Is Your Sunday Mass Prayerful?

[opus101]

Me, too.

I CANNOT pray or think or smile during chant. Sorry, I just can’t. It grates on my last nerve until I want to scream.

And before anyone says I haven’t “good” chant, our choir is run by a nationally recognized instructor of chant. Yes, she goes around the country teaching others about chant.

Luckily, my pastor has a Mass that uses very little chant. I attend that Mass.

If your choir director is a chant instructor, perhaps the chant in your parish is too complex!
IMO, the simpler the better. Very simple chant is reverent and directs your heart to the main point.

 

[maryjk]

If your choir director is a chant instructor, perhaps the chant in your parish is too complex!
IMO, the simpler the better. Very simple chant is reverent and directs your heart to the main point.

Of course. It can’t be that I just don’t like chant. There has to be something wrong with how it is done, because everyone just loves it.

Sorry, but chant doesn’t direct my heart to the main point. It directs my heart to the point that I can’t receive Communion because my attitude is not one of love.

 

[Usige]

I CANNOT pray or think or smile during chant. Sorry, I just can’t. It grates on my last nerve until I want to scream.

But some feel the same way about hymns so why is one point of view more valid than the other?

It likely comes done to how our brains are wired. Chant and song are two separate things to me. I can sing a million different songs, but not be praying. I can’t chant and not have it be a prayer. In my head chant = prayer, but singing ≠ prayer. That doesn’t mean I can’t pray and sing, but they are not automatically linked. If the lyrics or music of a hymn are deficient and not a reflection of my “inner voice” then they aren’t prayerful to me. Rather they become a competing distraction to be endured. This is not different then people who say I can’t pray in Latin because it means nothing to me. If the hymn means nothing to you (or grates on your nerves) it simply won’t be a prayer.

 

[CatholicRaven]

I find our parish’s Masses to be very prayerful.

We do sing hymns, but they generally are related to the readings and are uplifting, not distracting (I can usually even pray without difficulty while the choir sings). We also usually sing/chant certain things, such as the “Agnus Dei (Lamb of God),” the “Sanctus (Holy, Holy, Holy),” and the “Gloria (Glory to God).” I don’t have all of those memorized in Latin yet, but I find them beautiful reminders that the Mass is not an ordinary event.

We also have a Communion rail (with a Communion rail cloth) where we kneel to receive the Eucharist.

Our priest does include jokes or humorous stories in his homilies, but always with a point, not just for entertainment value. I think it helps people better relate to what he’s saying. He often explains Catholic teaching in an accessible way, as well. And I love that he does not avoid or shy away from controversial topics!

Another thing that I really appreciate is that the priest does not ask us to offer each other the Sign of Peace. When I’m at another Mass and the priest says to do this, I will do it in obedience, but I nearly always find it disruptive to my focus on God (I’m still working on that). Same thing for people holding hands at the Our Father, so I generally just close my eyes and fold my hands for that.

I have found that when I attend other parishes, I am more easily distracted and have to work a bit harder at staying focused–but I know that’s partly because it’s simply not as familiar to me as my “home” parish. I think these things are distracting because of *my own *weaknesses, not because of any fault or shortcoming of the Liturgy.

God bless!

 

[Usige]

Sorry, but chant doesn’t direct my heart to the main point. It directs my heart to the point that I can’t receive Communion because my attitude is not one of love.

That’s exactly how I fell when Hagen, Haas, Landry, etc. are rolled out. I don’t feel love, but rather a desire to strangle someone.

 

[maryjk]

But some feel the same way about hymns so why is one point of view more valid than the other?

One isn’t more valid, they are both valid.

My pastor handles it very well.

We have one Mass where it seems to be exclusively chant. And we have one that has no chant, or at least very little.

The rest of the Masses fall in between.

Almost everyone can find a Mass that works for them.

 

[Usige]

Father, I admit to feeling the same way. The choices used often seem to be at odds with what my soul wants to proclaim. I often feel like there’s a choice to offer the Lord platinum, gold, silver, or copper and people often choose copper. I understand if copper is the best you can offer, but why is it so often the first rather than the last choice?

Mass is often a weight upon me that drags me down rather than something that uplifts me. I often struggle to pray the Mass because of distractions that draw my focus from Christ and towards the people. My wife and I often talk about attending Mass at the FSSP parish 30 miles away as recharging our spiritual batteries since the focus is much more on the sacrifice on the cross.

What I would like to see:

• More balance between speaking about sin and forgiveness. Too often it seems people brush over sin and jump straight to “God loves you”. Yes, but don’t forget that it took sacrifice of his Son to redeem us.
• More use of EP1. I like to hear the litany of the saints. It reminds us of those that went before and that our faith transcends us and our time. Currently we hear it in our parish maybe once every 3 or 4 months.
• More sacred silence. I include **soft **piano or instrumental interludes here. I have no issue with reflective music during Mass as a back drop, but not all music has to include congregational singing.
• More use of the full confiteor during the penitential rite rather than the shorter call and response options.

 

[Usige]

One isn’t more valid, they are both valid.

My pastor handles it very well.

We have one Mass where it seems to be exclusively chant. And we have one that has no chant, or at least very little.

The rest of the Masses fall in between.

Almost everyone can find a Mass that works for them.

That’s great. I guess I was trying to point out that for everyone that thinks hymns are a prayer they need to recognize that there are probably just as many that feel the opposite. I wish more parishes did like yours and offered a consistent option. Many of us aren’t that lucky. Other than the Spanish Mass and the Sunday evening “contemporary” Mass, it’s basically a guess on what the liturgy will be like (well it will have dreck from OCP, but I fear I’ll never get away from that).

 

[Cavaille-Coll]

Father, I admit to feeling the same way. The choices used often seem to be at odds with what my soul wants to proclaim. I often feel like there’s a choice to offer the Lord platinum, gold, silver, or copper and people often choose copper. I understand if copper is the best you can offer, but why is it so often the first rather than the last choice?

I have often used a similar analogy in which the Church has presented us with a smorgasbord of sacred music, art, and architecture of all kinds in order to help us draw closer to Christ through the sacraments. While the finest “foods” are available at this table - filet mignon, lobster tail, or whatever - most Catholics today only want the ramen noodles.

Hence, the popularity of pedestrian, uninspiring music, ugly architecture, and a distinct disconnect between the concepts of truth and beauty. In our world today, people reject the beautiful and worship the ugly, and like Pilate, they say “What is truth?” Restoration of beauty to the liturgy, through sacred music, inspiring art and architecture, solid and substantive preaching, and opportunities for reverent silence - is critical to the preservation and growth of the True Faith.

 

[maryjk]

That’s great. I guess I was trying to point out that for everyone that thinks hymns are a prayer they need to recognize that there are probably just as many that feel the opposite. I wish more parishes did like yours and offered a consistent option. Many of us aren’t that lucky. Other than the Spanish Mass and the Sunday evening “contemporary” Mass, it’s basically a guess on what the liturgy will be like (well it will have dreck from OCP, but I fear I’ll never get away from that).

Sometimes it is hard for me to remember that not everyone has such a wonderful pastor.

Our Masses are consistent enough that if someone told me what they like, I could direct them to a Mass that should suit them.

Although I will say that all of the Masses, every one of them, are true to Church teaching. And you will never hear a homily in favor of female priests, homosexual marriage, contraception or abortion.

 

[Alex2008]

Antiphons (chanted) are part of the Mass itself. They are in the Missal, and come from sacred scripture. They were selected by the church for the Mass of the day. In the GIRM, they are listed as the first choice in the options for singing. The GIRM says gregorian chant should have the “first place” in the Mass. Musicians tend to prefer hymns, that is why they have predominated since VII.

Some hymns are lovely and prayerful, no argument there! But the Mass is designed primarily for chant. I’m advocating reorienting our music at Mass to conform more closely to the mind of the Church regarding what should normally be sung. The church’s mind is sing the Mass (antiphons, dialogues, ordinaries) rather than sing at the Mass (hymns).

None-the-less many of these antiphons are totally unfamiliar to people and people would have to learn them… Personally, and as a former priest, I find some of them quiet dissonant and hard to sing. What you need are good cantors…find them, let them learn the music, and then let them teach the music to the congregation. You have to be willing to spend before Mass to teach the music however. Lastly the average joe/jane in the pew does not know how to read music and so must be taught the meolody. It all takes time!

 

[FrStevenJones]

None-the-less many of these antiphons are totally unfamiliar to people and people would have to learn them… Personally, and as a former priest, I find some of them quiet dissonant and hard to sing. What you need are good cantors…find them, let them learn the music, and then let them teach the music to the congregation. You have to be willing to spend before Mass to teach the music however. Lastly the average joe/jane in the pew does not know how to read music and so must be taught the meolody. It all takes time!

Ever heard of “recto tono” (sp?) … it makes it easy to pray the antiphons, in song!

 

[EnglishTeacher]

1. 
   
   Before I became a priest, I noticed that the more devout I became, Sunday Mass became more difficult. I wanted to go to Mass to pray in community, to experience Christ’s presence, to be present at the sacrifice, and receive communion. However, I often felt the choices made for how the Mass was offered didn’t lead me into the prayer I craved. In fact, I increasingly experienced that rather than leading me into prayer, I had to fight the liturgical choices in order to be able to pray.
   
   I wanted to hear the beautiful, scripturally based antiphons used, the ones that the Church gives us in the Roman Missal. Instead, we always sung hymns, which often had nothing to do with the Mass of the day. I didn’t usually find the hymns drew me into prayer and recollection, and I craved prayer. When I looked around I often saw listless faces, especially among men, who often just sat there without singing. There was little silent time in the Masses I attended, and I craved time to just pray, without singing.
   
   After years of this, and studying the options, I decided we would be better off to make our Masses prayerful by using silence where it is allowed, and singing the Mass (dialogues, antiphons, ordinaries) rather than singing at the Mass ( hymns). Then the time that was now filled with hymns could be used for silent prayer and recollection, and now we could still sing, but we would now sing the Mass parts, the actual prayers! I am so excited about this idea, and it’s all doable with the right choices in the OF of Mass!
   
   So yea, Sunday Mass doesn’t need to be fancy. It just needs to be prayerful, first and foremost. Nothing must be allowed to get in the way of this, we need Our Lord, and we find him in a prayerful Mass!
   
   I’ve shared some of these thoughts in other posts, but I’m wondering if other people have experienced something similar.
   
   Please do not misconstrue this as an attack on the OF Mass. It is not! The OF has many, many options and choices. But most of them are never used.
   
   So I’m curious, where do you see opportunities for your pastor to make Sunday Mass a truly prayerful experience?

1. 
   Opportunities to make Sunday Mass a more prayerful experience . . . A few ideas that come to mind is to get rid of the extraneous comments like “good morning” or announcements before starting Mass. A silent atmosphere in the church before Mass is very helpful for praying and readying the mind for Mass.
   
   I like the idea that another poster suggested of having just an entrance and an exit hymn, rather than hymns during the Mass. I think that is far better solution than getting rid of hymns entirely. Singing hymns at Mass is prayer, and an important form of prayer for me, and I’m sure for many others.
   
   The scriptural antiphons that you mentioned are very beautiful, but they are very difficult to sing/chant as a congregation, at least in my experience. I read music reasonably well, and have sung in several different choirs, but I still find chant difficult without practice beforehand. Maybe you could have a cantor sing the antiphons?

 

[Pablopedro]

I spend large amounts of time outside of Mass in prayer. One of the things I absolutely love about Mass is how it pulls me outside of myself. Instead of simply sitting there self-focused or only focusing on God the way I would alone in my bedroom, I am having an entirely different religious experience at Mass that pulls me outside of myself and makes me more aware of my brothers and sisters in Christ, more responsive to the Mass, and makes the Mass an extremely unique experience unlike anything else.

I am certain there will be who love a more silent “down to business” Mass. But may I please recommend simply trying it out at one Mass time? Maybe announce the changes to that Mass time, explain them, and then see what sort of a response you get. That way your future parishioners will not have to change parishes if they do not care for it, but instead will only need to change Mass times. And your parishioners who love the changes can go to that Mass time.

 

[Cat]

Ever heard of “recto tono” (sp?) … it makes it easy to pray the antiphons, in song!

But…but…why on earth do you want to replace pretty melodic hymns with something simple and more-or-less monotonal?!!

On the one hand, traditionalist-leaning Catholics say that the Catholic faith has been “dumbed down” by the modernists who want only “happy-clappy” music. And yet, your answer to that is to provide “recto tono,” which is defined as “the simplest church music, just one tone?” That doesn’t make sense!

Why don’t you provide uplifting, inspiring, magnificent music? (I know the answer to that question–lack of money, and I sympathize with you.)

Do you really think that the “simplest music” is going to keep people in the Church and draw back the ones who have left? I don’t think so.

I’m pretty easy-going when it comes to church music, and I don’t mind chant that is badly sung, or contemporary music, or traditional hymns, or pretty much any kind of music that is done by Christians that I love and trust. However, I think a few months of “lecto tono” would drive me starko nutso. I like pretty music, or BEAUTIFUL, inspiring music, and I think a lot of others feel the same way, and I don’t apologize for that or consider it “un-Christian.” The Catholic Church has quite a lot to say about beauty and the arts, and I think that it’s appropriate for Christians to long for a “peek at heaven” in their Mass music.

If you want the antiphons, either hire a good cantor and ask them to find beautiful settings for the antiphons OR just say the antiphons and don’t sing them.

BTW, as a musician, I think that singing one tone is much harder than singing a lilting melody.

 

[FrStevenJones]

But…but…why on earth do you want to replace pretty melodic hymns with something simple and more-or-less monotonal?!!

On the one hand, traditionalist-leaning Catholics say that the Catholic faith has been “dumbed down” by the modernists who want only “happy-clappy” music. And yet, your answer to that is to provide “recto tono,” which is defined as “the simplest church music, just one tone?” That doesn’t make sense!

Why don’t you provide uplifting, inspiring, magnificent music? (I know the answer to that question–lack of money, and I sympathize with you.)
U
Do you really think that the “simplest music” is going to keep people in the Church and draw back the ones who have left? I don’t think so.

I’m pretty easy-going when it comes to church music, and I don’t mind chant that is badly sung, or contemporary music, or traditional hymns, or pretty much any kind of music that is done by Christians that I love and trust. However, I think a few months of “lecto tono” would drive me starko nutso. I like pretty music, or BEAUTIFUL, inspiring music, and I think a lot of others feel the same way, and I don’t apologize for that or consider it “un-Christian.” The Catholic Church has quite a lot to say about beauty and the arts, and I think that it’s appropriate for Christians to long for a “peek at heaven” in their Mass music.

If you want the antiphons, either hire a good cantor and ask them to find beautiful settings for the antiphons OR just say the antiphons and don’t sing them.

BTW, as a musician, I think that singing one tone is much harder than singing a lilting melody.

It’s really all about prayer, not music!

 

[CB_Catholic]

Well, Father, while I appreciate what you would like to do, and we do need more prayerful Masses, I think a good solution is to offer both types of Masses, reverently. Offer the parish Masses that will speak to as many people as possible, spiritually. I probably would not want to consistently attend a Mass as you have described without hymns, with mostly chant, long periods of silence, a silent offertory, ad orientem, yet many people do. But the OF can be reverent and beautiful without too many changes if good quality hymns are chosen, good music is played, parts of the Mass are sung, the sign of peace is given in a reverent manner, etc.

I think that rather than focus on what you think would be the ideal Mass, consider those who might not be willing to change because the Mass as is does meet their spiritual needs and offer Masses to meet the needs of most of the parishoners (you will never make everybody happy).

Since most parishes have more than one Mass on Sunday, it really should not be too much of a problem to have Mass as you envision it, and a reverent Mass like you already know and say. One has to remember that God did not make us all out of the same mold and speaks to each one of us differently.

 

[onmyknees]

Father, I admit to feeling the same way. The choices used often seem to be at odds with what my soul wants to proclaim. I often feel like there’s a choice to offer the Lord platinum, gold, silver, or copper and people often choose copper. I understand if copper is the best you can offer, but why is it so often the first rather than the last choice?

Mass is often a weight upon me that drags me down rather than something that uplifts me. I often struggle to pray the Mass because of distractions that draw my focus from Christ and towards the people. My wife and I often talk about attending Mass at the FSSP parish 30 miles away as recharging our spiritual batteries since the focus is much more on the sacrifice on the cross.

What I would like to see:

• More balance between speaking about sin and forgiveness. Too often it seems people brush over sin and jump straight to “God loves you”. Yes, but don’t forget that it took sacrifice of his Son to redeem us.
• More use of EP1. I like to hear the litany of the saints. It reminds us of those that went before and that our faith transcends us and our time. Currently we hear it in our parish maybe once every 3 or 4 months.
• More sacred silence. I include soft piano or instrumental interludes here. I have no issue with reflective music during Mass as a back drop, but not all music has to include congregational singing.
• More use of the full confiteor during the penitential rite rather than the shorter call and response options.

This!

 

[Elizabeth502]

1. 
   
   I didn’t usually find the hymns drew me into prayer and recollection, and I craved prayer. When I looked around I often saw listless faces, especially among men, who often just sat there without singing. There was little silent time in the Masses I attended, and I craved time to just pray, without singing.
   
   After years of this, and studying the options, I decided we would be better off to make our Masses prayerful by using silence where it is allowed, and singing the Mass (dialogues, antiphons, ordinaries) rather than singing at the Mass ( hymns). Then the time that was now filled with hymns could be used for silent prayer and recollection, and now we could still sing, but we would now sing the Mass parts, the actual prayers! I am so excited about this idea, and it’s all doable with the right choices in the OF of Mass!
   
   So yea, Sunday Mass doesn’t need to be fancy. It just needs to be prayerful, first and foremost. Nothing must be allowed to get in the way of this, we need Our Lord, and we find him in a prayerful Mass!..

1. 
   Amen, Father. Another great thread-starter from you. Very much appreciated.
   

   [So I’m curious, where do you see opportunities for your pastor to make Sunday Mass a truly prayerful experience?

   While I rarely have the opportunity to attend a traditional Mass form (my details are not important) , I am fortunate enough to attend a “solemn” with a small “s” OF Mass which features a ton of silence. My situation in that regard is unusual. This Mass is very atypical for Sunday parish Masses. But I will note also that it does not attract families, nor Catholics who like a lot of casualness, chattiness, and noise during Mass. It is definitely a niche Mass. To be noted, Father: Young people (young adults) flock to this Mass. And I mean flock. When they are asked why they go, they mention specifically the long periods of silence, the reverence, the chance to reflect & receive. They are maximally cooperative with these periods of silence. They may talk, and boisterously, outside (before and after Mass), but never during. This gives this Mass something of a monastic theme, though it is nowhere near a monastery.
   
   Now, we know that song can be so prayerful, and I do like to sing sacred music, and have often been in Church choirs. there have been times in which the words of the hymn I am singing have struck a deep chord in me (pun intended), and I have received that “sound” as a message from God, perhaps urging me in the direction of greater prayer, urging me to open my soul to God, whatever.
   
   However, when we sing --particularly someone else’s prayerful words-- we are usually in active mode. I have found that after receiving Communion, I particularly do not like to sing, no matter how beautiful the communion or post-communion hymn. In fact, I generally do not even “talk” at that moment. I just listen and receive. I have tried both ways, and there is no question that the silence after communion is especially persuasive.
   
   …So to answer your question about what the pastor can do…
   
   He can encourage lectors to pause before beginning the passage. That works in the above parish, and another I attend. If the lector waits for all of us to recollect ourselves, it promotes listening prayerfully and openly. Ditto, of course, for the priest himself waiting just before and after the Gospel, his own homily, and definitely waiting for some time after Communion, before the last prayers. (I see that the EWTN Mass priests do this, too.)
   
   And thank you for asking.
   [/quote]

 

[Elizabeth502]

It’s really all about prayer, not music!