Is this Jesus painting pornographic? [MSNBC]

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One of the featured videos at MSNBC
today:

msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/36534984#36534984

Entitled “Is this Jesus painting pornographic”?

St. Charles Borromeo is the parish, Arch. of Oklahoma City.

Me, I am not one to go out and make waves via the media, instead of following proper channels.

But has anyone seen this? Is there a grain of truth to their complaint?
Actually, no… Even if Jesus’s genitailia are “exposed”, it wouldn’t be the first time such a crusifix was created. The idea behind it is to show the poverty of Christ, his humility in his final days here on earth.

This is just another report which, no doubt, is designed to link in peoples minds with the sexual abuse crisis.

Edit
Wow, thanks to another poster for linking to pictures of the crusifix. What a lame report.
 
I will continue to take the alternate view. There is a distinct difference in the image on these links:

shrinesf.org/francis11.htm
monasteryicons.com/monasteryicons/Item_San-Damiano-Crucifix_207_ps_srm.html

And the picture under dispute:

newsok.com/controversial-crucifix-creates-rift-at-warr-acres-church/article/3453833?custom_click=masthead_topten

It seems very obvious that the artist who did the modern day interpretation intentionally modified the abdomen muscle depiction in order to make it appear as genitalia. It is wrong.
 
Tempest in a teapot here? Or is there more than just a fight over an icon?

A local religious icon artist, Janet Jaime, rendered this updated image of the San Damiano crucifix, subject of this “newsworthy” piece. Yes, it’s a variation on the tradition of said image. No comments from the artist, as yet. However, it appears that Fr. Seeton, the pastor of the church where the image hangs, knows a thing or two about iconography rules on creation and use.

See today’s post on subject at

getreligion.org/

You have to scroll to the middle part of the page.

Someone can strongly suggest that the cavity and rise of the abdomen are meant to be something else. But I do not see the depiction of the our Lord’s distended abdomen as appearing like genitalia. To say that the artist intentionally changed the depiction of the abdomen to make it appear like genitalia?

As for the two parishioners who left the parish, would reasonable well-grounded Catholics leave over something like this? :confused:
 
One of the featured videos at MSNBC
today:

msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/36534984#36534984

Entitled “Is this Jesus painting pornographic”?

St. Charles Borromeo is the parish, Arch. of Oklahoma City.

Me, I am not one to go out and make waves via the media, instead of following proper channels.

But has anyone seen this? Is there a grain of truth to their complaint?
Can’t tell from the first video because of the blank out, but the second video shows clearly that this is a standard-issue San Damiano Cross, just like the one I have here on my wall at home and on my desk at work except clearer.

In fact, I just took a good, good look at the icon I have in my house. I can see how one could construe some of the detail to look like a penis, but it’s really illogical. First, why in the world would a medieval artist paint a penis on the corpus of a crucifix after painting a very tasteful loincloth to cover the private parts? Second, the size of the alleged “part” is so large (if it’s an erect penis, it would have to measure several feet in length and more than foot in circumference) that it would have been a serious deformity making Christ physically unable to walk. Fact is, it’s just details of His abs (more like a two-pack – it looks like a circle with a line drawn vertically down the middle and a little circle at the top of the line where it intersects with the circle) just above the loincloth and the outline of the bottom of His ribcage above that.

Of course, people will see what they want to see.
 
Now that being said, a nude representation would not be out of line historically, as the Romans often crucified in the nude, both to accelerate death by exposure as well as to add that little extra bit of humiliation to the victim.
Eric Gill sculpted the Stations of the Cross in London’s Westminster Cathedral somewhere in the early 1900’s. In the 12th station the crucified Jesus is naked and his private parts exposed. Circumcised, too, IAW the Law. I believe that recently some old biddies, male and female, wanted it changed.
 
dude, it’s his abdomen.

if you’re gazing at the image of Christ dying for us on the cross, and all you can think about is the detail of His abdomen which may appear phallic to some, you’re focusing on the wrong thing.
It should appear as phallic to all.

It’s about the worst possible drawing a person could ever make of an abdomen.
 
:eek:

"Churchgoers Reportedly Outraged by Crucifix They Say Shows Jesus’ Genitalia

Churchgoers in Oklahoma are reportedly outraged over a crucifix in a Catholic church that they say shows an image of genitalia on Jesus.

The crucifix, which hangs above the church’s main altar, has caused a deep divide among parishioners at St. Charles Borromeo Catholic Church, NewsOk.com reports."…

Entire article here: foxnews.com/us/2010/04/16/churchgoers-reportedly-outraged-crucifix-say-shows-jesus-genitalia/?test=latestnews
 
An excerpt and link to related article follows below.

Hmm. This looks like a stylized piece of art to me, though I can see the, er, problem area. I do admit to being a bit puzzled by the area that looks like, um, the area that looks like a baby’s bottom. Why is it there? To represent a distended abdomen? With that being said, if I were a parishioner, I wonder if I would have noticed anything if it hadn’t been pointed out with this controversy.

"Controversial crucifix creates rift at Warr Acres church
Some parishioners say icon is obscene

WARR ACRES — Churchgoers are outraged over a crucifix in a Catholic church that they say shows an image of genitalia on Jesus. "…

Entire article here: newsok.com/warr-acres-catholic-church-has-crucifix-some-say-shows-exposed-genitals-of-jesus/article/3453833?custom_click=rss
 
Seems like a good idea to me. The artist can improve her work and fix the overly stylized areas causing the problem.

"To end Warr Acres church controversy, artist will modify crucifix
Parishioners say they welcome the changes

WARR ACRES — The local artist who designed a crucifix some say shows genitalia on Jesus plans to modify the piece in effort to end the controversy it has caused.

Janet Jaime, an Oklahoma City iconographer, came under fire for a crucifix she designed that since February has been above the main altar at St. Charles Borromeo Catholic Church in Warr Acres.

Church officials now plan to remove the crucifix so Jaime can modify it.

At issue is Jesus’ abdominal area, which some say looks like a large penis.

The church’s pastor released a statement to parishioners Friday announcing the crucifix would be modified.

"It certainly is not the intention of the artist or myself that the cross of Jesus Christ be a source of division or result in disrespectful statements,” the Rev. Philip Seeton wrote.

Parishioners welcome the news."…

Entire article Here: newsok.com/to-end-warr-acres-church-controversy-artist-will-modify-crucifix/article/3454703
 
This painting and its impact seems to have begun again in the Traditional Catholicism forum.:confused:
 
The perspective applied to the abdomen to create a distended appearance is foreign to the rest of the figure. That means the middle and upper torso is straighter than the abdominal muscles attached to it. It’s also too narrow compared to the upper torso.

Often, student artist miss the negative spaces in their work. To their embarassement sometimes if the psychological concepts attached to Rorschach tests are part of a critque.

As an artist myself I would have noticed the negative space created by these errors of perspective and proportion.:confused: :eek:
 
The perspective applied to the abdomen to create a distended appearance is foreign to the rest of the figure. That means the middle and upper torso is straighter than the abdominal muscles attached to it. It’s also too narrow compared to the upper torso.

Often, student artist miss the negative spaces in their work. To their embarassement sometimes if the psychological concepts attached to Rorschach tests are part of a critque.

As an artist myself I would have noticed the negative space created by these errors of perspective and proportion.:confused: :eek:
I have no background in art, so you lost me with some of your post.😊

All I know for sure is that in looking at the work now, I cannot help but see what offended some. Now that it has been pointed out, I cannot not see it, though I don’t know for sure if I would have noticed it before. Maybe I would have, though. Anyway, part of the problem is the bulbous-looking area right above the loincloth that I suppose is meant to be the abdomen. The area above it seems reasonable as a ribcage and breastbone. That which is meant to be the abdomen just doesn’t work, though.

I think it is a good idea that the artist is going to make changes to her work. That should take care of the controversy.
 
I have no background in art, so you lost me with some of your post.😊

All I know for sure is that in looking at the work now, I cannot help but see what offended some. Now that it has been pointed out, I cannot not see it, though I don’t know for sure if I would have noticed it before. Maybe I would have, though. Anyway, part of the problem is the bulbous-looking area right above the loincloth that I suppose is meant to be the abdomen. The area above it seems reasonable as a ribcage and breastbone. That which is meant to be the abdomen just doesn’t work, though.

I think it is a good idea that the artist is going to make changes to her work. That should take care of the controversy.
I think so too. She may want to practice some right brain thinking exercises expecially created for artists.😃
 
Here;s an article with a picture of the painting in question…

newsok.com/controversial-crucifix-creates-rift-at-warr-acres-church/article/3453833?custom_click=masthead_topten

It’s…um…kind of funny, I guess. Maybe poorly painted, but I don’t know if it was painted this way on purpose or on accident. 🙂 The video did not have to blur this out tho…they did so to create a bigger controversy. It’s supopsed to be his stomach.

Offensive to some? I can see that. Pornogrpahic? I vote no.
i think it is pretty discusting and bad taste. please dont tell me that the person who did this, did not know what he was doing. to me it is awfull and should be removed. it is just another scandal in the Church.
 
I will continue to take the alternate view. There is a distinct difference in the image on these links:

shrinesf.org/francis11.htm
monasteryicons.com/monasteryicons/Item_San-Damiano-Crucifix_207_ps_srm.html

And the picture under dispute:

newsok.com/controversial-crucifix-creates-rift-at-warr-acres-church/article/3453833?custom_click=masthead_topten

It seems very obvious that the artist who did the modern day interpretation intentionally modified the abdomen muscle depiction in order to make it appear as genitalia. It is wrong.
I have a San Damiano crucifix, and never noticed the abdomen looking like genitalia at all. I looked at the 1st two links, then went to my bedroom and looked at my crucifix. None look like the crucifix in question. If you look awhile, yeah, you can kinda see how His abdomen might look like a penis, especially if you’ve got a “dirty mind”. But the minute the picture of the controversial crucifix popped up, I was like “Whoa!” :eek:

Like I mentioned before, I don’t think it was intentional (I guess I have more faith in humanity than that. The sickos that would do that intentially would get a grant from the NEA and display it at the Brooklyn Museum of Art :p), but I do think some modification is in order.

In Christ,

Ellen
 
It does not help that this ‘distended abdomen’ or ‘6 pack’ or ‘4 pack’ or whatever it is supposed to be doesn’t resemble any part of the body other then a penis.
A penis drawn in the wrong area and to proportions too large to be credible.

I do not see pornography here, but I do see poor taste on the part of those that put the painting where it is, and I also see bad artistry on the painters part.

The artist may claim that he had no intention of what is seen in the painting.
I believe him. I also believe I would never look at another work from him.

The painting needs to be removed and replaced with a proper San Damiano crucifixion scene.
 
…The painting needs to be removed and replaced with a proper San Damiano crucifixion scene.
The painting will be removed to allow the artist to modify her work and then it will likely be returned to the Church.
Seems like a good idea to me. The artist can improve her work and fix the overly stylized areas causing the problem.

"To end Warr Acres church controversy, artist will modify crucifix
Parishioners say they welcome the changes

WARR ACRES — The local artist who designed a crucifix some say shows genitalia on Jesus plans to modify the piece in effort to end the controversy it has caused.

Janet Jaime, an Oklahoma City iconographer, came under fire for a crucifix she designed that since February has been above the main altar at St. Charles Borromeo Catholic Church in Warr Acres.

Church officials now plan to remove the crucifix so Jaime can modify it.

At issue is Jesus’ abdominal area, which some say looks like a large penis.

The church’s pastor released a statement to parishioners Friday announcing the crucifix would be modified.

"It certainly is not the intention of the artist or myself that the cross of Jesus Christ be a source of division or result in disrespectful statements,” the Rev. Philip Seeton wrote.

Parishioners welcome the news."…

Entire article Here: newsok.com/to-end-warr-acres-church-controversy-artist-will-modify-crucifix/article/3454703
 
This reminds me of the epispode of Everybody Loves Raymond when Marie created a sculpture…
 
If that is what someone is seeing meditating on a crucifix, that person needs to quit meditating on a crucifix and go instead to seek the aid of a professional counselor. There’s a problem, alright, but its not with the crucifix.
 
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