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Booklover
Guest
Booklover;5080957:
**that He may be with you forever; **
17 that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you.
18 “I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you.
19 “After a little while the world will no longer see Me, but you will see Me; because I live, you will live also.
20 “In that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you.
…
25 “These things I have spoken to you while abiding with you.
26 “But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.
John 15
26 “**When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you **from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me,
27 and you will testify also, because you have been with Me from the beginning.
John 16
5 “But now I am going to Him who sent Me; and none of you asks Me, ‘Where are You going?’
6 “But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart.
7 “But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you.
8 “**And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; **
9 concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me;
10 and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me;
11 and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged.
12 “I have many more things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now.
13 “But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.
14 “He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.
15 “All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.
Hi Pam! Thanks for filling it all in!
Vickie
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jakasaki
Guest
jakasaki;5081109:
Thanks Vickie -Hi Pam! Thanks for filling it all in!
Vickie
I can’t stand it any more.
Our muslim members take one little word, twisted to fix their own agenda and that’s that.
The chapters and verses I posted are there, right there in the Bible for all to read. And you know what, it’s pretty clear to understand what the message is.
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empurpledsoul
Guest
The amazing power and beauty of the promise of the Comforter is that it ensured that even one as I, living 2000 years later, would be able to receive directly from Jesus himself, a testimony of the Word. This ensured that the reliance upon human intellect, human interpretations, human ‘scholarship’, deferring to another human being for guidance, would no longer be needed. We can receive great truth by the text, by the testimonies in the NT, by the inspired sharing of those who dwell in faith with this same Comforter in Jesus name, yet we each are equal in our right to know for ourselves, we need not follow blindly, we need no hierarchy of human beings to guide us, we are directly connected to God’s Word and Truth through Jesus and the gift of the Holy Spirit.
No man on earth can give to me what Jesus has given in this gift, I turn to this for my own direction, not to any other human on earth, for they are flawed and can be misled by their own egos and desires, and I am not required to trust in men, but to trust in the Lord and His eternal truth.
We can receive the fullness of God in our own hearts and souls and minds through Jesus.
NOTHING in Muhammad ever revealed such a beautiful and perfect truth, therefore Muslims all defer to errant human thought, the horrid example of one human being claiming holiness in evil acts and make this their standard of morality and truth, cut off completely from their own affirmation by God Himself. Muhammad in this respect becomes their ‘God’, nothing else can come to earth, it was done with Muhammad, he did not provide a path for all to come to God through him to receive continued truth and revelations in their own lives this far down the road.
The Gospel is preserved for all of eternity because it is not dependent upon written text or human interpretation but is given to all who seek by the gift and power of the Holy Spirit, the most amazing truth on earth is that God loves us all and seeks to enjoin His love and truth to us individually and perfectly in this manner.
No man on earth can give to me what Jesus has given in this gift, I turn to this for my own direction, not to any other human on earth, for they are flawed and can be misled by their own egos and desires, and I am not required to trust in men, but to trust in the Lord and His eternal truth.
We can receive the fullness of God in our own hearts and souls and minds through Jesus.
NOTHING in Muhammad ever revealed such a beautiful and perfect truth, therefore Muslims all defer to errant human thought, the horrid example of one human being claiming holiness in evil acts and make this their standard of morality and truth, cut off completely from their own affirmation by God Himself. Muhammad in this respect becomes their ‘God’, nothing else can come to earth, it was done with Muhammad, he did not provide a path for all to come to God through him to receive continued truth and revelations in their own lives this far down the road.
The Gospel is preserved for all of eternity because it is not dependent upon written text or human interpretation but is given to all who seek by the gift and power of the Holy Spirit, the most amazing truth on earth is that God loves us all and seeks to enjoin His love and truth to us individually and perfectly in this manner.
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Booklover
Guest
Booklover;5081122:
Yep, I know the feeling. Sometimes I feel like I can’t stand anymore also. If I’d pulled my hair out every time I get frustrated with Muslims’ illogic and nonsense, I’d be bald by nowThanks Vickie -
I can’t stand it any more.
Our muslim members take one little word, twisted to fix their own agenda and that’s that.
The chapters and verses I posted are there, right there in the Bible for all to read. And you know what, it’s pretty clear to understand what the message is.
Vickie
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jakasaki
Guest
Indeed!!!
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jakasaki
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famdigy
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jakasaki;5081138:
that would be amusing, please be sure to send me a picture afterwardYep, I know the feeling. Sometimes I feel like I can’t stand anymore also. If I’d pulled my hair out every time I get frustrated with Muslims’ illogic and nonsense, I’d be bald by now
Vickie
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Booklover
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How can you make 7th century tribal life relevant for today? Do you expect the world to stay in the one time period till the end of time? How can it be relevant to those it curses and calls the worst of creation and promises so much torment to? How can a book like that be for all “mankind” as you state? That book is meant solely for the the followers of Muhammad and no one else! Period!
No, why? And we don’t accept anything “according to Islam”. If previous scriptures were completely destroyed, like what Muslims did to the library at Alexandria, how could Muhammad prove his “validity” by claiming that he was prophesied in earlier scriptures? Your whole contention is completely absurd as is all Islamic “logc” I might add, not to mention the sheer arrogance of it all. Muslims get offended if we state that the Quran is man made, but it doesn’t bother them if they offend us by stating that our scriptures don’t even deserve preserving! The Word of God is God, not just words in a book as you claim “next to God”… Now who’s ascribing partners to God?
As for the rest, it’s simply your opinion and means nothing to us! Everything you say isn’t there is there for those who search for the truth.Perhaps I underestimated you?
I don’t have question about it, really.
Luke 20:1 One day as he was teaching the people in the temple courts and preaching the gospel, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, together with the elders, came up to him.
What Gospel was “Luke” talking about? The book he was writing? I think not.
Acts 8:25 When they had testified and proclaimed the word of the Lord, Peter and John returned to Jerusalem, preaching the gospel in many Samaritan villages. Same phrase, same author, different book. What gospel were they preaching? The same Gospel Jesus was preaching is what I reckon. Which the Qur’an mysteriously calls “Injeel.” Why? I don’t know.Why it bothers you is more an interesting question to me. What was the Greek word used, I wonder?
I think your understanding is flawed, actually. Since you assume the message Jesus was preaching was about death and resurrection. But I find him teaching many other things, but not Trinity, not worship of himself, nor what else you claim, exactly. So…
Vickie
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tomarin
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Not sure how religious you are, but isn’t the whole premise of our religion (Christianity) that a “Syrian peasant from the 1st century” as Hillaire Beloc called him had an important message for us today?
It seems to me that any major religion has the task before of it of at least appearing relevant to modern people (that’s what Vatican II was about, at least in part). I don’t see why the harsh criticism, especially when it seems likely you would also criticize Islam for being “barbaric, medieval, etc.”. If Islam’s practitioners want it to be modern, why discourage them? It would be better for everyone involved if that were to happen, in my opinion.
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tomarin
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That’s a boldly presumptuous statement. I for one am interested in her opinion. I’ll judge whether it’s worth more or less than yours, thanks.
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Booklover
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I get so tired of the “comments from the peanut gallery” from the “Catholic” apologists for Islam! You just don’t get it do you? Where did Jesus state that all men have to have long hair and beards for instance? Muslim men have to sport beards because Muhammad did! Muslims have to do everything the way he did! [Moderator note: removed uncharitable comments] What’s spiritual or enlightening about all that? How do those things make anyone a better person?
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Please enlighten us as to how stonings, floggings, cutting off of hands, beheadings are relevant to modern life? Muslims believe these things are to be done until the end of time! Do you believe such things should be practiced in the 21st century? And yes, the Muslim mentality is barbaric and primitive and it’s Islam that keeps them that way!
Vickie
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Booklover
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Booklover
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I am Roman Catholic and proud of it, and as such I don’t defend Islam, the enemy of civilization and all we hold dear! Funny you should mention Hillaire Belloc, who also warned us that there would probably be a resurgence of Islam, and how right he was!
Vickie
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tomarin
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Every religion has that kind of stuff in it: Jews have dietary laws – how does that make one a better person? The point of religion is to bring you closer to God, not to make you a better person. I’m not even sure you absolutely need religion to become a better person.
Non-believers often regard these things as marginal to the “real” point of religion, which is its ethical and moral teachings. But practitioners of the religion rarely see it that way. What the nonbelivers see as marginal, irrational stuff the practitioners see as central to the religion.
Not at all, I hope. And most of the muslim apologists here don’t either, I think. Oftentimes the practices you’re talking about are cultural and not strictly religious (although in practice the two things get confused of course).
By treating Islam as something essential and immutable you’re unwittingly giving aid and comfort to those who would reinforce the barbaric and primitive things you allegedly don’t like.
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tomarin
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I don’t defend Islam either. I believe Mohammad was a false prophet. I do feel however that it is not necessary to be antagonistic to people of other faiths in order to be a good catholic, and that other people (not just my co-religionists) deserve to be treated according to certain standards of decency (such as not insulting their religion without provocation).
I also think the adherents of Islam deserve more respect than you accord them because 1. they are fellow human beings, 2. they are fellow monotheists and 3. while their religion denies the divinity of Jesus it does hold him and Mary in high regard, going as far as affirming the Virgin Birth.
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Booklover
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Oh? Can you get closer to God by being a bad person?
What are the ethical and moral teachings of Islam? Can you give us any example that surpasses what Jesus taught?
Really? How can you be sure of that since they’re allowed to lie to the unbelievers? Do they not approve of stoning for adultery? Check their posts better!
Huh? Not sure what you mean by this. Islam is all around and the atrocities continue wherever it goes. Do you mean we should bury our heads in the sand and pretend nothing bad is going on?
By the way, why do you keep defending the undefensible?
Vickie
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Booklover
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Islam wants to destroy everything we believe in and you think I shouldn’t be antagonistic towards it! You must be joking! Do absurd teachings deserve respect?
When Muslims treat others as their equals and stop wanting to either subjugate or kill them, I’ll change my opinion of them. Do Muslims really hold Jesus in high regard? Do you even bother to read what they post?
Vickie
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neploho
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Didn’t something very much along those lines happen to convert Edith Stein to the Church?He couldn’t have been a devout Catholic if he didn’t believe in the crucifixion and what it means.
Sounds pretty phony! He picks up a Quran and bingo! he instantly accepts what’s in it! Bogus!
Vickie
Story of a Soul? Something like that.
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neploho
Guest
Are there some Ismalis here?
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