Is this pro-life?

[Luis_Santiago]

This is a true story. I’m not sure what should have been done here. This is just a bad situation all around, but something needed to be done.

I have a very close friend, Stan. Stan is Catholic, but not very strongly. He only goes to mass a few times a year. Stan has a friend, Leah. Leah is a sweet girl, and Catholic as well. But she’s not very strong-willed and has terrible judgment. Norman used to be Leah’s boyfriend. Norman is controlling, selfish, not very intelligent, and also Catholic.

Norman and Leah were dating, and Leah wanted to get out of that relationship. Norman was making her do things she didn’t want to do, and had hit her twice. He didn’t like to use a condom, and she couldn’t use birth control because of a medical condition, so he made her not use anything. Her friends were telling her this was a terrible idea, but keep in mind, this girl has terrible judgment and is easy to tell what to do. My friend Stan, and her other friends as well, managed to get her to leave Norman. She did, but not before she became pregnant.

So she was pregnant and Norman knew. She didn’t want to have anything to do with him anymore, but he was strongly pro-life, and wanted her to have the baby. She was willing, for the baby’s sake, but she didn’t want to have anything to do with Norman anymore. She even had a list of people that were willing to adopt it. But Norman would have none of this. He was telling her that any child of his was going to be raised by its parents, and she couldn’t abandon it. He didn’t want to raise the child himself, or even primarily, but he wasn’t about to let someone that wasn’t Leah or himself.

At this point, Leah has no idea what to do, and asks Stan for advice.

But before I continue, I have to ask, is Norman an example of a pro-life person? Are his priorities representative of others who are pro-life? What should Norman have done?

And for that matter, what should Leah have done? This is one of those situations where it’s hard to ask what Jesus would do. Clearly Jesus wouldn’t have gotten in this situation in the first place.

 

[stringbeanduck]

A pro-life person doesn’t necessarily have to godly person. An atheist can think abortion is discussing and condemn it very much. Norman though is being a very stupid person by limiting Leah’s options. Not to mention has some grave sins on his soul as well. If Norman thinks it’s wrong to abort an unborn baby and promotes caring babies to their birth date, then he is a pro-life person albeit imoral in other aspects of life. This is assuming your meaning pro-life when it comes to abortion.

Some women get into abusive relationships and feel they can’t leave. The right thing would be dump Norman, seek spirtual help, and go have the bady and give him/her up for adoption.

 

[ryecroft]

If I were giving advice on the situation, I believe (and I know this won’t go over big) I would tell normal or have him believe that I had miscarried. I would then I would get to a place where he wouldn’t be able to contact me, have the baby and give it up for adoption. If he’s already hit Leah, then I can guess how great he’ll be with a screaming baby or terrible two year old. I think in this case this would be acceptable both for Leah and the baby - what Norman doesn’t know can’t hurt Leah or baby.
God Bless
Annie

 

[pennsylvan]

He’s pro-life but he’s also an imbecile.

This is another example of the two spheres of morals and law passing in the night.

Regardless of whether he’s pro-life or not, the baby can not be adopted without Norman’s consent.

Until the birth, it’s Leah’s choice to carry the baby to birth.

Theres is much less morality in law than many assume. Time is better spent on helping - not forcing - people to make the right choices.

 

[Newbie2]

I would then I would get to a place where he wouldn’t be able to contact me, have the baby and give it up for adoption. ***If he’s already hit Leah, then I can guess how great he’ll be with a screaming baby or terrible two year old. ***I think in this case this would be acceptable both for Leah and the baby - what Norman doesn’t know can’t hurt Leah or baby.
God Bless
Annie

My thoughts exactly, except for telling him that she miscarried. I would contact an attorney, possibly getting a court order to keep him away during the pregnancy. Depending on the State, he may or may not have significant rights as a biological parent, but his stated unwillingness and unsuitability to raise the child on his own need to be documented, as he may press for his parental rights (which for him, the connotation of “parental” is an unfunny joke).

What should Leah have done? Seen this rube of a boyfriend as an immature control freak and left him ong ago (she had to get hit more than once to figure this out?) and second, well…not to cast stones, but this is a good example of why sex outside of marriage brings only problems.

As far as is he pro-life, stringbeanduck got it right.

 

[ryecroft]

Seriously, if this woman needs help finding an attorney (if that’s what she decides) and you need help finding a good low cost or even free attorney if you pm me and let me know, I’ll see what I can dig up. I’m not sure because I don’t even know what state you’re in or the woman. It’s deffinately good that she has a friend to lean on and confide in because in her situation she’s going to need all the help she can get. The last thing I want to see happen is that this little child becomes some kind of sick barganing chip to this guy. We all need to pray for them. I know you hear this lots but seriously there are tons of people who would help - some would help especially if she wants to adopt out - there are lots that will even o.k. an open adoption. Many women like this because they feel they haven’t just adopted the child and have no other contact with he/she.
God Bless
Annie

 

[Luis_Santiago]

A pro-life person doesn’t necessarily have to godly person. An atheist can think abortion is discussing and condemn it very much. Norman though is being a very stupid person by limiting Leah’s options. Not to mention has some grave sins on his soul as well. If Norman thinks it’s wrong to abort an unborn baby and promotes caring babies to their birth date, then he is a pro-life person albeit imoral in other aspects of life. This is assuming your meaning pro-life when it comes to abortion.

I referred to Norman as “pro-life” because that’s the word he used to describe himself. I don’t think this is an accurate description of the man though.

Some women get into abusive relationships and feel they can’t leave. The right thing would be dump Norman, seek spirtual help, and go have the baby and give him/her up for adoption.

She can’t give the baby up for adoption without Norman’s permission. Norman would never allow it though.

If I were giving advice on the situation, I believe (and I know this won’t go over big) I would tell normal or have him believe that I had miscarried. I would then I would get to a place where he wouldn’t be able to contact me, have the baby and give it up for adoption. If he’s already hit Leah, then I can guess how great he’ll be with a screaming baby or terrible two year old. I think in this case this would be acceptable both for Leah and the baby - what Norman doesn’t know can’t hurt Leah or baby.

Leah tried to tell Norman she had a miscarriage. He didn’t believe her. Leah is really bad at lying. This is one of the reasons she’s easy for her boyfriends to control.

He’s pro-life but he’s also an imbecile.

This is another example of the two spheres of morals and law passing in the night.

Regardless of whether he’s pro-life or not, the baby can not be adopted without Norman’s consent.

This is true. Norman knows this.

Until the birth, it’s Leah’s choice to carry the baby to birth.

Norman knows this too.

Theres is much less morality in law than many assume. Time is better spent on helping - not forcing - people to make the right choices.

I agree here too. I do know Leah, but not well enough to have influenced her decisions. Besides, she’d be mortified if she even knew I knew about this. The only reason I do is that I’m such good friends with Stan.

My thoughts exactly, except for telling him that she miscarried. I would contact an attorney, possibly getting a court order to keep him away during the pregnancy. Depending on the State, he may or may not have significant rights as a biological parent, but his stated unwillingness and unsuitability to raise the child on his own need to be documented, as he may press for his parental rights (which for him, the connotation of “parental” is an unfunny joke).

This has already been played out, and I did not know the story until well after it happened. I didn’t finish the story I started earlier, but it’s too late to change things now.

What should Leah have done? Seen this rube of a boyfriend as an immature control freak and left him ong ago (she had to get hit more than once to figure this out?) and second, well…not to cast stones, but this is a good example of why sex outside of marriage brings only problems.

I know, but you have to know Leah to know what she’s like. As I said before, this girl has terrible judgment and is easy to control. If she would have been stronger-willed, she would have done as her friends all advised her to much earlier. But we’ve all known people, especially women, who stay in these sorts of relationships anyway.

As far as is he pro-life, stringbeanduck got it right.

Yes, but knowing this doesn’t help Leah any.

Seriously, if this woman needs help finding an attorney (if that’s what she decides) and you need help finding a good low cost or even free attorney if you pm me and let me know, I’ll see what I can dig up. I’m not sure because I don’t even know what state you’re in or the woman. It’s deffinately good that she has a friend to lean on and confide in because in her situation she’s going to need all the help she can get. The last thing I want to see happen is that this little child becomes some kind of sick barganing chip to this guy. We all need to pray for them. I know you hear this lots but seriously there are tons of people who would help - some would help especially if she wants to adopt out - there are lots that will even o.k. an open adoption. Many women like this because they feel they haven’t just adopted the child and have no other contact with he/she.

Again, I thank you for your offer. However, it is too late to change anything that happened here. When I learned about this story, it was too late for me to do anything about it too. I just don’t know what the right thing to do would have been.

 

[theistgal]

She can’t give the baby up for adoption without Norman’s permission. Norman would never allow it though.

I don’t think this is correct. They’re not married, right? AFAIK, the woman has the legal right to make the decision about what happens to the baby, regardless of what the biological father wants.

Before abortion was made legal, pregnant girls used to go to “homes” to have their babies and give them up for adoption. The biological father might argue against it, but ultimately, it was the girl’s choice.

 

[Luis_Santiago]

I may as well finish the story. Leah called Stan and asked what she should do. Stan did all he could to support her. He told her that whatever she ended up doing, he would be there for her. He definitely didn’t encourage her to have an abortion, but that’s what she did. At this point she wanted to get away from Norman, and wanted to make sure he was out of her life forever. I know there are stories of women who suffer all kinds of guilt from having an abortion, but Leah wasn’t one. She said that afterwards she was happy and relieved that Norman no longer had any power over her. She did leave the Catholic Church though. I think this was easier for her than to accept what the Church teaches, and this doesn’t surprise me.

Norman has been sending Stan threatening messages, accusing him of killing his baby. Stan has just been ignoring him and avoiding going places where he might meet Norman.

Oh, and as if this isn’t messed up enough… well first I need to add some background. Stan and Leah work together, and went to college together. Stan was at Leah’s apartment last week with three guys and a girl that were friends with Leah from work. They had been drinking, but not excessively. Stan had to leave, and he told Leah that he didn’t trust the one guy that was her friend. Leah assured him he was fine, so Stan left. Later, one of the guys left with the girl, and the other two guys tried to rape her. So now Stan is trying to get these guys fired from work. It’s likely that’s all that can be done, since there’s practically no evidence now.

This is the point where Stan is asking me for advice. Now Leah is falling for Stan, since he’s been doing more than anymore to protect her. Stan likes her too, but he’s not sure he wants to be in a relationship with her because of the drama. But he also knows that this girl needs someone to protect her and tell her what to do. He’s not a controlling personality, but he’s come to the conclusion that this is what Leah needs.

But anyway, this is not the point. My point is that there are plenty of Catholics out there like Norman. There is this idea that being against abortion is so important for Catholics that everything else is secondary. Norman didn’t follow the Church’s teaching on premarital sex, responsibility, or violence. Only when it came to abortion, did he refer to his religion. He’s too ignorant to realize that by putting her in that situation and limiting her options, he’s as responsible as Leah for what happened, and certainly more responsible than Stan. And yet, Stan is the one he’s accusing of killing his baby.

I’m well aware that if Leah and Norman had followed the teaching of the Catholic Church, they wouldn’t have been in that situation. Still, as long as there are Catholics like Norman, I think this idea is ridiculous, that nothing is more important for a Catholic than being against abortion. Everything fits together, and Catholics can’t disregard parts of Church teaching just because they think abortion is a greater injustice. I’m still not sure what Leah should have done, but she had to make a choice between ending a new life and tying herself to Norman for the remainder of her own. Maybe if she were stronger, she could have done more to give that child a decent life. I’m sure I’m not the only one who wishes she was.

 

[Luis_Santiago]

I don’t think this is correct. They’re not married, right? AFAIK, the woman has the legal right to make the decision about what happens to the baby, regardless of what the biological father wants.

Before abortion was made legal, pregnant girls used to go to “homes” to have their babies and give them up for adoption. The biological father might argue against it, but ultimately, it was the girl’s choice.

In the state where I live, he would have significant rights as the father. Both parents would need to agree to adoptions. This isn’t always a bad thing, but the state isn’t usually well-equipped to make these decisions.

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

This is a true story. I’m not sure what should have been done here. This is just a bad situation all around, but something needed to be done.

I have a very close friend, Stan. Stan is Catholic, but not very strongly. He only goes to mass a few times a year. Stan has a friend, Leah. Leah is a sweet girl, and Catholic as well. But she’s not very strong-willed and has terrible judgment. Norman used to be Leah’s boyfriend. Norman is controlling, selfish, not very intelligent, and also Catholic.

Norman and Leah were dating, and Leah wanted to get out of that relationship. Norman was making her do things she didn’t want to do, and had hit her twice. He didn’t like to use a condom, and she couldn’t use birth control because of a medical condition, so he made her not use anything. Her friends were telling her this was a terrible idea, but keep in mind, this girl has terrible judgment and is easy to tell what to do. My friend Stan, and her other friends as well, managed to get her to leave Norman. She did, but not before she became pregnant.

So she was pregnant and Norman knew. She didn’t want to have anything to do with him anymore, but he was strongly pro-life, and wanted her to have the baby. She was willing, for the baby’s sake, but she didn’t want to have anything to do with Norman anymore. She even had a list of people that were willing to adopt it. But Norman would have none of this. He was telling her that any child of his was going to be raised by its parents, and she couldn’t abandon it. He didn’t want to raise the child himself, or even primarily, but he wasn’t about to let someone that wasn’t Leah or himself.

At this point, Leah has no idea what to do, and asks Stan for advice.

But before I continue, I have to ask, is Norman an example of a pro-life person? Are his priorities representative of others who are pro-life? What should Norman have done?

And for that matter, what should Leah have done? This is one of those situations where it’s hard to ask what Jesus would do. Clearly Jesus wouldn’t have gotten in this situation in the first place.

I was in this situation. He didn’t want to break up, and threatened to kidnap my child if I refused to continue in the relationship. I was never willing to give up my child. Thankfully, I had supportive parents willing to protect me and my child. I found a really good lawyer…one who goes for the jugular vein. Then I let it be known that he was NOT the father of the child. Then he came to realize that to even take me to court to get a judge to FORCE me to make my child have a paternity test was going to COST him a whole lot of money. Then he realized that I was going to take him for absolutely EVERYTHING he had, and fight him more than he could imagine for him to even have anything to say in my child’s life.
Many would say that this is extreme…and it is. I was forced to choose to lie and protect or face having my child kidnapped from me.
It was control of me that he wanted, though. It never would have been this way had he not made the threats he had.

He cannot force her to keep the baby. She can put the baby up for adoption…only, he will have the option of keeping the baby himself should she do so.
I would get good legal advice.

 

[Luis_Santiago]

I was in this situation. He didn’t want to break up, and threatened to kidnap my child if I refused to continue in the relationship. I was never willing to give up my child. Thankfully, I had supportive parents willing to protect me and my child. I found a really good lawyer…one who goes for the jugular vein. Then I let it be known that he was NOT the father of the child. Then he came to realize that to even take me to court to get a judge to FORCE me to make my child have a paternity test was going to COST him a whole lot of money. Then he realized that I was going to take him for absolutely EVERYTHING he had, and fight him more than he could imagine for him to even have anything to say in my child’s life.
Many would say that this is extreme…and it is. I was forced to choose to lie and protect or face having my child kidnapped from me.
It was control of me that he wanted, though. It never would have been this way had he not made the threats he had.

It means a lot to me that you understand all too well the gravity of this sort of situation. I thank God that I’m not the one that had to decide what to do in that situation, but it changes things a lot when you know the people involved and what they’re capable of. I know Leah well enough to know that she didn’t have it in her to fight the prolonged battle that you did. Sadly, not everyone has your willpower.

He cannot force her to keep the baby. She can put the baby up for adoption…only, he will have the option of keeping the baby himself should she do so.
I would get good legal advice.

The trouble is, Norman couldn’t properly care for a hamster, let alone a child. Leah knew this, and for her, letting Norman raise the child was out of the question. Leah had compiled a list of people who were willing to adopt that baby, but Norman was prepared to do everything he could to make sure none of them had the chance.

It is tragic that Leah resorted to abortion. It would have been much better if Norman had realized that neither of them was prepared to raise a child, and if his pro-life philosophy had led him to allow the adoption despite what he wanted. But I believe this situation has made me pro-choice. It is one thing to argue over history and logic and ancient religious philosophy, but it is quite another thing when these sorts of choices are forced on people you know. Even the fact that he knew Leah could get an abortion, caused Norman to tone down his demands, albeit not enough. If the law said that she couldn’t, she would be powerless against Norman’s demands, and would have had to raise the baby whether or not she would rather put it up for adoption. In this case, Leah had supportive friends, a supportive family (although I don’t think most of them know this happened), and a decent amount of options and resources available to her. But there are far too many men out there that are much worse than Norman, and too many women who have fewer options than Leah did. She could have found the baby a loving home if Norman had allowed it, but there are plenty of women who would be unable to do this.

I don’t question the Catholic teaching that abortion is evil. I know that abortion ends a human life. Some would say otherwise, but only because they want to avoid revealing its inherent ugliness. But I think that simply making abortion illegal would cause more problems than it would solve, without actually having an effect on the abortion rate, as has been the case in Chile. As Christians, we are called to change people’s hearts and minds. This is much more difficult, but I think this is what we have to do.

 

[Sair]

This is the point where Stan is asking me for advice. Now Leah is falling for Stan, since he’s been doing more than anymore to protect her. Stan likes her too, but he’s not sure he wants to be in a relationship with her because of the drama. But he also knows that this girl needs someone to protect her and tell her what to do. He’s not a controlling personality, but he’s come to the conclusion that this is what Leah needs.

But anyway, this is not the point. My point is that there are plenty of Catholics out there like Norman. There is this idea that being against abortion is so important for Catholics that everything else is secondary. Norman didn’t follow the Church’s teaching on premarital sex, responsibility, or violence. Only when it came to abortion, did he refer to his religion. He’s too ignorant to realize that by putting her in that situation and limiting her options, he’s as responsible as Leah for what happened, and certainly more responsible than Stan. And yet, Stan is the one he’s accusing of killing his baby.

I’m well aware that if Leah and Norman had followed the teaching of the Catholic Church, they wouldn’t have been in that situation. Still, as long as there are Catholics like Norman, I think this idea is ridiculous, that nothing is more important for a Catholic than being against abortion. Everything fits together, and Catholics can’t disregard parts of Church teaching just because they think abortion is a greater injustice. I’m still not sure what Leah should have done, but she had to make a choice between ending a new life and tying herself to Norman for the remainder of her own. Maybe if she were stronger, she could have done more to give that child a decent life. I’m sure I’m not the only one who wishes she was.

It’s a real shame that your friend has found himself in such a complicated and potentially heartbreaking situation.

For what it’s worth, I agree with your assessment of Norman. I would say that he is ‘pro-life’ in name only, and took the opportunity to stand on what for him is an empty principle because it gave him leverage in trying to control Leah. If someone doesn’t follow the teachings of the church to which they claim to belong, just pulling out the pro-life card when a pregnancy is at stake certainly doesn’t unblot their copybook.

As for your friend becoming involved in a relationship with Leah, it seems to me that the best he could do for both himself and for her is to try to maintain a supportive friendship, rather than risk becoming committed to an unequal relationship that he may come to resent. I have a friend who has only just managed to extricate himself from a relationship with a very needy woman who lacks self-confidence and self-awareness, and it wasn’t a healthy relationship for either of them. It sounds like Leah needs to be given time and support and encouragement to find her own feet as far as possible, before allowing herself to commit to another relationship.

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

It means a lot to me that you understand all too well the gravity of this sort of situation. I thank God that I’m not the one that had to decide what to do in that situation, but it changes things a lot when you know the people involved and what they’re capable of. I know Leah well enough to know that she didn’t have it in her to fight the prolonged battle that you did. Sadly, not everyone has your willpower.

The trouble is, Norman couldn’t properly care for a hamster, let alone a child. Leah knew this, and for her, letting Norman raise the child was out of the question. Leah had compiled a list of people who were willing to adopt that baby, but Norman was prepared to do everything he could to make sure none of them had the chance.

It is tragic that Leah resorted to abortion. It would have been much better if Norman had realized that neither of them was prepared to raise a child, and if his pro-life philosophy had led him to allow the adoption despite what he wanted. But I believe this situation has made me pro-choice. It is one thing to argue over history and logic and ancient religious philosophy, but it is quite another thing when these sorts of choices are forced on people you know. Even the fact that he knew Leah could get an abortion, caused Norman to tone down his demands, albeit not enough. If the law said that she couldn’t, she would be powerless against Norman’s demands, and would have had to raise the baby whether or not she would rather put it up for adoption. In this case, Leah had supportive friends, a supportive family (although I don’t think most of them know this happened), and a decent amount of options and resources available to her. But there are far too many men out there that are much worse than Norman, and too many women who have fewer options than Leah did. She could have found the baby a loving home if Norman had allowed it, but there are plenty of women who would be unable to do this.

I don’t question the Catholic teaching that abortion is evil. I know that abortion ends a human life. Some would say otherwise, but only because they want to avoid revealing its inherent ugliness. But I think that simply making abortion illegal would cause more problems than it would solve, without actually having an effect on the abortion rate, as has been the case in Chile. As Christians, we are called to change people’s hearts and minds. This is much more difficult, but I think this is what we have to do.

The complete problem is society as a whole. Society says that it is perfectly acceptable and good to have sex outside of marriage. Only, society doesn’t protect the babies or the parents when unplanned pregnancies occur. What education or social program helped Leah out in this situation? None. The law said that she could not keep the baby away from him so far as she knew. The law threw that baby away…whether from the present law that said that an unfit and abusive father can keep the mother from putting the baby up for adoption…or by making her only option to kill her baby.
The whole law needs to change. And individuals…not the government…need to control things.
My heart goes out to Leah. She felt as though this was the best option…probably for the child. That is completely and totally warped thinking, but I understand how she could be in that situation. There were other options for her, but the options were completely and totally drastic (and I do not mean becoming a mother). In order for her to deal responsibly with this situation, she would have had to contact an abused woman’s shelter and go into hiding. That very probably never crossed her mind as an option because that option is not advertised.

There are many, many, many women who need love and support. Children need to be educated about situations like mine…like Leah’s. They need to be made aware that abstinance is the only proof positive of something horrible happening to you due to a sexual relationship. And that doesn’t even mention the spiritual part.
Abortion only destroys, it never heals.

Becoming pro choice is not the answer. That makes it seem as though abortion is an alright answer…and murder is NEVER the right answer.
We need to become pro woman…and abortion is not pro woman. Catholicism is pro woman.
The laws need to echo such pro woman steps.

 

[fix]

But anyway, this is not the point. My point is that there are plenty of Catholics out there like Norman. There is this idea that being against abortion is so important for Catholics that everything else is secondary. Norman didn’t follow the Church’s teaching on premarital sex, responsibility, or violence. Only when it came to abortion, did he refer to his religion. He’s too ignorant to realize that by putting her in that situation and limiting her options, he’s as responsible as Leah for what happened, and certainly more responsible than Stan. And yet, Stan is the one he’s accusing of killing his baby.

I have no idea how you come to such a conclusion.

 

[manualman]

Thing is, the story isn’t over yet. Leah fundamentally decided that it would be better to kill the baby than allow Norman to raise him. She was STILL vicitimized and manipulated by Norman.

Had she called his bluff, she would have destroyed him. Guys like Norman aren’t going to care for a child. No way. She could have told him “I’m giving the baby up for adoption. Law says you have first dibs. Whatcha gonna do?” Bullies like Norman always cave when truly stood up to.

The reason I say the story isn’t over is that eventually, Leah is going to wake up in a cold sweat over this. She may be relieved right now, but that will eventually pass and reality sets in.

Your scenario is a classic case why abortion shouldn’t be legal. Women all the time are coerced into abortion by abusive men in their lives like Norman. “Safe, legal abortion” enables the Norman’s of the world to take advantage of women not as strong willed as they are.

I say Norman wanted her to have the abortion all along. He just doesn’t want to admit it out loud.

 

[elts1956]

It means a lot to me that you understand all too well the gravity of this sort of situation. I thank God that I’m not the one that had to decide what to do in that situation, but it changes things a lot when you know the people involved and what they’re capable of. I know Leah well enough to know that she didn’t have it in her to fight the prolonged battle that you did. Sadly, not everyone has your willpower.

The trouble is, Norman couldn’t properly care for a hamster, let alone a child. Leah knew this, and for her, letting Norman raise the child was out of the question. Leah had compiled a list of people who were willing to adopt that baby, but Norman was prepared to do everything he could to make sure none of them had the chance.

It is tragic that Leah resorted to abortion. It would have been much better if Norman had realized that neither of them was prepared to raise a child, and if his pro-life philosophy had led him to allow the adoption despite what he wanted. But I believe this situation has made me pro-choice. It is one thing to argue over history and logic and ancient religious philosophy, but it is quite another thing when these sorts of choices are forced on people you know. Even the fact that he knew Leah could get an abortion, caused Norman to tone down his demands, albeit not enough. If the law said that she couldn’t, she would be powerless against Norman’s demands, and would have had to raise the baby whether or not she would rather put it up for adoption. In this case, Leah had supportive friends, a supportive family (although I don’t think most of them know this happened), and a decent amount of options and resources available to her. But there are far too many men out there that are much worse than Norman, and too many women who have fewer options than Leah did. She could have found the baby a loving home if Norman had allowed it, but there are plenty of women who would be unable to do this.

I don’t question the Catholic teaching that abortion is evil. I know that abortion ends a human life. Some would say otherwise, but only because they want to avoid revealing its inherent ugliness. But I think that simply making abortion illegal would cause more problems than it would solve, without actually having an effect on the abortion rate, as has been the case in Chile. As Christians, we are called to change people’s hearts and minds. This is much more difficult, but I think this is what we have to do.

Ah Dear luis. So nice to hear from you again. Isn’t keeping abortion legal or making it illegal the point of all your story telling? Trying to find out if there would be any pro life people who would think in instances such as your “friends” experiences, abortion should not be made illegal?

 

[s4angel]

Unfortunatly in this story no one was able to ask the child. I know that there is no way a child in the womb can answer per say. would the child have been abused is irrelevant at this point as it already was abused by being killed.

A man can not force a dna test unless the woman puts him down somewhere as the father. I was in an almost identicle situation with my last child. No where and I do mean no where does her biological fathers name appear when asked I just say I don’t know. I will never ask for child support as then he would have rights too and I will not subject my child to that kind of environment.

I know to lie is wrong and I do regret it with all my heart as well as the sin that neccesitated another sin to protect the consequence of the first sin (isn’t that how sin goes?) I did go to confession and now if asked directly I would tell the truth but not before everyone understood the abuse first and made sure the proper protections were in place.