Is there anything impossible to God?

[Fra_Angelo]

My friend, you have misunderstood omnipotence. God is omnipotent, but let’s clarify.
Now, transfer that principle of the triangle having three sides as necessary to exist over to some of these questions you’re asking.

. No infringement on omnipotence here, He is just doing what is possible only for God and no one else.
God could not be God if He wasn’t the ultimate stadard for morality. Who else but God alone could do that?
Hope this helps. Praise God

That makes sense, thank you.

Basically, it is only good sense to say that some things just aren’t possible. Thank God this is true. It means that things can make sense.

I don’t understand the meaning of this that certain things aren’t possible.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Bob, my question to you is: It appears that God does not interfere with free will (at least, that’s how it APPEARS, we really don’t know, do we?) Does He not because he cannot, will not, because it “breaks the mold” whereof creation is made, “invades” the laws He put into place? If He knows before hand what will occur; and if what will occur is horrendous, harmful, destructive; and He chooses not to intervene, does He co-create the awful event(s) or does He allow it because of the nature of Nature? I think this is the one thing that I struggle with the most. I am interested in your particular feedback.

I don’t know the answer to this any more than you do.

I don’t have formal training in philosophy, but from time to time I’ll go and read a bit about some philosopher or philosophical school.

I tend to rely on certain spiritual experiences for my insights, or some of them at least. I think I can claim to have had a certain number of spiritual experiences of one sort or another.

I’ll use a couple of them to try to get some sort of handle on “free will vs. predestination”.

I said earlier that my father appeared in my room the night he died, he started with an apology, we argued and conversed, and at the end he gave this terrifying scream and disappered.

I think he’s in hell. During our “conversation” (we could probably argue all night about how we communicated, since he no longer had a body with lungs, voice box, brain, tongue or any other physical means of doing so, but we talked anyway), at one stage he blurted out, “I always was doomed! I didn’t really have any choice!” I argued back (and I was an atheist at the time) saying “That can’t be right!” He replied, “Oh, it’s right all right. You can see that from here!” (From where he was standing, presumably in front of the judgemen seat).

Yet later in the same exchange, he admitted, “I was WILLING” ( to act in the deliberately cruel stupid way he did). When I related this story to my old pastor, including the comment my father made about being “doomed”, but without telling him the bit about being willing, the pastor commented, “I’d say he was willing. Very willing.”

Now I used to drive a cab a couple of nights a week. Sometime in late 2005, I remember being in the same street in a suburb where my father died. He happened to die at Unit 1/7 (Unnamed) Street), Nundah. Since being in the street reminded me of his death and apparition, I prayed that if there was any truth about the apparition and some of the things he said, I asked for a “sign”. I got back this sense I ought to know better, but anyway I persevered.

Later that same night, or perhaps the next night I was driving, I pulled up at the Queen Street rank in Brisbane, which was where I usually waited for fares. Eventually a bloke came up, a bit the worse for a drink or two, hopped in the back, and simply said “Nundah!”

I asked him, “Whereabouts in Nundah?” He was a bit narky, but simply said, “Just drive. I’ll tell you where to go!” So off we went. And ended up at No. 6 (Unnamed Street), Nundah, at a house directly across the road from where my father died. I even said to the bloke, “Hmph! That’s where my father died.” He was a bit taken aback, but anyway.

As far as I’m concerned I got my “sign”. Now I had free will all night where I drove; traffic and traffic lights affected my whereabouts and timing. The other cabs queued up ahead and behind me at the rank. They were affected by traffic etc, the radio, other jobs and so on, and the bloke I picked up had free will when he’d leave the pub where he’d be drinking, and even if he wanted to hop into my particular cab.

Despite all this personal free will, the permutations of traffic, lights, radio jobs, other cabs etc. etc. God somehow directed this particular fare to my particular cab to give me my “sign”.

Do we have free will? We do, but God’s in charge. Does God therefore will suffering? I think He does. I don’t like it, but I find the claim that God wills that no one suffers doesn’t meet up with reality, as I’ve experienced it.

Now I could read tome after tome on philosophy if I wanted to. But I don’t think I’d get one inch closer to the reason for my father saying “I always was doomed! I didn’t really have any choice!” and “I was WILLING!” almost in the same breath. Or the way God brought a particular drunk to my particular cab to the address right across the road from where my father died, just to illustrate a point.

Or my three “double whammies” (like a breath going through you in waves from head to foot), which on each occasion were used to highlight something being said by a Bible group leader on one occasion, and my old pastor on the other two occasions. The only trouble was that I’ve calculated that in spatial terms I’d moved billions, and probably trillions, of miles from first to third occasion in purely astronomical spatial terms.

Yet God knew where to find me on each occasion; what was about to be said and how it had relevance to me personally", and how to get across the message in no uncertain terms on each occasion without one other person in the vicinity knowing about it. He remained completely hidden. I distinctly remember the first time looking around at everybody else to see what they were making of it, and they weren’t taking the slightest bit of notice. For the simple reason it hadn’t happened to them.

Then of course we’ve got Mr. Dawkins who thinks he’s going to put God in a test tube. Boy, what a twirp!

 

[Bob_Crowley]

I’ll tell another story - I’ve told it before, but this time I’m going to emphasise the conflict between God’s will and my apparently free will.

The night my father died, he predicted “You’ll meet a pastor. You’ll think he’s great, but all he’ll do is discourage you even more.”

My father died in January 1979. I met the pastor around October 1982. Sometime around 1991 the pastor apologised for discouraging me. Prediction fulfilled.

Now in that case, my father could obviously see something that was going to happen a few years down the track. It happened - it was a “you **will **meet…”

However the old pastor himself was prophetic, which was one of the reason thought “he was great.”

One prediction he made was “I think you’ll be doing a cleaning job for a short time. You won’t like it much, but I think the Lord will just WANT you to hear about a ghost.” (emphasis mine - he said it almost conversationally)… Now he would have made that prediction around 1990 or 1991 as he died himself in January 1992.

He also commented that “I think you might have seen this ghost before”.

I knew by this time how accurate he was (I’d been in his church about 9 years by then), but even so I thought it was silly, and basically ignored it.

He also predicted I’d lose my then (government) job (1995), and I’d become a Catholic (1996 or 97).

In earlly 2006 I was still driving the cab I mentioned above. January in Brisbane is dead for cabs, and I hated all the wasted time. I was sitting there wondering when I was going to get the next job when I noticed a bloke cleaning around a shopping centre. I spoke to him and started cleaning not long after.

And I didn’t like it much - split shifts, driving 600 kms a week, and I thought one brand of stores were a bit tough. However I was being shown around an old store in Ipswich when the young bloke showing me the run suddenly remarked “This place is haunted.” So here was the old pastor’s prediction.

Apparently a former manager had committed suicide in the 1960’s.

Eventually I got around to ringing the local priest in Ipswich, probably in 2008, and he said he’d get a mass said for the ghost. However I wondered if he did, as I was just a strange voice on the phone with a peculiar story and I couldn’t give him the name of the suicide (and still can’t).

Also note I needed to lose my government job, or I wouldn’t have been cleaning, and I needed to become Catholic, or I wouldn’t have thought about having a mass said for the ghost. All 3 predictions were necessary.

But I had doubts whether the priest had said a mass, and I wondered what to do about it. But circa 2010 I came across an Australian priest on this American based forum, and lo and behold, he just happened to be located **at the very same church in Ipswich **where I’d originally phoned the main priest. So through the forum’s email facility, I got in contact with him, and he said he’d definitely say a mass.

Now I think he’s the ONLY Australian priest I’ve seen on this forum. * And guess where he was located just when I needed him? *

Last year I checked the church’s website and he was no longer there. He’d obviously been moved to anothe church and replaced by another associate priest.

So just when I was wondering about what to do with regard to ensuring a mass was said for this suicide, I find on Catholic Answers Forums the solution. Once that’s done, he’s then moved.

In October 2012, I received a newsletter from the local seminary, and both the Forum priest (ordained 2009) and his replacement (Ordained 2011) featured in the newsletter. I donate a few dollars each year to the seminary, which is why I got the newsletter.

Surprise, surprise.

Here’s the predestination bit - “I think the Lord will just WANT you to hear about a ghost.” That’s not just foresight, but God’s active WILL. Around 15 years elapsed between the pastor’s prediction, but despite my initial scepticism, thousands of individual choices by both myself and others, I found myself doing a cleaning job for a short time, didn’t like it much, and heard about a suicidal ghost, and ended up getting a mass said for him, which I assume was God’s will. He’d been dead long enough for the world to forget about him (by and large), but God hadn’t forgotten.

And his prediction also linked Catholic Answers Forums and our local Holy Spirit Seminary into the same set of circumstances.

So how much is my vaunted “Free Will” worth, if God “WANTED” me to hear about a ghost? Did I, to echo my father above, “really have any choice?”.

That’s why I don’t get too excited about philosophical discusssions on “free will” and “predestination”. God’s got the drop on us, regardless of what we do, and we’ll never work it out.

What about a devil’s advocate like Christopher Hitchens? Was he, like my father, “always (predestined - doomed?)” to be a hardline atheist, or misetheist? Possibly - maybe probably.

But you can bet your bottom dollar he was “willing”. I’d say he was very willing, to be the devil’s advocate.

Even in my own case, I made a “willing” decision to do cleaning. But I didn’t know what God had tied up with it. Not in a million years would I have guessed the pecuilar set of circumstances that tied it all together.

As “for seeing the ghost before”, years before I went camping with my father at a locality called Legume. To get there and back we drove through Ipswich. Casting my mind back, I remember one trip when a bloke standing with a briefcase on the footpath looked at me as we drove past. I turned around and he then walked through a closed door. It gave me the heebie geebies - I wondered if I was going out of my mind. That was probably around 1970.

It took nearly 40 years for that episode to make sense. Even back then, God knew what He WANTED and INTENDED.

 

[Pugsly]

Bob…these are fascinating incidents. However, I have one comment about free will…If God allows the devils to mess with us…is it then not “fair” that He can reach into our life’s events with a sign or a miracle here and there?

I know free will is precious in God’s sight…but is it fair that devils tamper with it…unopposed?

 

[ellzeena]

I don’t know the answer to this any more than you do.

I don’t have formal training in philosophy, but from time to time I’ll go and read a bit about some philosopher or philosophical school.

I tend to rely on certain spiritual experiences for my insights, or some of them at least. I think I can claim to have had a certain number of spiritual experiences of one sort or another.

I’ll use a couple of them to try to get some sort of handle on “free will vs. predestination”…
Yet God knew where to find me on each occasion; what was about to be said and how it had relevance to me personally", and how to get across the message in no uncertain terms on each occasion without one other person in the vicinity knowing about it. He remained completely hidden. I distinctly remember the first time looking around at everybody else to see what they were making of it, and they weren’t taking the slightest bit of notice. For the simple reason it hadn’t happened to them.

Then of course we’ve got Mr. Dawkins who thinks he’s going to put God in a test tube. Boy, what a twirp!

Thank you! Wonderful response! And I agree. so-called anecdotal information is the best testimony no matter what field you’re in, even though materialist science refutes it constantly. I agree, I have had hundreds of “signs”, met by God in ways, in moments, that were undeniable. Such as your cab fare…yes, it was an answer. I hate to say or believe that God “wills” suffering, it just cuts to the quick. BUT…I wonder if WE, and all who suffer, don’t (at some point, perhaps prior to conception) “volunteer” to serve Him in this way? It’s an idea I’ve had for many, many years. I believe I was given a choice at age five, when Mary appeared to me: stay and suffer through a very hard life for God’s purpose and with His help, or leave with her. I was at death’s door with double pneumonia. I think I chose, to stay. That is something I would do, even now, volunteer in that manner. But so much of that event is hidden (except for those parts revealed to me which predicted certain catastrophe in my life). Bottom line? We don’t, we can’t, know God, as He is, because it is impossible for us. I think that every day we step out in faith and try to trust. Trust: so hard, but it’s what Jesus taught. Thanks, Bob.

 

[ellzeena]

Regarding God’s perspective, Bob and others:

Time does not exist. Quantum Physics has “proven” this. It is an illusion necessary to creation. Everything happens at once, it is not linear. The end is the same as the beginning. God is outside of “time”. He sees, He knows, it is not a prediction, it is His nature, outside of time/creation. This is one reason why we are totally unable to comprehend this, because we are creatures, we are part of “time”. I’ve thought for my lifetime that science would catch up with faith and it is, quite unwillingly, I might add. Non-local consciousness is real. I have experienced it throughout my life. It has also been proven, in the laboratory. This is part of God, in some way. So precognition is having availability (openness, if you will) to that which is available to us anyway. It isn’t in the manner of predicting such as is done by so-called psychics. It’s on a much deeper level, hard to explain: it’s a soul level. I just know things and, often, I don’t realize I knew it until it has come to pass. I’m not trying to, it happens, a lot. I have been prepared, also, by God. Think about this: when you look back on your life, doesn’t it appear to have gone by in the blink of an eye? Because it has. It is. It always will. And one thing you, Bob, said that rings so true to me: “WILLING”. Yes. One can do harm without intention, or one can do harm knowingly, and for whatever reason just not care. I think there’s an enormous difference. Being outside of Time, God is able to see it all, at once. Thank you for sharing, wonderful anecdotes. I absolutely love sharing this way with people who know God and who are known by Him.

 

[fred_conty]

Bob…these are fascinating incidents. However, I have one comment about free will…If God allows the devils to mess with us…is it then not “fair” that He can reach into our life’s events with a sign or a miracle here and there?

I know free will is precious in God’s sight…but is it fair that devils tamper with it…unopposed?

Hi Pugsly,

This is a little point, but it may help you.

The devils(bad angels) cannot touch our will. All they may do is tempt, which means project or recall images and thoughts to our thought and imagination processes. They may also, but rarely, influence the body in some ways. BUT…within the limits that God sets for them.

Also our angels can remind us and tell us about good holy things to counteract them, as well as the Holy Spirit. And our prayers as well also limit their activities.

So they are never left to freely do anything to our will, and are always within bounds that God sets for them when they are dealing with our intellect.

Just some thoughts.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Bob…these are fascinating incidents. However, I have one comment about free will…If God allows the devils to mess with us…is it then not “fair” that He can reach into our life’s events with a sign or a miracle here and there?

I know free will is precious in God’s sight…but is it fair that devils tamper with it…unopposed?

I don’t think devils can tamper with our free will “unopposed”. However they can use force which God is not prepared to do.

In the end, I think there’s something in every person which can seek God. In some people, this doesn’t even seem to come into operation - serial murderers, tyrants, sex slavers, career criminals, etc. The capability is there, but they’re just not interested. And the longer they remain uninterested, the easier it is for the devil to strengthen his grip, until they get to the stage where they’re almost certainly doomed.

Then there are those who seek God. Saints, charity workers, people who make a practice of helping others, even religious persons of other faiths. After all, St. Paul was virulently opposed to Christianity at first, but he was always serious about God.

I think it’s this raw material which pushes us one way or the other. And God and the devil respond in their own ways.

I don’t think we’ll know the answer this side of glory myself. As for “signs” …

I’ve related the story of my father appearing the night he died. The only other story I’ve heard of a clear materialisation was when a former homosexual gave a testimony some years ago in the Presbyterian Church I attended. I did hear that a certain Catholic who helped to set up a charismatic Catholic outfit in Brisbane had an apparition of his father, but I don’t know any detais.

However I heard the testimony of the homosexual.

According to his own account, he’d been mixed up in everything going in Sydney, which is the hotbed of the homosexual scene in Australia. BSM, bondage, orgies - you name it. He said that he and others used to stand on street corners in Kings Cross (Sydney’s Red Light district) and talk about how they’d kill Fred Nile, a Christian morals campaigner in Sydney. In a stroke of irony, it was one of Fred Nile’s ministries that rescued this particular homosexual after his first suicide attempt.

But while he had become a Christian, the long term bug remained, and he succumbed. In despair he made a second suicide attempt. This time he was really serious, and was all set to go, when in his own words, Christ materialised in the corner of the room, moved towards him and somehow merged with him. ** From that time on he never even had to struggle with the tempation to homosexuality**, had married a woman who accepted his past, and had a couple of young kids when I heard him speak.

So he was given a sign, which he related to others. But homosexuals have a higher suicide rate than the general public, so why doesn’t Christ solve all their problems that way? His story was unique as far as I know.

I don’t know. In the end God is sovereign, and all we can do is cooperate or resist. Either way we’ll serve HIs purpose, either as a prize or as a tool, but we will also be shown to have been willing to do what we did.

In fact one of the things my father said the night he died was “It (the cruel way he treated me) was all for your (my) benefit!” I’ve never really worked that out, but apparently it is supposed to have some salutary benefit in the long run, even though i don’t like it.

Somehow God is supposedly going to use that evil for some sort of good. Just how remains to be seen. It would appear my own father was a tool somehow. He could have made a decision to serve God instead, but he didn’t. So somehow despite his deliberate cruelty, he still ended up serving God in some form.

Even the devil does somehow. In a pique of frustration, I once blurted out to my old pastor, “What the hell did God make the devil for?”. He thought for a moment, and then just shrugged, and replied, “Oh, he’s got a job to do I suppose.”

This is probably what irks the devil the most actually - the knowledge that in the long run, God’s using him as a tool.

 

[Fomalhaut]

I don’t think devils can tamper with our free will “unopposed”. However they can use force which God is not prepared to do.

Don’t if that’s too off-topic, but can you expand on that ? How could God be unprepared to something, as he knows the future ?

 

[tonyrey]

I don’t think devils can tamper with our free will “unopposed”. However they can use force which God is not prepared to do.

In the end, I think there’s something in every person which can seek God. In some people, this doesn’t even seem to come into operation - serial murderers, tyrants, sex slavers, career criminals, etc. The capability is there, but they’re just not interested. And the longer they remain uninterested, the easier it is for the devil to strengthen his grip, until they get to the stage where they’re almost certainly doomed.

Then there are those who seek God. Saints, charity workers, people who make a practice of helping others, even religious persons of other faiths. After all, St. Paul was virulently opposed to Christianity at first, but he was always serious about God.

I think it’s this raw material which pushes us one way or the other. And God and the devil respond in their own ways.

I don’t think we’ll know the answer this side of glory myself. As for “signs” …

I’ve related the story of my father appearing the night he died. The only other story I’ve heard of a clear materialisation was when a former homosexual gave a testimony some years ago in the Presbyterian Church I attended. I did hear that a certain Catholic who helped to set up a charismatic Catholic outfit in Brisbane had an apparition of his father, but I don’t know any detais.

However I heard the testimony of the homosexual.

According to his own account, he’d been mixed up in everything going in Sydney, which is the hotbed of the homosexual scene in Australia. BSM, bondage, orgies - you name it. He said that he and others used to stand on street corners in Kings Cross (Sydney’s Red Light district) and talk about how they’d kill Fred Nile, a Christian morals campaigner in Sydney. In a stroke of irony, it was one of Fred Nile’s ministries that rescued this particular homosexual after his first suicide attempt.

But while he had become a Christian, the long term bug remained, and he succumbed. In despair he made a second suicide attempt. This time he was really serious, and was all set to go, when in his own words, Christ materialised in the corner of the room, moved towards him and somehow merged with him. ** From that time on he never even had to struggle with the tempation to homosexuality**, had married a woman who accepted his past, and had a couple of young kids when I heard him speak.

So he was given a sign, which he related to others. But homosexuals have a higher suicide rate than the general public, so why doesn’t Christ solve all their problems that way? His story was unique as far as I know.

I don’t know. In the end God is sovereign, and all we can do is cooperate or resist. Either way we’ll serve HIs purpose, either as a prize or as a tool, but we will also be shown to have been willing to do what we did.

In fact one of the things my father said the night he died was “It (the cruel way he treated me) was all for your (my) benefit!” I’ve never really worked that out, but apparently it is supposed to have some salutary benefit in the long run, even though i don’t like it.

Somehow God is supposedly going to use that evil for some sort of good. Just how remains to be seen. It would appear my own father was a tool somehow. He could have made a decision to serve God instead, but he didn’t. So somehow despite his deliberate cruelty, he still ended up serving God in some form.

Even the devil does somehow. In a pique of frustration, I once blurted out to my old pastor, “What the hell did God make the devil for?”. He thought for a moment, and then just shrugged, and replied, “Oh, he’s got a job to do I suppose.”

This is probably what irks the devil the most actually - the knowledge that in the long run, God’s using him as a tool.

Thanks for a fascinating post, Bob.

Genuine freedom implies that there are no limits to the evil of which persons (human and non-human) are capable in this world…

 

[Bob_Crowley]

Don’t if that’s too off-topic, but can you expand on that ? How could God be unprepared to something, as he knows the future ?

By “force” in the spiritual sense, I mean something like demonic possession, where they take over a person’s faculties to a greater or lesser extent. God won’t do that, but always works within the boundaries of person’s free will.

The devil will also allow his agents to use physical force eg. the Gestapo using torture, and the Nazis concentration camps and hostage executions. However in this sense, God **will ** allow his agents to use physical force.against evil. For example, God expected the “free world” to do something about the evils of fascism and nazism a couple of generations ago, by the use of massive physical force.

The Americans tried to stay out of it, but in the end, God let them be drawn into the conflict almost against their will.

On the other hand, whenever I consider the Battle of Midway only a few months after Pearl Harbour, I find it difficult to ignore a divine sleight of hand.

 

[ellzeena]

Don’t if that’s too off-topic, but can you expand on that ? How could God be unprepared to something, as he knows the future ?

That’s semantics. “Prepared” can be used colloquially to mean “willing to” - I am not prepared to ride that horse (lol). I am prepared to help my neighbor, if necessary (doesn’t mean I have tons of food stashed away, etc.) God is not willing to force His will on us or change the course of direction we choose with our free will. He is not “prepared”, although he can influence us, yes, if we’re open to His influence. And there is no “future”, time is a factor of the fabric of creation. It all happens at once. Our physical brains are constructed in a manner that filters what our eyes actually see - everything you “see” is something that occurred a second ago (perhaps shorter), it’s all in the “past”. In the case of certain illness and dysfunction, when the brain is prevented (either chemically or structurally) from doing its job of filtering what they eyes “see”, people (and yes, animals) SEE and HEAR what is actually THERE. These are then termed hallucinations but, are they, really?

 

[georgemiller]

I believe another answer to consider is that our God is a God of truth and, as such, He cannot also be the creator or author of contradiction. To do so would make the first statement a lie.

 

[tdgesq]

I believe another answer to consider is that our God is a God of truth and, as such, He cannot also be the creator or author of contradiction. To do so would make the first statement a lie.

And this is correct.

In Latin, the applicable part of the Nicene Creed reads “Credo in Deum Patrem omnipotentem . . . .” Omnipotentem is the Latin root for the English word “omnipotent.” As you know, the creed translated into English reads “we believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty . . . .” The Council of Nicaea was an ecumenical council, so what it teaches in this regard is absolutely binding on the consciences of all Catholics.

Of course what we want to know is whether God being “almighty” means that he can do anything at all - even engage in a logical inconsistency such as creating a square circle. The Church clearly teaches that not even God can engage in logical contradiction.

Let’s suppose for a moment that God could create a square in physical space and at the same time create a circle in the same physical space. This would violate the law of non-contradiction. What this would mean is that God can create something that is a square and not a square at the same time and in the same sense. It would also mean that God creates a circle and not a circle at the same time and in the same sense. It would be true that he was creating a square, yet also false that he was creating a square. It would be true that he was creating a circle, yet also false that he was creating a circle. It would be a contradiction. And most importantly, it would mean that God could create a state of affairs that is not true. He could create a state of affairs that is false.

Yet one of the attributes of God is that he is truth. The First Vatican Council teaches that:

“God cannot deny himself, nor can truth ever be in opposition to truth.”

piar.hu/councils/ecum20.h…20and%20reason

“we believe to be true what He has revealed,
· not because we perceive its intrinsic truth by the natural light of reason,
· but because of the authority of God himself, who makes the revelation and can neither deceive nor be deceived.”

piar.hu/councils/ecum20.h…3%20On%20faith

These are de fide dogmatic statements of the Vatican council; the highest grade of theological certainity possible and something that all Catholics must believe.
Furthermore, St. Thomas Aquinas at length treats this question, and he concludes:

I answer that, All confess that God is omnipotent; but it seems difficult to explain in what His omnipotence precisely consists: for there may be doubt as to the precise meaning of the word ‘all’ when we say that God can do all things. If, however, we consider the matter aright, since power is said in reference to possible things, this phrase, “God can do all things,” is rightly understood to mean that God can do all things that are possible; and for this reason He is said to be omnipotent.

newadvent.org/summa/1025.htm#article3 (Emphasis added).

It is not possible for God to engage in a contradiction. He is not able to engage in something that is not true, whether it be a creative act or otherwise. So there are some things that are impossible to God.

 

[nemesis001]

We Believe that everything is possible to God, but is it philosophically possible to say? Can our God be bad? Never. Can he do evil (unless we hold on to the principle of St. Thomas that evil is the privation of good)? No. Can he be nothing? No. Can he be created? No. Can there be someone equal to God? No. Or at least, can he lie (because he is truth himself) ? no. … That means there are certain things (which goes against the very nature of God) which are somehow impossible to God. Am I right? I am sorry if it is only a foolish question, because I am just a beginner in the field of Philosophy, but I hope for a satisfactory answer.

My take on it is that a contradictorily defined “thing” is not really a thing at all. The inherently contradictory definition is nothing more or less than a nonsense word string. For the same reason that “dgshoihksdas” is not an English word, “square circle” does not name a thing.

So God can indeed do anything, but,

“make a square circle,”
“create a rock impossible for omnipotent power to move,”
“fail, as the fundamental principle of all existence, to exist,”

are not “things,” per se, but rather nonsensical word strings masquerading as things.

 

[nemesis001]

Regarding God’s perspective, Bob and others:

Time does not exist. Quantum Physics has “proven” this. It is an illusion necessary to creation. Everything happens at once, it is not linear. The end is the same as the beginning. God is outside of “time”. He sees, He knows, it is not a prediction, it is His nature, outside of time/creation. This is one reason why we are totally unable to comprehend this, because we are creatures, we are part of “time”. I’ve thought for my lifetime that science would catch up with faith and it is, quite unwillingly, I might add. Non-local consciousness is real. I have experienced it throughout my life. It has also been proven, in the laboratory. This is part of God, in some way. So precognition is having availability (openness, if you will) to that which is available to us anyway. It isn’t in the manner of predicting such as is done by so-called psychics. It’s on a much deeper level, hard to explain: it’s a soul level. I just know things and, often, I don’t realize I knew it until it has come to pass. I’m not trying to, it happens, a lot. I have been prepared, also, by God. Think about this: when you look back on your life, doesn’t it appear to have gone by in the blink of an eye? Because it has. It is. It always will. And one thing you, Bob, said that rings so true to me: “WILLING”. Yes. One can do harm without intention, or one can do harm knowingly, and for whatever reason just not care. I think there’s an enormous difference. Being outside of Time, God is able to see it all, at once. Thank you for sharing, wonderful anecdotes. I absolutely love sharing this way with people who know God and who are known by Him.

If time does not exist, then music is categorically impossible.

Music does exist. Ergo, time is real.

Next!

 

[nemesis001]

Hi Pugsly,

This is a little point, but it may help you.

The devils(bad angels) cannot touch our will. All they may do is tempt, which means project or recall images and thoughts to our thought and imagination processes. They may also, but rarely, influence the body in some ways. BUT…within the limits that God sets for them.

Also our angels can remind us and tell us about good holy things to counteract them, as well as the Holy Spirit. And our prayers as well also limit their activities.

So they are never left to freely do anything to our will, and are always within bounds that God sets for them when they are dealing with our intellect.

Just some thoughts.

Sorry to have to break it to you, fred, but, possession is a real happening. Demons do sometimes possess human wills. God allows it for whatever reasons He has for allowing it.

 

[CJeplin]

This might seem like I’m not answering your question at first, but please just humor me for a couple of paragraphs. It should all sound applicable in the end.

When I was 30 years old it was discovered that I have one of the highest recorded IQs according to several tests (which are very boring, if you ask me, and which I took repeatedly for the next few years at the interest of psychologists–but uggh, never again).

Now I personally don’t believe that I have a higher “intelligence” than the average person, and I think that tests like these aren’t always fair to those who may come from other cultures and use different logical formulae or approaches to reason. I may have a different capacity for using what I learn as well as a problem-solving technique that is quite out-of-the-box when compared to others, but any real differences from the average person? None but one, and this is what I’ve learned from talking with my fellow “high IQers” – it’s all about “impossibility.”

You see, in the most basic terms the real difference between a so-called genius and the average Joe is that the “genius” doesn’t see obstacles as obstacles. Obstacles are just problems yet to be solved. Unlike those silly science-fiction space captains that are always surprised when the enemy’s torpedo get’s through (“How did they manage that? It’s impossible to penetrate our shields!”), the truth of the matter is that nothing is impossible.

You may not believe that, but it’s true. The only things that are impossible are things we can’t conceive. If you and I can conceive something, it is possible. We might not be able to do what we conceive right now, but we can’t conceive anything that can’t be possible. Fiction always becomes fact.

And that’s the real difference between the way a so-called genius sees the world and the average thinker. Doesn’t make a genius better or smarter or more intelligent. It just means that obstacles to getting things done get moved out of the way. People often say they weren’t able to this or that because of some obstacle when in reality it was because they couldn’t see a way around an obstacle. “It was impossible to overcome!”

Impossible is kind of an illusion. All those people who died when the Titanic hit an iceberg wouldn’t have had the ship’s builders realized that sinking wasn’t impossible. Anything is possible, even something you think is impossible.

How does this answer your question? Simple. Impossible is only impossible if you perceive it as such. One person’s impossibility is not another man’s impossibility, Most people see obstacles where another sees only possibilities.

Now that is just with people. Apply this to a Higher Being, to God. Unless you are God, you have no idea how God sees things. Does God have any obstacles? Does God come across things that stop him from achieving things? Just because God chooses to be good instead of evil, tell the truth instead of lie, this doesn’t make God incapable of evil or lying. It may be said to be an impossibility for God to act a certain way because God chooses never to break his own rules, but this doesn’t mean God isn’t almighty. God can do whatever God wants to. If he couldn’t, he would be God. And he is benevolent not because he is incapable of being evil. God is benevolent because God chooses to be. That’s how benevolent and almighty he is, and that’s saying a lot.

What qualifies as impossible for God would depend on God. You will have to ask him. Just as you can’t know for sure what will or what will not stump me or anyone else with a reasoning mind, regardless of so-called IQ, you cannot know for sure what God can or cannot do unless you are God–that is without asking.

And it’s not impossible to know if anything is impossible for God. You can just think about what I wrote for a moment or ask God when you see him. Sooner or later you will get your answer, I promise you.

 

[ellzeena]

I fall into your category also. I intuitively know that I can’t comprehend the mind of Einstein because I don’t have his mind; I know that others can’t comprehend mine, because they are not so equipped. And on it goes. I know that we cannot comprehend the interior life of any other species, no matter how much we believe that we can, or have. So how can we even begin to comprehend God…now that IS “impossible”. I compare us to the mouse on the space station. He got there somehow, he knows his way around, he knows where the food is and what places to avoid at what time(s) in order to stay away from “those” that are large and scary to him; he has no concept of space except for his own territory; he has no idea what a space station truly is, although he has a concept; he could never build a space station, nor could he comprehend the entities who have built one. And its purpose…well, that is beyond his ability even when stretched to its limits.

I “see” things that happened forty years or more ago as if they are there, in front of me, now. My memory is such that I can find a place in a book just by thinking of the approximate location in the book and on the page. Every lemon becomes fruit for the lemonade. I can solve the most intricate problem (ordinary problem) quite easily. But one thing I cannot do, and what I have been attempting to do my entire life (from very early childhood), is understand God. What does He want; what’s it all about, Alfie? It’s a frustrating limitation but I can hear Him laughing, out of tender love not scorn. There has not been one human being (I do not count Jesus among these because of His true nature) that has, does, or will understand God. All we can do is try to discern His will for us and then try to achieve it. And that doesn’t mean reading tons of esoteric material (although I have!), it means being open to the Holy Spirit who DOES speak to each one of us, every single day.

 

[tdgesq]

What qualifies as impossible for God would depend on God. You will have to ask him. Just as you can’t know for sure what will or what will not stump me or anyone else with a reasoning mind, regardless of so-called IQ, you cannot know for sure what God can or cannot do unless you are God–that is without asking.

There is something very beautiful about your comments, and I thank you for them. I just quoted the one part because I think it sums up nicely what you are describing. I.Q. relative to God, even one as high as yours (and certainly one as low as mine), is infinitesimally small compared to God’s. Despite that, God has revealed certain things about himself through the Church. And it has been fairly clear that it isn’t in the business of casually discovering God’s limits, if there be any. For the most part, it has been content with professing that God is omnipotent - he is Almighty.

I am also content with that formula; until a challenge to the faith requires an answer. The unfortunate practical reality is that God’s omnipotence has been challenged in both the ancient Church and on this forum. You see threads from time to time that claim omnipotence is incoherent, generally presented as a requirement that God be able to do something logically impossible. So things like, can God lie even though he is truth? Can God cease to exist even though he is eternal? Can God be not be omnipotent even though he is almighty?

And so the Church has infallibly declared that “God cannot deny himself, nor can truth ever be in opposition to truth,” among other things. With our limited intellects we interpret that to mean that there are some things that God cannot do, and there appears to be little more we can conclude if we are to stay in the realm of “rational” discourse that the opposition can accept. I believe there are answers even to these challenges though.

I look to the Church and her saints to try and answer these things, and mostly to Aquinas. A lie is really a lack of truth, as is a contradiction. It is an imperfection and a lack of being in a sense. And so it hasn’t concerned me in a very long time that God may not be able to lie or to violate the law of non-contradiction. A god that lacks perfection is not our God.

Ultimately you are right though - we won’t fully understand what is truly impossible for God until we see him.