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napad
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Catholic can’t believe that :nope: .
And none on this thread ever wrote that from what I read
It is a heresy Donotist–I think.
BTW are you even interested in the truth of this question ?
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And none on this thread ever wrote that from what I read
It is a heresy Donotist–I think.
BTW are you even interested in the truth of this question ?
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napad
Guest
I know people who are doing great things inspiring people with Amway or any other thing you can think of. It doesn’t prove anything divine, other than people get inspired by many things. And more people have been inspired by the Catholic Church than any other Christian Church. (over a billion Catholics now) Does that prove the Catholic Church is right?
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ron77nyc
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I’m not speaking for every non-Catholic, just the people I know of who preach the gospel, feed the poor and worship. God gives them the Holy Spirit to aid them in doing His will just as He does with Catholics who do His will.
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JJJ4Eva
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All I can say to all of you is that God isn’t Catholic, thus He has an open mind about who enters Heaven - Those who His Son has suffered for, they enter Heaven, and that’s every one save for the ones that have broken His Commandments. They still stand you know?
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ron77nyc
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Then we all agree.:tiphat:Catholic can’t believe that :nope: .
And none on this thread ever wrote that from what I read
It is a heresy Donotist–I think.
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ron77nyc
Guest
Then we all agree.:tiphat:Catholic can’t believe that :nope: .
And none on this thread ever wrote that from what I read
It is a heresy Donotist–I think.
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ShellKell
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Danno2281
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If you’re not trying to pick a fight, you might be in the wrong place for not picking one. That statement is not a particularly acceptable one here, but be prayerful and, hey, you never know!
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Danno2281
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At the top right is a list of pages. Simply go back to 1, and continue. From a post on pg 2:
Not true. Fr. Feeney was not excommunicated not for heresy, but for disobedience (although the excommunication did not give any specification of the charge).
The Council of Florence, wherein the Greeks were restored to unity (sadly for only a short time) declared, and Eugene IV (Pope at the time) declared in the bull Cantate Domino:The most Holy Roman Catholic Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews, and heretics, and schismatics can ever be partakers of eteral life, but they are to go into the eternal fire “which was prepared for the devil and his angels” (Mt:25,41) unless before death they are joined with Her, and so important is the unity of this eclesiastical body that only those remaining within this unity can profit from the sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and that they alone can receive an eternal recompense fo their fasts, almsdeeds, and other works of Christian piety and duties of a Christian soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved unless they abide within the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church.
We must further remember what the first Vatican Council declared: that any defined truth means by its terms only what was meant by those who formulated it, in other words, the Catholic Church in this context means exactly what Pope Eugene IV understood by it and nothing else.
This position is often called “triumphalism.” It hs frequently been impugned, but it has never been condemned.
What is relevant is that God may IN WAYS ABSOLUTELY UNKNOWN TO US bring certain souls into the Church before their souls leave their bodies, and this miracle of grace may happen far more frequently (or rarely) than we suppose.
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paul_c
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Do you have anything to back up your beliefs or is just an unsupported individual opinion?
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paul_c
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Well, as a Catholic you would know that the first step into achieving eternal life is to be cleansed of original sin through baptism. We do acknowledge the validity of baptism, though for those outside the church who baptize in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Now if someone did that and was able to live the rest of their lives without mortal sin, then yes the Church would teach that they died in the state of Grace and would be rewarded with eternal life. .
The first problem for the non-Catholic is the ability to interpret the will of God so they know how to avoid sin. Although the 10 commandments are known to all, the interpretation of what they mean is not so clear cut at times. Take the 5th commandment: Is abortion killing? Some non-Catholics faiths teach that it is not and hence, a non-Catholic could be deceived into sinning. What about the 3rd commandment: Keep the Lord’s Day holy. Does that mean you have to attend Mass? We teach that it does.
The second problem for the non-Catholic is that if they did sin and lost their sanctifying grace, they would have no re-course to reclaiming that Grace, because that comes through the sacrament of reconciliation which is administered by the Catholic Church.
Granted, God can do anything he wants but those of Catholic Faith must believe that he gave the truth of the matter to the Church and that it is reliable in passing it on.
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ShellKell
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Maybe the same as you “just an unsupported individual opinion”
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paul_c
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The reason I asked was if you had some reasoning being the opinion that there is no salvation within the Catholic church, we could actually discuss it and see where the truth lies. As it is, there are 23 pages of posts here, most with detailed references and most supporting the Catholic position that Slavation comes from the Catholic church, recognizing that some non-catholics will be saved through the teachings and action of the church. There’s not much point in recapitulating those discussions unless you have something more to bring to the table than a simple, imflammatory statement.
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Ralph_Macdonald
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Ralph_Macdonald
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Why do Catholics continue to follow mans teaching instead of “the word of God” (the Bible). God has left His word so we will not go astray, that is all we need. Salvation is for anyone who comes to God through Jesus Christ, repents of their sins,and receives Him as their Lord an Savior. My Bible says who soever will may come. We will be judged by the word (the bible) in the end, not by what the church (man) teaches. Read Ephesians Chapter 2 verses 8-9. I know Christ as my personal Savior. Ralph
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Danno2281
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We begin with the truth that Jesus gave us: “Who hears you hears Me, who rejects you rejects Me…”(Lk:10,16) Trusting Jesus to have told the truth, they are not merely men, but spokesmen for Jesus, the same Jesus Who clearly said, “Unless a man be born again of water and of the Spirit**** he cannot enter the kingdom of God” (Jn:3, 3)
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paul_c
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Ralph,
Your bible is correct. Whoever will may come. The Catholic church is open to anyone who wants to enter.
And whether you recognize it or not, if you enter heaven through the bible, you most assuredly have entered thanks to the Holy Catholic church, whose inspired members wrote the books of the New Testament and whose hierarchy, also under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, defined the canon. Had it not been for the Catholic Church, there would be no bible for you to follow.
The Catholic Church offers two major advantages to its members that they can get no where else. First of all, the church has the full deposit of Faith from the apostles, passed down through the generations. This provides the proper interpretations of the bible and augments it with the apostolic tradition that was not contained within the 27 books of the new testament. This is extremely important in understand God;s will from man and therefore to avoid sin. The Second benefit is that the Church provides the sacraments in Christ’s name that provide the graces necessary to be saved. This includes baptism, the real presence in the eucharist, and of course, the sacrament of reconciliation, which makes allows the sinner to return to grace.
And by the way, Its is very strange that “bible protestants” think that the Ephesian 2 8-9 are somehow condemnations of the Catholic position, This just shows how little they understand about the Catholic position or the proper interpretation of the bible.
Here it is :
Let me explain how this fits within the Catholic sotierology.
For Catholics, Jesus’ sacrifice provides initial justification upon Baptism into the Faith. What this means is that the effects of original sin are washed clean. This is done completely without any merit by men and is a complete gift on the part of Jesus for all men that are baptized. So you can see how this fits with Ephesians 2:8-9.
Now for Catholics, if you were to die immediately after baptism, you would die in the state of Grace and be saved. In fact, until you fall from grace by turning away from God through sin, this remains the situation. Unfortunately, man does sin. Fortunately, God is merciful and has provided forgiveness of Sin aand the ability to regain grace through the sacrament of reconciliation. To be reconciled, an individual needs to be contrite, confess, be repetent and do penance. For the Catholic, in net, life is a journey toward holiness that can only be demonstated with works of love. If we end live in a State of Grace, we will be saved…
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napad
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I think your kinda off subject though it should be addressed but probably better on another thread for example: **How do you know the Bible is the word of God?
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napad
Guest
summary points
The only Church of Christ is the Catholicpost 55
Holding the Catholic Faith (after the age of reason) and Baptism is necessary for salvation.
post 140 post 8
At least two relatively new religious communities are approved with this position post 19
The opposition to the above position is that Baptism isn’t necessary for salvation and neither is Faith in Jesus Christ has be come a popular theory. They say "One only needs to follow one’s conscience and have invincible ignorance post 85
That the Catechism of the Catholic Church has contradictions on this subject.post 237
That Pope Benedict-- when he was Cardinal Ratzinger-- considers holding a strict understanding of no salvation without baptism an acceptable position for a Catholic.post 322
Newman’s development of doctrine theory is wrong post 83
conclusion:
Those who hold strict understanding of no salvation are Catholics in good standing and not heretics
The only Church of Christ is the Catholicpost 55
Holding the Catholic Faith (after the age of reason) and Baptism is necessary for salvation.
post 140 post 8
At least two relatively new religious communities are approved with this position post 19
The opposition to the above position is that Baptism isn’t necessary for salvation and neither is Faith in Jesus Christ has be come a popular theory. They say "One only needs to follow one’s conscience and have invincible ignorance post 85
That the Catechism of the Catholic Church has contradictions on this subject.post 237
That Pope Benedict-- when he was Cardinal Ratzinger-- considers holding a strict understanding of no salvation without baptism an acceptable position for a Catholic.post 322
Newman’s development of doctrine theory is wrong post 83
conclusion:
Those who hold strict understanding of no salvation are Catholics in good standing and not heretics
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Danno2281
Guest
Need more be said? Time for a new thread.
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