S
Sirach14
Guest
Robert Spencer, author of book, talks about Islam the way Islam is. He pulls no punches.
washtimes.com/culture/20050823-105218-4831r.htm
washtimes.com/culture/20050823-105218-4831r.htm
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G
gilliam
Guest
*His newest book is The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades) *
Somehow I don’t think some here will read this book.
Somehow I don’t think some here will read this book.
M
Matt25
Guest
The word Islam shares the same root as the word Salaam meaning “Peace”, see islam.about.com/blintroa.htm hence those who say Islam is a religion of peace have a good case.
It amuses me no end that those who insist that Islam is a violent religion that justifies terrorism are often the same people that say Christianity is a religion of peace that justifies nuking Hiroshima and/or pre-emptively invading Iraq.
It amuses me no end that those who insist that Islam is a violent religion that justifies terrorism are often the same people that say Christianity is a religion of peace that justifies nuking Hiroshima and/or pre-emptively invading Iraq.
D
Darrel
Guest
Islam can never be a true religion of peace until it can exist and dominate a free culture without an Islamic government. That happen anyplace in a free democracy that is civilized?
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Adonis33
Guest
Not a good example. Hiroshima was not nuked in the name of Christianity. Many people try to make the arguement that Christians are just as violent by mentioning the IRA or McViegh. The IRA did not bomb in the name of Catholicism, and McViegh was not particularly religious.
I think Islam means “submission”. Correct me if I’m wrong.
M
Matt25
Guest
It means both peace and submission. A Muslim being one who submits to God.
I did not say that Hiroshima was bombed in the name of Christianity. I said that some people who say Islam is inherently violent also say that the use of weapons of mass destruction against Japanese civillians can be justified by Christian doctrine. Neither Islam nor Christianity are religions of aggression although many Muslims and Christians seek to distort their faith to justify their own evil deeds.
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Adonis33
Guest
I see your point of view. However, I feel their is a difference between a Christians oppinion on how to conduct a war, and a Muslim who believes that he will go to “72 Virgins” by blowing up some infidels.
Many good Catholics of concience (spelling) can disagree on the war in Iraq, or whether or not the nuking of Hiroshima was morally just. However, nobody can argue that strapping a bomb to you and bombing a cafe is morally acceptable.
J
jman507
Guest
Wow, lets see Cristianity, means something like another Christ, but yet it is taught that we all have our fallen nature, we will never be as blameless as Christ. I guess when we get to heaven purified will be as pure and blameless as Christ.
Just because Islam is close to Salaam which means peace, well that could just as well mean once the whole world is converted then there will be peace.
As they say never judge a book by its cover, you cannot judge it by its name.
M
Matt25
Guest
Not many Muslims think that suicide bombing is morally acceptable either.
Incidentally suicide bombing in the modern era was pioneered by the mostly Hindu Tamil Tigers of Sri Lanka, not to mention the mostly Shintoist Kamikaze pilots of Japan. Poor Christian America besieged by all these murderous world religions whose believers are overwhelmingly committed to destroying themselves because they hate freedom so much.
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Adonis33
Guest
Who started the practice of suicide bombing is irrelevent. I do not think anybody has clamed it was exclusive the Islamic terrorist.
I guess my point is, When the Ex-Isrealie soldier shot and killed the 4 (?) Palestinians - the Act was condemned by the Prime Minister, and even the most right wing in Isreal. They wouldn’t even let him be buried in a military cemetary. The actions of the IRA was conemned by the Catholic Church.
Who in the Islamic community condemns the acts of terror perpetuated by the terrorist? What we have are leaders in the Islamic community calling for these attacks. I should not have to search a web site looking for a condemnation of terrorism. They should be more public.(Maybe the media isn’t reporting it).
M
Matt25
Guest
Darn right the media isn’t reporting it. Muslims practically fall over each other in condemning terrorism but the Corporate Media doesn’t report it much. Nonetheless you can find it if you have the goodwill to look for it. It is more comforting though to think of all billion or so Muslims as enemies of freedom who love to kill Americans and Jews. That way the USA is always right isn’t it?
muhajabah.com/otherscondemn.php
cair-net.org/html/911statements.html
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Robert_Bay
Guest
Moving thread to Islam forum. Discussions about Islam should be conducted in that forum.
Please be polite when discussing other religions.
Please be polite when discussing other religions.
H
Hashi_Al-Eritre
Guest
Perhaps some of the members posting on this thread should read into the history of the Crusades…
M
meedo
Guest
"I see your point of view. However, I feel their is a difference between a Christians oppinion on how to conduct a war, and a Muslim who believes that he will go to “72 Virgins” by blowing up some infidels.
"
You know , there is alot in the west who would rather dismiss the muslims who do these acts that they do it because of the reason above . I guess it satisfies somthing inside them. At least now they dismissed the notion that there ar epeople who would gladly die for the liberation of their land , specially if some of these people were females !!
I swear By Allah, the west can do a Doctorate in this 72 Virgins hadeeth while 95% of muslims never even knwo about it .
I dont see muslims looking for virgins through suicide in Sweden, Austria, malasya, Argentina , Peru , Brazil, Romania,Norway, Finland, Greece, ect
You know why ? because for them these countries didnt harm them and didnt have a historyt of occupying them .
I would not commit suicide right now even if you guarantee me 1000000000 Virgins in heaven. But i will gladly fight to death who ever invades my country without even waiting for any women at all in heaven.
We are humans like you , and if you fail to understand that we have ligitimate grieviences then forget any soloutions.
You will always call us virgin loving suicides and will call you racist double standard imperialists .
The problem is not in SUICIDE bombing, the problem is in killing innocent people.
When i die in the battle field and i knwo i am dying 100% due to the strength of the enemy this isnt a suicide . But when i AIM at innocent people who done me now harm then its suicide and Violence againts civilians.
The problem isnt alone on our side. These countries that feel they can rule the world better understand that they will face teh consquences of their agression and arrogance. People have been condemning the palestinians while no body cares if they get their land back or not , well they dont care about what you think too.
There is some tough work among ALL of us . The west shoudl recognioze his immoral past and problems that it created in teh world and be responsible and sacrifciing enough to solve it with ACTIONS and not words and those lost fanatic Muslims should understand that even though there is aggression against Alot of their countries , that doesnt allow retaliating at innocent peopel who did them no wrong .
If you dont accept that things go both ways then there is no hope . We dont have less pride or dignity than you .
I am sorry for teh blunt truth , but i put it to you so that you better understand . You can take all the virgins or non virgins we dont really care . We just dont want invasion and injustices for palestinians and others and stop supporting our dictators and then afterwards blaming us for them.
Peace
"
You know , there is alot in the west who would rather dismiss the muslims who do these acts that they do it because of the reason above . I guess it satisfies somthing inside them. At least now they dismissed the notion that there ar epeople who would gladly die for the liberation of their land , specially if some of these people were females !!
I swear By Allah, the west can do a Doctorate in this 72 Virgins hadeeth while 95% of muslims never even knwo about it .
I dont see muslims looking for virgins through suicide in Sweden, Austria, malasya, Argentina , Peru , Brazil, Romania,Norway, Finland, Greece, ect
You know why ? because for them these countries didnt harm them and didnt have a historyt of occupying them .
I would not commit suicide right now even if you guarantee me 1000000000 Virgins in heaven. But i will gladly fight to death who ever invades my country without even waiting for any women at all in heaven.
We are humans like you , and if you fail to understand that we have ligitimate grieviences then forget any soloutions.
You will always call us virgin loving suicides and will call you racist double standard imperialists .
The problem is not in SUICIDE bombing, the problem is in killing innocent people.
When i die in the battle field and i knwo i am dying 100% due to the strength of the enemy this isnt a suicide . But when i AIM at innocent people who done me now harm then its suicide and Violence againts civilians.
The problem isnt alone on our side. These countries that feel they can rule the world better understand that they will face teh consquences of their agression and arrogance. People have been condemning the palestinians while no body cares if they get their land back or not , well they dont care about what you think too.
There is some tough work among ALL of us . The west shoudl recognioze his immoral past and problems that it created in teh world and be responsible and sacrifciing enough to solve it with ACTIONS and not words and those lost fanatic Muslims should understand that even though there is aggression against Alot of their countries , that doesnt allow retaliating at innocent peopel who did them no wrong .
If you dont accept that things go both ways then there is no hope . We dont have less pride or dignity than you .
I am sorry for teh blunt truth , but i put it to you so that you better understand . You can take all the virgins or non virgins we dont really care . We just dont want invasion and injustices for palestinians and others and stop supporting our dictators and then afterwards blaming us for them.
Peace
J
Joe_Monahan
Guest
Reminder to all
This forum has been relatively remarkable of late for the level of charity and civility shown by posters, Christian and Muslim, to one another. Let’s work at maintaining that. At least from my perspective, it allows for threads that make much more interesting reading than those common in the recent past which were characterized more by rants than discussion.
Thank you.
Joe
This forum has been relatively remarkable of late for the level of charity and civility shown by posters, Christian and Muslim, to one another. Let’s work at maintaining that. At least from my perspective, it allows for threads that make much more interesting reading than those common in the recent past which were characterized more by rants than discussion.
Thank you.
Joe
M
meedo
Guest
I Appologise if i broke the rules of the forum. I didnt mean to, i was just speaking my heart out .
I appreciate the work you do brother Joe really , and i am committed to help you preserve this lovely forum .
When i posted the post above i spoke from my heart as someone who is hurt .
May we never have any reason to fight. May God show us all his path of mercy and justice and love for the other. May he rid us of racism and bigorty and persecution and may he guide our leaders to the best of our nations.
Ameen
Meedo
Cairo
Egypt
I appreciate the work you do brother Joe really , and i am committed to help you preserve this lovely forum .
When i posted the post above i spoke from my heart as someone who is hurt .
May we never have any reason to fight. May God show us all his path of mercy and justice and love for the other. May he rid us of racism and bigorty and persecution and may he guide our leaders to the best of our nations.
Ameen
Meedo
Cairo
Egypt
L
Lance
Guest
Hiroshima and Iraq have nothing to do with Christianity. There was never a claim that they did. The terrorist at least claim what they are doing is in the name of Islam. Just because the words have the same root does not give them a right to claim they are a religion of peace. Actions speak louder than words.
M
meedo
Guest
Well if teh actions speak louder than words then what about 3 million vietnameese killed for a useless war of agression!!!
Doesnt all the christian american soldiers have any morals to preepmt this war ? or wasnt they christian back then ?
what would you feel when your skin is bieng boiled with Napalm Just because you want to be a comunist ??! can u answer that question??
what did the vietnameese do to you for you to do this?!!
Nothing !!!
People dont fight or suicide bomb for teh sake of just religion. people have grieviences and they arent heared. !!!
If you have any perception you will see that the countries that had been targeted for these attacks no matter hjow we disagree with these attacks have been all aggressive countries in nature and injust in their policies .
People use the religion as a catalyst for theri struggle but it is not what initiated them to do what they do . I mean yuou dont have suicide bombs in Argentina and sweden and Finland and Maly and malasya . Theer are muslims with numbers in all these countries. Why isnt there suicide bombings there?!
Islam doesnt say to you to go and strap yr self explosive into a bus of civilians . It tells you to defend yourself against agression even if you have to die for it . Now it is not the responsibility of Islam that people feel that they have to defend themselves against teh US and the UK .
YOU have to prove that this situation isnt really agrressive to the countries invaded.
Islam is out of the question and the IRA fought againts the protestant north because they are English invadors from another creed . Thats a fact .
if all the terrorists in teh world try their best they wouldnt even come close to 1/10 of the number of Civilians and Native americans that America anheilated in its wars!!!
Now dont tell me that all of a sudden americans forgot about their bibles totally and suddenly became unchristian. They were christian in every step of the way !! or else you must be saying that the faith tehy hold couldnt deter them ffrom doing worng which is ofcourse mreo horrible!!!
Sorry but i dont like throwing briks whilke your whole CITY is made of glass!!!
Peace
Doesnt all the christian american soldiers have any morals to preepmt this war ? or wasnt they christian back then ?
what would you feel when your skin is bieng boiled with Napalm Just because you want to be a comunist ??! can u answer that question??
what did the vietnameese do to you for you to do this?!!
Nothing !!!
People dont fight or suicide bomb for teh sake of just religion. people have grieviences and they arent heared. !!!
If you have any perception you will see that the countries that had been targeted for these attacks no matter hjow we disagree with these attacks have been all aggressive countries in nature and injust in their policies .
People use the religion as a catalyst for theri struggle but it is not what initiated them to do what they do . I mean yuou dont have suicide bombs in Argentina and sweden and Finland and Maly and malasya . Theer are muslims with numbers in all these countries. Why isnt there suicide bombings there?!
Islam doesnt say to you to go and strap yr self explosive into a bus of civilians . It tells you to defend yourself against agression even if you have to die for it . Now it is not the responsibility of Islam that people feel that they have to defend themselves against teh US and the UK .
YOU have to prove that this situation isnt really agrressive to the countries invaded.
Islam is out of the question and the IRA fought againts the protestant north because they are English invadors from another creed . Thats a fact .
if all the terrorists in teh world try their best they wouldnt even come close to 1/10 of the number of Civilians and Native americans that America anheilated in its wars!!!
Now dont tell me that all of a sudden americans forgot about their bibles totally and suddenly became unchristian. They were christian in every step of the way !! or else you must be saying that the faith tehy hold couldnt deter them ffrom doing worng which is ofcourse mreo horrible!!!
Sorry but i dont like throwing briks whilke your whole CITY is made of glass!!!
Peace
L
Lance
Guest
No they were not Christian. They were what they have always been, American. I know this is a strange concept to you but we do not have a state religion. Our military is Christian, Jew, Muslim, Atheist, anamist maybe even some Hindu and Bhuddist.
L
Lance
Guest
meedo said:
Since you started the brick throwing, if you are in a war why don’t Muslims fight like men? Terrorism is a cowards way of fighting and in todays world Islam sems to have captured the market in terrorism. If you think the land of Israel belongs to you why not declare war on Israel and if God is on your side you will win according to your religion. Has America always been right? No, but we have tried to learn from our mistakes and in most cases we have. Egypt is one of the oldest countries in the world, you have had a long time to prefect you government and way of life, you have a lot of natural resources. Has Egypt in it’s whole 5000 year history given as much to charity and other nations as America has in the past 100 years/ I suggest you keep some of the bricks you don’t like to throw and start building yourself a better country. We have never been a nation of ‘empire’ builders.
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