Islam/Qur'an

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Rarer_Way_Prior

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I’m unaware if we have any Moslems here with us these days. I don’t come around much anymore. In any case, It would be appreciated for some commentary on the religion itself and its sacred text. No bashing, flaming, or anything else inconsiderate (especially mention to terrorists) here. Please if you will, just write a bit about Islam and/or the Qur’an so I can deeper my understanding of what they’re all about. Now I’m not saying nothing negative necessarily, because as I understand it, Mohammad has caused some heat lately. Merely enlighten me, but be kind in nature.

P.S. No bogus claims like Arabic is the mother of all languages.
 
There are Muslims here too, as well as former Muslims who are now Christians.
 
Rarer_Way_Prior said:
😛

Thanks much Eucharisted. 🙂

I’m looking for… anything. What do you think is important to Islam? Maybe clarify something about it. 'Gotta run now. TIA
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From my study of Islam and reading of the Qu’ran, I’ve come to realize some important things to Islam:
  • Believing in a single-person Deity
  • Believing Mohammed is God’s last Prophet
  • The five pillars of Islam
Some information on Islam which Muslims don’t know about or refuse to acknowledge or attempt to hide from people:
 
mhamzah1 said:
What I dont understand is why would you want to know about Islam from a Catholic. After all you won’t study Physics from a Biology teacher, so why study about Islam from a Christian.
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Even a Biology teacher could have majored in Physics. There are Moslems here as well. You need to calm yourself; bring it down a notch. Charity my friend. 🙂
 
**
We have to move slowly since you have not pointed out any particular area. Please follow just a few things at a time:
  1. The belief that “there is no God except One God/Allah and that Muhammad is a messenger of Allah.” (For Allah you can substitute God).
  2. The belief that Allah sent messengers to all nations of the world. Some of them are named and well known. The others are not mentioned by their names. Allah did not send messengers to the children of abraham (Jews and Christians and Muslims) only.
  3. To believe in all he messengers of Allah including Adam, Noah, Abraham, Ishmael, Issac, Jacob, Joseph, Moses, Jesus. (Include here Karishna and Budha too if you like) A disbelief in any one of them will throw a muslim out of the pale of Islam.
  4. The belief that Allah spoke to all nations of the world and revealed Himself to them through His messengers. He revealed himself and gave messages, some of which were written down in book form. Muslims are to believe in all the revealed books. If any one says he does not believe in any one book, say bible or Quran, he cannot be a Muslim.
  5. the belief in all the angels of God.
And a few more things. Any particular question will be answered, God Willing.**
 
Rarer_Way_Prior said:
I’m unaware if we have any Moslems here with us these days. I don’t come around much anymore. In any case, It would be appreciated for some commentary on the religion itself and its sacred text. No bashing, flaming, or anything else inconsiderate (especially mention to terrorists) here. Please if you will, just write a bit about Islam and/or the Qur’an so I can deeper my understanding of what they’re all about. Now I’m not saying nothing negative necessarily, because as I understand it, Mohammad has caused some heat lately. Merely enlighten me, but be kind in nature.

P.S. No bogus claims like Arabic is the mother of all languages.
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I will risk and take the bait

(The religion its self)
My experience of religion/s is much more the people and what and how they do. ie the bums in the pews b4 the catechism.
I know lots of Catholics that do not know they worship the deity of Islam.

I live in Country Australia in a town of around 22,000.

I am very close to our Islamic community i pray with them almost every Friday and some terabi ect.

The people in our community are seemingly great. They are very devout to God. leave aside any they have the wrong God stuff.

they live the commandment of putting YHWH first. So much so i am shamed for my Catholic family who would put the footy first, and chat in mass etc.

They put YHWH / Allah first but are quite ignorant of Islam and the Quran except for what we may call “the Christian values” these they know well. They are hard to challenge on Quran and hadiths if it is a difficult question they back away.

A classic story would be a Jamat (islamic evangelist) much like the redemptist priests came to visit.

He spoke of Mahomed (pbuh) with a story that goes like this not exact i am sure.
That the Prophet (pbuh) entertained a traveller but had little food so instructed his wife to serve the guest and dimm the lights so he would not notice the family did not eat.

This story was much detailed longer and went on for while.

I had heard this story b4 and i think i was told it was a companion of the Prophet (pbuh).

This man had tears streaming down his face as he told the story and i could not help but feel he was talking of My Brother Yahooshua (pbwh).

Now at this time i knew Mohamed (pbuh) to be a man of wealth so did not credit the mans story.

Given where the man was, in a good place with a good image of his leader, i could only praise YHWH for the love and depth i saw, that it may continue.

(its sacred text)
As 4 the Quran get one and read it in proper order not as it is compiled.
I assume you already know some of the history of the people b4 the Quran and as it was recited. If not seek b4 u read.

When i read the bible books i start with the attitude of how can this be true rather than the i will prove this wrong.

Do the same with the Quran and pray that you will see only YHWH truth.

I oft hear people use the “t” word and say it is a fruit of Islam but could i not argue the same of my community?
How is it then thorns and apples are seemingly on the same bush?

I dont believe religion bears fruit but the spirit bears the fruit.

Maybe the spirit is bigger in love than our “My Religion” small mindedness.

Yahooshua (pbwh) saw light in the Samaritans despised by his people, gave to the gentile, despised by his people.

I must be the most blessed man on this planet i love Yahooshua (pbwh) in any person regardless of their religion.

PS if you want to have understanding of Muslims you need to understand and look at Hadiths also. I dont see them as sacred texts so did not speek of them. (no offence to Islamic brethren please feel welcome to correct me on this)
 
I think Islam had an amazing unifying affect on the Arabian peoples and their nations. For that, I am thankful. Islam has many good morals to learn from. I think one thing that separates Islam from other religions is how practical it is. Islam is a religion that affects daily life moreso than any other religion. Islam is the only religion that talks about Muslim banking, interest rates, dress, eating, charity, war, government, leaders…Islam is a jack of all trades when it comes to moral obligations. This is why so many countries have set up whole governments and economies based on Islam.

Islam, like any religion, has it’s bad parts. But for a good percentage of it, it’s a good religion like any other. If it were a bad religion, I don’t think it could have lasted this long! 😛
 
AJTheMan said:
I think Islam had an amazing unifying affect on the Arabian peoples and their nations. For that, I am thankful. Islam has many good morals to learn from. I think one thing that separates Islam from other religions is how practical it is. Islam is a religion that affects daily life moreso than any other religion. Islam is the only religion that talks about Muslim banking, interest rates, dress, eating, charity, war, government, leaders…Islam is a jack of all trades when it comes to moral obligations. This is why so many countries have set up whole governments and economies based on Islam.

Islam, like any religion, has it’s bad parts. But for a good percentage of it, it’s a good religion like any other. If it were a bad religion, I don’t think it could have lasted this long! 😛
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**You have written good detail. Please know that Islam is non-political in nature from the very beginning. The prophet Muhammad was not a political person yearning for fame. He was the greatest saint that could ever be.

He led a pious life. Just at the age of 30 and afterwards, he used to take some food and water and go into a cave away from the city (Cave named Hira) and he used to remain there praying to Allah for many days. That was his life befoe allah spoke to him onenight.

Allah sent the angel and gave some message, “Recite in the name of the Lord who created. Create dman from a clot of blood…”

Later people foffered him money, most beautiful woman, offered him kingdom of Arabia. He said, " I do not want gold." “I do not want any woman.” “I do not want to be any king.”

It is long story.Now I come to the point.Like the Jews at the time of Jesus, the Muslims have gone astray and lost all political power, nearly all over the world. They have Msulim states,but only for the name sake. The Muslim religious leaders are yearning to get back soem political power where they could establish a government of their own Shariyat (Muslim Law).

Most of the Muslim leaders are political persons. They do not have any spiritual leader (Imam.). The Muslims in Egypt and bangladesh and pakistan, all have tried to come in political power to establish a government of God.

Like the Jews of the time of Jesus,theyhave failed to do so. The reason is that the Muslims are very much divided politically, spiritually, financially, educationally, morally. they can never succeed the way they are going.

Of course they are offering prayers in large numbers in mosques. But there is no real guidance. Their mosques are void of any guidance. they are not peaceful. They have to come up inmany ways, say morally too.

The problem is that they do not understand the emaning of the most basic things of Islam. They are promoting hatred too. And Killing of peaceful innocent persons.

I can prove that the present day Muslims do ot understand the meaning of the word “Kafir.” So what canany one expect fromthem. The religion itself is alright.But the followers are far away from the real truth. Astaghfirullah (May Allah forgive me.)**
 
Rarer_Way_Prior said:
It would be appreciated for some commentary on the religion itself and its sacred text.
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“Some of the parchment pages in the Yemeni hoard seemed to date back to the seventh and eighth centuries A.D., or Islam’s first two centuries – they were fragments, in other words, of perhaps the oldest Korans in existence. What’s more, some of these fragments revealed small but intriguing aberrations from the standard Koranic text. Such aberrations, though not surprising to textual historians, are troublingly at odds with the orthodox Muslim belief that the Koran as it has reached us today is quite simply the perfect, timeless, and unchanging Word of God.”
Yemeni fragments.
Eucharisted said:
Arabic is the father of all tongues. 😃
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:rotfl:
AJTheMan said:
I think one thing that separates Islam from other religions is how practical it is. Islam is a religion that affects daily life moreso than any other religion. Islam is the only religion that talks about Muslim banking, interest rates, dress, eating, charity, war, government, leaders…Islam is a jack of all trades when it comes to moral obligations. This is why so many countries have set up whole governments and economies based on Islam.
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So are the secular laws we have today in US, UK, Canada, etc…

Even those secular laws outperform Islamic law in many aspects, else we would have seen the Islamic countries as “developed countries”.

In my view Christianity concentrate on the heavenly teachings and leaves the earthy ones to you to decide, while Islam concentrate on the earthy teachings while ignoring the heavenly teachings altogether.
 
planten said:
**
…Any particular question will be answered, God Willing.**
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A while back you said,
planten said:
…
There is a hell of a difference in the teachings of Jesus and the words of Paul.
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I asked the following:
What are the teachings of Jesus? You have said in the past that the Bible had been corrupted by the introduction of ideas such as the Trinity and those of that dastardly Paul of Tarsus. … You have also said in prior posts that Jesus taught “many” good things. If that is true, and the Qur’an is to correct the “corruptions” of prior revelations, where in the Qur’an are the “good teachings” of Jesus such as the Lord’s Prayer and the Sermon on the Mount? If those are “corruptions” also, what do Muslims consider the “good teachings” of Jesus?
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Still waiting for an answer. Or is Allah not willing?
 
sedonaman said:
A while back you said,

I asked the following:
Still waiting for an answer. Or is Allah not willing?
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He might be busy.

But don’t hold your breath. He makes wild accusations and presumptions. It’s why I try not to reply to his posts.
 
Steven_John said:
I will risk and take the bait
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lol Sorry! 'Never looked at what I wrote in another perspective. I’m not going to start ripping beliefs to shreds lol. I came for a better understanding.
Steven_John said:
I know lots of Catholics that do not know they worship the deity of Islam.
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And with that you have those who refuse to believe they do.
Steven_John said:
They put YHWH / Allah first but are quite ignorant of Islam and the Quran except for what we may call “the Christian values” these they know well. They are hard to challenge on Quran and hadiths if it is a difficult question they back away.
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Your family or the Islamic community?
Steven_John said:
(its sacred text)
As 4 the Quran get one and read it in proper order not as it is compiled.
I assume you already know some of the history of the people b4 the Quran and as it was recited. If not seek b4 u read.

When i read the bible books i start with the attitude of how can this be true rather than the i will prove this wrong.

Do the same with the Quran and pray that you will see only YHWH truth.
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Will do.
Steven_John said:
I oft hear people use the “t” word and say it is a fruit of Islam but could i not argue the same of my community?
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That just makes me angry.
Steven_John said:
I dont believe religion bears fruit but the spirit bears the fruit.
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That’s ultimately true.
Steven_John said:
PS if you want to have understanding of Muslims you need to understand and look at Hadiths also. I dont see them as sacred texts so did not speek of them. (no offence to Islamic brethren please feel welcome to correct me on this)
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I’ll look into it. What are they exactly?
 
Sam_777 said:
“Some of the parchment pages in the Yemeni hoard seemed to date back to the seventh and eighth centuries A.D., or Islam’s first two centuries – they were fragments, in other words, of perhaps the oldest Korans in existence. What’s more, some of these fragments revealed small but intriguing aberrations from the standard Koranic text. Such aberrations, though not surprising to textual historians, are troublingly at odds with the orthodox Muslim belief that the Koran as it has reached us today is quite simply the perfect, timeless, and unchanging Word of God.”
Yemeni fragments
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What do they claim?
 
Sam_777 said:
“Some of the parchment pages in the Yemeni hoard seemed to date back to the seventh and eighth centuries A.D., or Islam’s first two centuries – they were fragments, in other words, of perhaps the oldest Korans in existence. What’s more, some of these fragments revealed small but intriguing aberrations from the standard Koranic text. Such aberrations, though not surprising to textual historians, are troublingly at odds with the orthodox Muslim belief that the Koran as it has reached us today is quite simply the perfect, timeless, and unchanging Word of God.”
Yemeni fragments.
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Thanks for the link 🙂
 
Rarer_Way_Prior said:
lol Sorry! 'Never looked at what I wrote in another perspective. I’m not going to start ripping beliefs to shreds lol. I came for a better understanding.

Forgive me i must have listen to satan and though you might be trolling, CAF can be a place to beat up on Muslims. Figured a lash or two for me rather than them would b ok.

And with that you have those who refuse to believe they do. Yes i dont blame some people we all see different things and have different experience, it can be hard to look beyond ones own self

Your family or the Islamic community?
Islamic community was my reference

That just makes me angry.
Yeh for me i get sadness, some times very deep and into great great pain and tears, thank YHWH for Yahooshua that i can leave from this suffering for them, it is not my place to say but i wonder how many of us walk in the religion more than the spirit

I’ll look into it. What are they exactly?
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To the best of my explanation, they are sayings of Mahomed (pbuh) life they were gathered some time after his passing.

To my understanding for the first century they were only oral. The third khalifa (leader) set to compile them, some 130 years later again this work was completed.
From what i can work out there a lots of them but Mulsims i meet speak of the 6 most authentic collections. They are ranked in order of Authenticity.
Why Hadiths, they are the “way of Muhammad (pbuh)” Sunna.
Muslims oft express i follow the Quran and the Sunna.

So my take is the Hadiths are tools to expand and show practically the teaching of the Quran.

At this remark is where things get messy or they can be clear for them, In my experience only, if a community in dispute over an action to take they will 1st look to the Quran, 2nd to Hadith (according to its rank) 3rd a scholar.
Not a bad plan and i have seen it work well, i have also seen it make clear division. One man interoperates this way and the other that.
The beauty in the division is the passion to do what is right for Allah and it is unyielding.

I do not speak for Islamic religion and may Allah / YHWH for give my errors, you will need to seek and pray to clarify my offerings. If my words bring offence to a Brother or Sister please know it was not intended. May Allah / YHWH be glorified and all of the Prophets (pbut) be respected not for for their sins (for this we beg mercy on them from The Most Merciful) but for Allah / YHWH guidance to us through them.

i will be as i will be, you have free will so can choose who you see
 
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