Isn't it Better for Your Soul to be Unbaptized?

[pianistclare]

I’m not placing limits on God’s mercy when it comes to spiritual things, because he doesn’t do so.

God places limits on his mercy when it comes to temporal things. When God says “no” to prayers for good things, he places the limits, not me.

God is limited by his will.

How can I be at peace when bad things hit me and hurt me? Why would I be grateful when bad things happened? I’m not a masochist. “Thank you sir, may I have another” is what plebes tell their “frat brothers” during hazing, not what a beloved son tells his loving father.

Can’t lay my burden down. Not allowed. Must carry the cross, nothing optional about that.

I suppose you’ll persist in believe that you’re the only person on earth who ever suffered.
I’ll leave you to it.
But there’s nothing Catholic in that thought.
If you can’t see through the hurt, then you’ve got a bigger problem than just not understanding the will of God.

peace.

 

[John_Martin]

Five Talents, Two Talents, One Talent.
The one with Five and the one with Two were baptized the minute they saw the Treasure in front of them, and spent their days with the light of the infused Holy Spirit enlightening their minds and wills to see what is virtuous and to will it and to do it. In the end they poured all their wealth of life back into union with God.

The one with One Talent was only concerned that he might not succeed in a life of virtuous doing of all his doings, thus building up more treasures. So, he held back from embracing union with the One Talent, the Treasure of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, and was not baptized until the last minute; but then he had no treasure of Merit to share with the one who gives the Spirit. He had no holiness of being to pour into the Trinity as the Trinity pours its being into its own.

 

[BobCatholic]

I suppose you’ll persist in believe that you’re the only person on earth who ever suffered.

I never said that. I don’t believe that.

If you can’t see through the hurt, then you’ve got a bigger problem than just not understanding the will of God.

Can’t understand something not revealed to me.

 

[mikekle]

To the OP… While it may seem better to just wait and get baptized on one’s deathbed, there is a big problem with that: How do you know when you will die??

Pretty big gamble!

I have heard this statement many times before, but Im not sure it holds any water, I mean, sure, some people do die instantly, but the many many people I have known that died, it was not instant at all, they knew they were going to die well before it actually happened.

Even if someone jumps off a tall building to commit suicide, they still have that time going down to ask, maybe thats not a good example, better one would be a bad car accident, instant death is rare, there is usually a time frame when someone realizes they are going to die to when it happens. It only takes a couple milliseconds to ask the question…?

 

[fred_conty]

If someone is baptized and they are in a state of mortal sin, then they need to see a priest to get their sins absolved.

If someone is unbaptized but believe in Christ all they need to do is get baptized, and anyone is capable of baptizing anyone.

Thus, this leads me to my confusing conclusion: why is it better to be baptized if only a priest can save you? If you are dying in a state of mortal sin (and a priest can’t come in time) then it would seem that you would be going to Hell. On the other hand, if the same person was unbaptized then all they would need to do is ask someone to baptize them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit.

Please help me clear up my confusion!

What are the effects of Baptism?

Romans 6
You have been taught that when we were baptised in Christ Jesus we were baptised in his death, in other words, when we were baptised we went into the tomb with him and joined him in death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead by the Father’s glory, we too might live a new life.

This new life is “I no longer call you servants but friends.” Or as St. Paul put it, calling God, “Abba, Father”, placing us on intimate terms.

Jesus said “I am the vine and you are the branches.” We become one with him. And so this enables us to receive the Eucharist, “This is my body.” “This is my blood”. “As often as you do this, do this in memory of me.” Thru baptism, we have the gift of receiving this new manna from heaven, Jesus’ body and blood. Could anyone think of a personal relationship that could be closer? Postpone this?

He also mentioned “Lay up treasures for yourselves in heaven.” To be of heaven or his kingdom, we need to have his life in us to empower us to store treasures in heaven. For without his life in us we are only natural creatures and not heavenly beings who alone have the right to store heavenly treasures.

To postphone baptism does not consider the features above that unite us with Jesus and experience his life both in supernatural life and Jesus in the Eucharist. The gifts/effects of the Holy Spirit are not received which strengthens the Christian to overcome this world and Satan. We are fickle people. Events and values change over time, and who knows that one’s heart will not harden against God and baptism at a later date.

But the final important thought is that we, as Mary Magdelene did, love him, and he has that very special love for us…thru baptism.

And what was the price of our baptism that Jesus’ paid for love of us?

Isaiah 50
I offered my back to those who struck me, my cheeks to those who tore at my beard. I did not cover my face against insult and spittle.

 

[surritter]

I have heard this statement many times before, but Im not sure it holds any water, I mean, sure, some people do die instantly, but the many many people I have known that died, it was not instant at all, they knew they were going to die well before it actually happened.

Even if someone jumps off a tall building to commit suicide, they still have that time going down to ask, maybe thats not a good example, better one would be a bad car accident, instant death is rare, there is usually a time frame when someone realizes they are going to die to when it happens. It only takes a couple milliseconds to ask the question…?

I didn’t say it’s impossible to cry out to God in the split-second before death, and be saved by “baptism of desire.”
But frankly it’s nutty to purposely avoid baptism and hope that you’ll get that split-second. You said that instant death is rare; yet you are saying that one can gamble and hope that they aren’t in that minority. Ugh.

 

[goout]

I have heard this statement many times before, but Im not sure it holds any water, I mean, sure, some people do die instantly, but the many many people I have known that died, it was not instant at all, they knew they were going to die well before it actually happened.

Even if someone jumps off a tall building to commit suicide, they still have that time going down to ask, maybe thats not a good example, better one would be a bad car accident, instant death is rare, there is usually a time frame when someone realizes they are going to die to when it happens. It only takes a couple milliseconds to ask the question…?

Instant death happens all the time. Literally, every community, every day, someone dies suddenly without warning without a chance to consider it.

While we don’t know what happens when someone looks Christ in the face at that moment, for us who have time to consider it, a healthy fear might be appropriate. (not servile fear, healthy salvific fear)
It seems we would be guilty of presumption who say “I have time”. You don’t have time.
God has time. Time belongs to Him. He gives it to us and he can end it according to His will.

 

[fisherman_carl]

Better for your soul? Of course not. What is good for your soul? To be of clear conscience before God and man. To be living in a growing relationship with God. You can’t do that if you refuse to take the first step, to be baptized. If you love him you will be baptized. Don’t be fooled. God is not mocked. In Eternity you will see the significance of having lived a life for the Lord. You can not play games with God or Eternity. He knows your heart. He knows what you need. He is calling you into relationship. He wants to use you to bring others to him. You can not do that if you refuse him or play games.

 

[mikekle]

I didn’t say it’s impossible to cry out to God in the split-second before death, and be saved by “baptism of desire.”
But frankly it’s nutty to purposely avoid baptism and hope that you’ll get that split-second. You said that instant death is rare; yet you are saying that one can gamble and hope that they aren’t in that minority. Ugh.

I do not think one should avoid baptism for this reason, its always best to do everything you can to ensure salvation, I was just saying that instant death, meaning less than a millisecond is pretty rare. I know calling out to God for forgiveness is the first thing I would do if I suddenly had a heart attack or realized I was about to be in a deadly car accident, I assume most people would do the same, but I guess it comes down to what they believe.

What if someone just asked for forgiveness all the time thru out their daily lives, no matter what was happening, would this save them? Personally I ask God to forgive me for things I have done multiple times each and every day.

 

[davidv]

I do not think one should avoid baptism for this reason, its always best to do everything you can to ensure salvation, I was just saying that instant death, meaning less than a millisecond is pretty rare. I know calling out to God for forgiveness is the first thing I would do if I suddenly had a heart attack or realized I was about to be in a deadly car accident, I assume most people would do the same, but I guess it comes down to what they believe.

What if someone just asked for forgiveness all the time thru out their daily lives, no matter what was happening, would this save them? Personally I ask God to forgive me for things I have done multiple times each and every day.

Without the grace of Baptism, why would anyone do this?