Isn't "homophobe" the wrong word?

[otjm]

If you disagree with homosexuality/ or think it’s sinful then you’re probably a good Catholic.

It helps to be accurate. If you think that homosexual sexual relations are sinful, then you are in line with the Church. The Church holds that homosexual orientation is objectively disordered - that is, it is not the natural law, the law of nature to be oriented to same sex; it is the law of nature to be oriented to the opposite sex. The Church does not hold that people themselves are objectively disordered, but rather that their sexual orientation is disordered. The Church also hold that anyone having sexual relations outside of marriage are engaged in an act which is objectively seriously wrong, whether it is homosexual sex or heterosexual sex.

If you actively avoid homosexual people, then you might be a homophobe. (Let’s face it. If you actively avoid sinners, you are a very lonely person).

this is true.

The people who killed Matthew Shepard are homophobes.

Although Matthew Shepard’s mother is touring the United States with this message, one might do a little more research before accepting this lock, stock and barrel. There appears to be evidence that his killing was not about his sexual orientation, but was done by two drug addicts who were looking for money. The evidence apears to be that the issue was not his sexual orientation, but simply the fact that he was in the wrong place at the wrong time (that is, in their path). He has become the poster child of the gay rights organizations and it seems that no one really wants to discuss waht really happened; it is much more important that the image of what happened remain fresh in everyone’s minds - somewhat like “Don’t confuse me with the facts; I already have my mind made up.”

 

[johnlal]

… one might do a little more research before accepting this lock, stock and barrel. There appears to be evidence that his killing was not about his sexual orientation, but was done by two drug addicts who were looking for money. "

I wasn’t aware of this theory of Matthew’s death. Thanks for the information. I’m sure everybody has an opinion. My point is that the word “homophobe” would certainly apply to somebody who kills another person because he knows or suspects him to be gay.

 

[fix]

Let me provide an analog:
Worshiping false gods is very sinful. However, you wouldn’t be justified in hating or being afraid of hindus. You wouldn’t keep your children away from Hindu people. You wouldn’t physically harm people because they were hindus. You wouldn’t advocate laws that deny hindus of civil rights. You wouldn’t keep hindu people from marrying each other, even though their marriage rituals are different from ours. You might even study their history, appreciate their culture, and admire their historical heroes without adopting their beliefs.

Those who use the term homophobe often use it against folks who calmly assert Catholic teaching or explain natural law. It is not used only against those who advocate violence or who run in fear from homosexual persons.

 

[johnlal]

Those who use the term homophobe often use it against folks who calmly assert Catholic teaching or explain natural law. It is not used only against those who advocate violence or who run in fear from homosexual persons.

My point was that there is still a legitimate use for the word “homophobe”.

 

[otjm]

I wasn’t aware of this theory of Matthew’s death. Thanks for the information. I’m sure everybody has an opinion. My point is that the word “homophobe” would certainly apply to somebody who kills another person because he knows or suspects him to be gay.

I would agree with that; as to the cause of Matthew’s death, it is my understanding that after they captured the two who killed him, it later came out that their excuse (I refuse to use the word “reason”) had nothing to do with his sexual orientation. Needless to say, this didn’t exactly make front page news…

 

[Joshua99]

* * I think ‘homophobe’ is wrong as well as the term ‘gay’. I prefer to use the term ‘homosexual’.

 

[fix]

My point was that there is still a legitimate use for the word “homophobe”.

Perhaps in some academic setting. In reality, it is a highly politicized term used as a cudgel.

 

[johnlal]

Perhaps in some academic setting. In reality, it is a highly politicized term used as a cudgel.

I posted that somebody who kills another because he thinks or suspects the other is gay is a homophobe. And you disagree with me?

 

[fix]

I posted that somebody who kills another because he thinks or suspects the other is gay is a homophobe. And you disagree with me?

I am saying the term is used for anyone who understands homosexual acts are contrary to natural law. It is used to end a debate. It is a word used to silence people.

If it were used in a very strict way I would have no problem with it.

 

[johnlal]

I am saying the term is used for anyone who understands homosexual acts are contrary to natural law. It is used to end a debate. It is a word used to silence people.

If it were used in a very strict way I would have no problem with it.

Good. Now that we agree that homophobia exists, then the real question is this:
Do people oppose homosexuals’ political causes because they feel their Catholic requires them to, OR
Do people use their Catholic religion to justify their homophobia?

 

[fix]

Good. Now that we agree that homophobia exists, then the real question is this:
Do people oppose homosexuals’ political causes because they feel their Catholic requires them to, OR
Do people use their Catholic religion to justify their homophobia?

What is homophobic about rejecting the gay agenda?

 

[johnlal]

What is homophobic about rejecting the gay agenda?

That’s the question. What is the real reason people are rejecting homosexual interests? Is it truly religion or is it homophobia?

 

[fix]

That’s the question. What is the real reason people are rejecting homosexual interests? Is it truly religion or is it homophobia?

It is rejected because it is false and harmful.

 

[Nepenthe]

So then, it frightens you?

Did it frighten you before you came to full understanding of churchly matters?

 

[fix]

So then, it frightens you?

Did it frighten you before you came to full understanding of churchly matters?

Why does the word afraid apply here? I understand adultery is wrong, should I be afraid of adulterers? I understand tax cheating is wrong, does that make me afraid of tax cheats?

 

[Nepenthe]

Well? Are you?

If so, why don’t you direct your hatred towards them for a change?

 

[johnlal]

I think that we have established above that people sometimes act out of homophobia. The original post in this thread attempted to state that homophobia doesn’t exist. I think we now agree that homophobia does exist.

When people are killed or terrorized because they are gay, it cannot be doubted that the perpetrators are acting out of homophobia.

Therefore, I think it’s at least relevant to ask whether our laws are motivated by religion or by homophobia.

 

[fix]

Well? Are you?

Afraid? No, I am not afraid in the sense you use the term. I understand bad behavior is wrong and I hope and pray it will not be legitimized into civil law. The need to characterize people who oppose vice as “afraid” seems to be an effort to vilify people.

If so, why don’t you direct your hatred towards them for a change?

Calling truth hatred does not change truth. This thread is a good example of how language is intentionally changed in hopes reality will be changed.

 

[fix]

I think that we have established above that people sometimes act out of homophobia.

That depends on who is defining that term.

The original post in this thread attempted to state that homophobia doesn’t exist. I think we now agree that homophobia does exist.

Again, that depends on who is defining it.

When people are killed or terrorized because they are gay, it cannot be doubted that the perpetrators are acting out of homophobia.

Such people act gravely wrong. If you want to apply a descriptive term that is fine, but such a term should be used appropriately.

Therefore, I think it’s at least relevant to ask whether our laws are motivated by religion or by homophobia.

What does this have to do with violence?

 

[Nepenthe]

And calling hatred truth doesn’t change the hatred either.

I am sufficiently aware of your post history, fix.