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prayerwarrior17
Guest
is there really a purgatory? is it stated in the Bible?
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FCEGM
Guest
Yes, there really is a purgatory. These articles will help you see the biblical basis for the Catholic teaching:
catholic.com/thisrock/2005/0511sbs.asp
catholic.com/library/purgatory.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9711word.asp
With this and other questions you have, a feature you should learn to use on CAF is the links to the “Library” and “ThisRock” which you will see at the very top of the page. You can do a search for specific topics that are of concern to you.
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Dicerning
Guest
Is there really a Trinity? Is it stated in the bible?
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Tantum_ergo
Guest
Yes, there is.
Yes, it is implitcitly stated in Scripture.
One must also remember that:
A. Not everything Jesus said and did and taught is contained in Scripture (this is noted in the gospel of St. John).
B. The Holy Spirit was promised to lead us to all truth. If ‘all truth’ were already contained in any given thing, such as the Scripture, how could the Spirit ‘lead’? Surely, if the Bible were meant to contain all truth explicitly, not only would Christ have told us, He would have told His followers to establish a Bible, not a Church, and He would have noted, in Scripture, that all authority was contained in Scripture. He did not. Rather, Scripture tells us that the pillar and foundation of truth is not Scripture itself, but the Church.
C. Remember that Scripture itself tells us that nothing unclean/sinful may enter heaven. While the man-made recent Protestant teaching that Christ’s sacrifice ‘whitewashed’ our sins and thus we are ‘free’ to enter heaven is often touted as nullifying the need for purgatory, this fails to take into account the scriptural teaching of Malachi regarding the refiner’s fire, the New Testament teaching that those will be saved as through fire, the admonition to the apostles about binding and loosing, St. Paul’s exhortations about bringing people to the church to be reconciled, St. John’s words about sin which leads to death, etc. It further ignores the consistent Catholic teaching of 2000 years in which purgatory is authoratively taught.
IOW, there was no time when the Church taught that there was ‘no’ purgatory, and that Christ ‘whitewashed sins’, and then at point A (usually given as either "Constantine’ or ‘during the middle ages’) the Church went FROM teaching ‘no purgatory’ to suddenly insisting on purgatory, and the ‘brave bold reformers’ were just RESTORING the ORIGINAL teaching because of the bad corrupt Catholic Church’s errors.
Far from it. It was men who had many vested interests in denying the Church who came up with their own MAN-MADE teachings like ‘no purgatory’ and who are thus teaching a DIFFERENT GOSPEL from the one St. Paul and all Christians have taught.
Challenge those who speak against the Church to prove that ‘no purgatory’ is authentic apostolic teaching. They won’t be able to, any more than any of their other teachings. They’ll try to argue from a negative, "Yes, it was taught but the Church repressed it’ or ‘the BIBLE says so but the Church kept people from the Bible’ or a host of other antiCatholic whoppers. But they’ll never be able to show you any real documented proof that ‘their teaching’ existed first. . . all they can CLAIM is that it was either repressed or distorted, but the proof is there that the teachings about purgatory existed, and existed as authentic teaching, and existed well before the new, man-made ‘whitewash claim’.
Check out the CA Library for “antiCatholic whoppers”, and also the articles about purgatory. They’ll help.
God bless you. Don’t let your faith be shaken. As St. Peter in his second letter tells us, “Resist, solid in your faith.” Resist the lions who are seeking to tear your faith down. Trust in Christ and His Church. He never will allow the just to stumble.
Yes, it is implitcitly stated in Scripture.
One must also remember that:
A. Not everything Jesus said and did and taught is contained in Scripture (this is noted in the gospel of St. John).
B. The Holy Spirit was promised to lead us to all truth. If ‘all truth’ were already contained in any given thing, such as the Scripture, how could the Spirit ‘lead’? Surely, if the Bible were meant to contain all truth explicitly, not only would Christ have told us, He would have told His followers to establish a Bible, not a Church, and He would have noted, in Scripture, that all authority was contained in Scripture. He did not. Rather, Scripture tells us that the pillar and foundation of truth is not Scripture itself, but the Church.
C. Remember that Scripture itself tells us that nothing unclean/sinful may enter heaven. While the man-made recent Protestant teaching that Christ’s sacrifice ‘whitewashed’ our sins and thus we are ‘free’ to enter heaven is often touted as nullifying the need for purgatory, this fails to take into account the scriptural teaching of Malachi regarding the refiner’s fire, the New Testament teaching that those will be saved as through fire, the admonition to the apostles about binding and loosing, St. Paul’s exhortations about bringing people to the church to be reconciled, St. John’s words about sin which leads to death, etc. It further ignores the consistent Catholic teaching of 2000 years in which purgatory is authoratively taught.
IOW, there was no time when the Church taught that there was ‘no’ purgatory, and that Christ ‘whitewashed sins’, and then at point A (usually given as either "Constantine’ or ‘during the middle ages’) the Church went FROM teaching ‘no purgatory’ to suddenly insisting on purgatory, and the ‘brave bold reformers’ were just RESTORING the ORIGINAL teaching because of the bad corrupt Catholic Church’s errors.
Far from it. It was men who had many vested interests in denying the Church who came up with their own MAN-MADE teachings like ‘no purgatory’ and who are thus teaching a DIFFERENT GOSPEL from the one St. Paul and all Christians have taught.
Challenge those who speak against the Church to prove that ‘no purgatory’ is authentic apostolic teaching. They won’t be able to, any more than any of their other teachings. They’ll try to argue from a negative, "Yes, it was taught but the Church repressed it’ or ‘the BIBLE says so but the Church kept people from the Bible’ or a host of other antiCatholic whoppers. But they’ll never be able to show you any real documented proof that ‘their teaching’ existed first. . . all they can CLAIM is that it was either repressed or distorted, but the proof is there that the teachings about purgatory existed, and existed as authentic teaching, and existed well before the new, man-made ‘whitewash claim’.
Check out the CA Library for “antiCatholic whoppers”, and also the articles about purgatory. They’ll help.
God bless you. Don’t let your faith be shaken. As St. Peter in his second letter tells us, “Resist, solid in your faith.” Resist the lions who are seeking to tear your faith down. Trust in Christ and His Church. He never will allow the just to stumble.
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VociMike
Guest
What do you think is wrong with the concept of Purgatory?
And where did you ever learn that something must be “stated in the Bible” (whatever that might mean) to be part of the Christian faith?
J
Joe_Kelley
Guest
Matthew 5:23-29
What is the jail referred to here? Some will maintain it is civil court, However, I find it hard to believe that Jesus inserted advice on secular law between instructions on offerings at the altar and the danger of hell.
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Philomena
Guest
PrayerWarrior,
Why don’t you just come out and tell us the truth? You’re not Catholic and you aren’t as ‘confused’ as you have called yourself in all of your threads that you started in the past couple of days in all of the forums.
If you want to discuss these issues, please be honest about your motives.
God Bless you and your journey to Truth.
Why don’t you just come out and tell us the truth? You’re not Catholic and you aren’t as ‘confused’ as you have called yourself in all of your threads that you started in the past couple of days in all of the forums.
If you want to discuss these issues, please be honest about your motives.
God Bless you and your journey to Truth.
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Philthy
Guest
Hello Friend!
Is there really a New Testament? If so, how do you know?
Dont think of Purgatory as a place - that is a mistake. Think of Purgatory as a process: the process of detaching from our self centeredness to a completely God centeredness. This is known as the “holiness without which no one shall see Heaven”. Getting back down to earth somewhat, Purgatory is the process by which we are prepared to face God unveiled. It is not merely our mortal bodies which prevent us from being in God’s presence without being consumed - it is what “comes out from within us” which cannot bear the unveiled presence of God. Purgatory is the process by which we are finally and completely made perfect to be in God’s presence and to rest eternally basquing in His Glory. And don’t worry - this doesnt mean Christs passion, death and resurrection were insufficient, it is part of the same glorious achievement he achieved on Calvary.
To Him be the glory now and forever!
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grannymh
Guest
Good afternoon prayerwarrior 17
Please double check my reference. I believe the rational for purgatory is in Maccabees, As I recall, prayers were being offered for fallen soldiers who had strayed from Jewish law. This implied that these men were someplace where prayers could help them. Purgatory became the name of this place of transition.
The difficulty is that Maccabees is no longer in the Protestant bible.
Personally, it seemed to me that the parables which included a proper wedding garment would imply that one needed “something” to help them enter heaven. To me this is common sense.
Because of your encouragement, I did post “Can the Eucharist be understood through means other than scripture dueling?” in Apologetics. Thank you.
Blessings,
grannymh
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prayerwarrior17
Guest
based on your words you are judging me…your showing the truth that you really cant help me…if you dont want to answer me…just dont post…why are you stumble?if you are really a good catholic christian you will not be stumble in my lot of question… instead of
helping me you make me so weak…why is it bad to ask the question that confusing me?..no offence…sorry for my questions…GOD BLESS…
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thistle
Guest
Don’t be too hard on Philomena. Its just that we get so many people coming to the forums pretending to be Catholics and asking things which would indicate they are not actually Catholic and they are really trying to bait us. I also looked at your other threads and posts and certainly find your questions strange because a Catholic would be expected to know the answers to the questions you are asking.
Are you young and still not properly educated in the Catholic faith?
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grannymh
Guest
BIG question Thistle,
I’m new. What things would indicate that someone is not actually Catholic?
Blessings,
grannymh
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VociMike
Guest
A big giveaway is when all the objections (or “questions”) are the standard Protestant objections to Catholicism. You can spot these in a New York minute, compared to all the other legitimate questions a person could have about the Catholic faith. And the OP’s various questions fit directly in the “standard objections” camp. So either she’s(?) not Catholic, or some non-Catholics have been feeding her the standard (and long-answered) errors regarding Catholicism, and she didn’t know enough to refute them.
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CentralFLJames
Guest
There are quite a few references in the bible that allude to purgatory. But you also need to know that the Protestant version of the bible tossed out the deuterocanonical books of the OT since their agenda was to remove purgatory from the teachings and invent a new secular based theology where The Church had no authority or power over them. So you need to use a good Catholic Bible that has the full 73 books of the cannon.
But an even better way to know what the apostles taught and what the early church believed is to go to the many writings of the early church fathers who all mention the need to pray for those in purgatory etc.
Here are just a few of the many bible references that infer purgatory and make an exegesis of it quite easy - especially when taken in light of the actual practices of the early church and their traditions:
Matt. 5:26,18:34,Luke 12:58-59, Matt. 5:48, Matt. 12:32,Luke 12:47-48, Luke 16:19-31, 1 Cor. 15:29-30, 2 Macc. 12:44-45, Phil. 2:10 - 2 Tim. 1:16-18, Heb. 12:14 - Heb. 12:23 - 1 Peter 3:19; 4:6, Gen. 50:10; Num. 20:29; Deut. 34:8 - Baruch 3:4 - Zech. 9:11
Here is another good reference link:
scripturecatholic.com/purgatory.html
James
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Church_Militant
Guest
Along with all the other good responses you have received, I would add the following link to an article that I wrote on my Catholic blog.
Biblical and Jewish Traditional Beliefs About Purgatory
Biblical and Jewish Traditional Beliefs About Purgatory
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Lukelion
Guest
If we are not to judge, why does God give us the gift of discernment? Are you perhaps Evangelical(Pentecostal)?
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RosaryFan
Guest
Gee, I sure hope so! Not many are worthy to be in the presence of Almighty God when they die…
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mark_a
Guest
Your blog is awesome!!
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grannymh
Guest
Me, too, hopes so. I know I have a place reserved in Purgatory and I’m not giving up that seat for anybody!Gee, I sure hope so! Not many are worthy to be in the presence of Almighty God when they die…
Blessings,
grannymh
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prayerwarrior17
Guest
im 20 yrs old…im from philippines…me & my family are catholics…i understand why some questioned my treads…i know my threads are so strange…they tell me i am catholic and i should know the answer…honestly, i have a lack of knowledge about catholic teaching…i attend church evey sunday but still i have a lot of question to ask… i want to ask somebody but im afraid if they will get mad at me…i know theres a lot of people like me now…confusing about the thruth…i have friends who are non catholics…but they are good christians like us…it just that they have some teaching that are not the same with our teaching…i read bible but im so disperate to know the real word of GOD…we have the same GOD but we have conflicts in other part of the teaching…sometimes i think i dont like to be involve in any religions anymore coz there many religions now…same christian …same bible but have deferrent interpretation…i want to hear the truth…pls pray for me…i dont know where i should believe i want to focus on GOD…upon reading all posted answer in my threads its really help me to understand it… i have some knowledge about our teaching but my my knowledge is not enough to defend our religion…4 me theres nothing wrong about our religion but 4 them there is…pray 4 me to just focus of whats GOD want…i believe we cant be save by religion…we will be save if we follow GOD rules… sorry 4 late responces… but still have a lot of question cant we just be united to praise GOD?why many are arguing about it?..THANK YOU…GOD BLESS…
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