepskin

Lisa

 

[Jessup]

I agree 2,000% There are many trades in which the people in them earn more than your average college graduate. These would include, but are not limit to: automobile mechanic, body and fender man, bartender (in a fancy restaurant or nightclub), carpenter/cabinet maker, Electrician, heating and airconditioning technician, Plumber, etc. Many of these craftsmen earn as much as many lawyers and some doctors. The certainly earn more than school teachers!
To get started in a trade, I strongly suggest that you seriously consider joining the military, preferably the US Navy. A tour in the Navy is a maturing experience. For starters, it will get you away from home and away from being dependant upon your parents. You will enter as a youth and leave it as a man. In addition, because the Navy is the most technical of all the military services, it is almost impossible to do a hitch in the Navy without learning a trade that will enable you to earn a living on the outside. Lastly, you will get to travel and see a good hunk of the earth, because American Naval Ships are at sea for no more than 50% of the time, and every 10 days to 2 weeks you are in a new place.
You will also be able to enter a program that will finance either a trade school or university education.

 Your quality of life is next to nothing in the crafts and trades in this day in age. The only way I can see being an electrician, or especially my trade as a

welder/industrial mechanic. Is to be permanently staying at a power company for 30.00 an hour.
That’s the meat and potatoes of the trades, ( power companies) the days of spending 30 years with a union out of high school in a respectable trade is finished With the elimination of pensions, and the " Green Energy" agenda, these jobs are going away more every year. A good solid education from a university in a hard science is the way to go. Medical school, pharmacist, nurse, engineer, accountant. These are the only ways to make a living.
Working in the trades is a sure fire way to become poor.

 

[LisaA]

Your quality of life is next to nothing in the crafts and trades in this day in age. The only way I can see being an electrician, or especially my trade as a
welder/industrial mechanic. Is to be permanently staying at a power company for 30.00 an hour.
That’s the meat and potatoes of the trades, ( power companies) the days of spending 30 years with a union out of high school in a respectable trade is finished With the elimination of pensions, and the " Green Energy" agenda, these jobs are going away more every year. A good solid education from a university in a hard science is the way to go. Medical school, pharmacist, nurse, engineer, accountant. These are the only ways to make a living.
Working in the trades is a sure fire way to become poor.

Jessup I can’t argue with your experience so leaving that aside, I think it’s fine to suggest people go into the hard sciences, nursing,engineering accounting etc…In fact I went into accounting BECAUSE of the great number of jobs in the field.

But we all need to get real. These are the most competitive of areas. They are the toughest curricula. In some particularly IT and engineering we also have competition with foreign nationals. Not everyone going into those fields is going to make it. They have to be smart, study hard and perform well on tests. To get into medical school, pharmacy school and nursing school is REALLY REALLY tough. There are a lot of smart people vying for those jobs.

I don’t mean to discourage anyone but there is a reason there are tons more graduates in the “soft sciences” like sociology or psychology than electrical engineering. It’s a lot easier. You need to find where your talent meets the requirements for that subject and be willing to work very very hard. This is where the phrase “easier said than done” comes into play.

Lisa

 

[Zirconia]

Further, if you can parlay a couple years at Community College and THEN transfer to a higher prestige university, you can get the same bang for the buck as someone who spent four years there. I have one friend who graduated from Stanford but spent a single year there and got much of her undergrad at community and state colleges, another who has a PoliSci degree, cum ladue from Boston University but got his first two years at a community college. It’s a less expensive route to the sime gold plated sheepskin

Lisa

Also, there comes a point when the fact that you have the degree is more important than where you got it. At least within reason–if the school is accredited by a reputable authority (in my region it would be WASC), ultimately a bachelor’s degree from it is just as much a bachelor’s degree from any other institution. I should add I had a very unique situation both with my education and how most of it was financed, but ultimately I attained the degrees and that is what starts mattering more and more. Not where you end up going or how much you spend.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

Your quality of life is next to nothing in the crafts and trades in this day in age. The only way I can see being an electrician, or especially my trade as a
welder/industrial mechanic. Is to be permanently staying at a power company for 30.00 an hour.
That’s the meat and potatoes of the trades, ( power companies) the days of spending 30 years with a union out of high school in a respectable trade is finished With the elimination of pensions, and the " Green Energy" agenda, these jobs are going away more every year. A good solid education from a university in a hard science is the way to go. Medical school, pharmacist, nurse, engineer, accountant. These are the only ways to make a living.
Working in the trades is a sure fire way to become poor.

$30 an hour is nothing to scoff at. Electric and phone companies will always have a need. I know more than 1 person in these fields who is doing just fine and has excellent medical insurance.

 

[Jessup]

$30 an hour is nothing to scoff at. Electric and phone companies will always have a need. I know more than 1 person in these fields who is doing just fine and has excellent medical insurance.

That 30.00 an hour is the upper 10%. people spend years working on the road living out of gang boxes before finding a permanent place to work. But thanks to " Green" Energy most of those jobs are going away. If was to go into any trade again, it would be strictly Instrumentation and control. But as far as school goes, I'm not that smart Ive been struggling through it all my life, I'm working on getting to see a Dr. to find out if I can get on meds to perform better. Aderall I hear works wonders.

I’d live off of aderall for 4 or 5 years if it meant passing school and having a job in the AC afterwards for 80k a year.
anyway, Cheers! and God bless,