Issues with Me, Myself, and I?

[Robster]

I know every post I have made on here has mostly been about situations with myself. Senoir members have mostly been giving advice to others because it seems as though they have it all figured out. I feel guilty that I am not doing the same selfless act, but God will fillful his purpose for everyone as he says in the bible and I am always open to anything and everything. I guess where I am going with this is that I am once again seeking advice on what the heck am I doing. I just recently had some long one on one conversations with various individuals who enlightened me in areas that have never been approached before. Don’t worry, I still believe in God and Jesus, but I have been questioning my mission in the Catholic church. I have lost my reasoning behind being in the Church except for what all the biblical scholars have made it out to be. I think we will fight to the end of time on which religion is correct and why, which bible verse explains this and that to his interpretation, who can memorize the most bible verses, what can and cannot be explained with or without reasonable or shadow of a doubt. I have never come to a conclusion about my faith I have always been growing and finding out new things because I’m curious about knowledge and I believe it will make me a better servant if I’m able to use it right. But a religion that focuses on rights that all others have and then accuses others of not being right when it was all formulated (bound and loosed) by man is confusing to me. What makes my journey more right or wrong than others who believe in the same salvation which lies within and believe in the same God. If everyone really believes in their own personnel God anyway then why is a protestant a protestant and not just a christian. Why are we all labeled and not just one body. Why do we call ourselves Catholics and proud to be when it puts a “better than you; we’re right your wrong” label on all of us. Ofcourse we are going to have outcasts and deserters and various opinions, but in the end will this all matter…will we consider our alienation outlook on the world to still be right when we show up at the gates of heaven…don’t worry I’m confusing myself to! I’m confused and have always been praying for guidance, but lately I think that prayer was answered by some serious eye opening. I sometimes just want to do what feels right and what I think god has engraved in my heart to be right. But right and wrong are only feeling from within, instead of what is believed; I feel left out. If any of you have or are experiencing this same issue I would like to hear your thoughts on things. Thank you!

 

[mercygate]

It might be helpful for you to break this post into paragraphs, assess each individual point, and re-frame the questions one-by-one.

You seem to be confused not so much by the issues you present as you are by failing to break the issues down into manageable sections.

 

[Michael038]

First of all I have many friends who are of other faiths. I respect them for what they believe as do they with my Catholocism. The main difference that we have with non Catholics is that we believe in Salvation based on Grace, Faith, and Works. There are mant Christions that believe in sola scriptura(the Bible alone), sola fide(faith alone), and that believe that communion is merely symbolic and not the true presence of Christ as we believe. I reccomend for you to go to www.biblechristiansociety.com, there are many cd’s and tapes, you can order for Free! These break down differences between Catholics and non Catholics, and show biblical evidence that the Catholic Church was founded by Christ, and that all of the sacraments are rooted from scripture. Check it out. I believe are non Catholic brothers and sisters are good people too, they just havent been exposed to the truth concerning the Holy Catholic Church. I will keep you in my prayers.

God Bless!
M

 

[Robster]

The main difference that we have with non Catholics is that we believe in Salvation based on Grace, Faith, and Works.

Is that WE believe? See this is what I am talking about. I have always tried to go out into this world and preach the gospel by molding myself to fit in with other groups and then spread the joy that God has given me. I try my best to find a way to lure them into the Catholic church when they feel comfortable around me, but now I’m not sure why I do so anymore. I have met two types of people in the Catholic church; I have met the by the book, memorizing, and not open to anything else; and I have met the hypocrites that try to go once a week to church but don’t know anything about their faith (more of an entertainment type thing). Why would I want to lead someone else to this. It’s like subjective love…it’s not unconditional love. We are all supposed to be one body, one family, everyone is our brother and sister. Why do they continue to hide these feelings and let our brothers and sisters fall? People who have made it to the church still are suffuring and in so much pain, but no one is helping them by saying “peace be with you”(routine fake words). All this, it just doesn’t make sense to me. We are called to be followers of Jesus Christ; is this what Jesus would want to see from his people? Is this the way God has wanted us to spread the word; through routine faith; through subjective stereotyping love? Why do we fall in societies ways of generalizing when we are the true one and only Church? So many things have changed over the years, even our bible is different, whose to say the Catholic church is still the Catholic church. Our the four pillars the only thing that is left and how can you prove that they have not been changed? And why does it matter, if the word was inscribed into our hearts anyway; shouldn’t we live the gospel with our own free will and conscience without having to put a label on ourselves?

 

[mercygate]

Robster:

Is that WE believe?

Rob, take a step back. The teachings of the Church are clear and available. Get yourself a copy of the Catechism and **pray **your way through it. Take a year if you have to.

See this is what I am talking about. I have always tried to go out into this world and preach the gospel by molding myself to fit in with other groups and then spread the joy that God has given me. I try my best to find a way to lure them into the Catholic church when they feel comfortable around me, but now I’m not sure why I do so anymore.

Hm. Need to come back to this.

I have met two types of people in the Catholic church; I have met the by the book, memorizing, and not open to anything else; and I have met the hypocrites that try to go once a week to church but don’t know anything about their faith (more of an entertainment type thing).

In your first sentence, you indicate that you are uncertain of what “we believe” and now you are saying that your brothers and sisters are either rule-sticklers or hypocrites and those are the only two types of people you have met in the Church. I find it easy to believe that this is what you see, but I assure you that these are not the only two kinds of people in the Church.

Why would I want to lead someone else to this. It’s like subjective love…it’s not unconditional love. We are all supposed to be one body, one family, everyone is our brother and sister. Why do they continue to hide these feelings and let our brothers and sisters fall?

Rob, what you say here does not follow as a clear train of thought.

People who have made it to the church still are suffuring and in so much pain, but no one is helping them by saying “peace be with you”(routine fake words). All this, it just doesn’t make sense to me.

Rob, again, I encourage you to get a grip on your thought processes. I assure you, it will help you work your way towards solutions to these problems that haunt you.

We are called to be followers of Jesus Christ; is this what Jesus would want to see from his people? Is this the way God has wanted us to spread the word; through routine faith; through subjective stereotyping love? Why do we fall in societies ways of generalizing when we are the true one and only Church?

Join a pro-life event and see how well we fall into “society’s ways.”

So many things have changed over the years, even our bible is different,

“even our Bible is different?” From what?

whose to say the Catholic church is still the Catholic church. Our the four pillars the only thing that is left and how can you prove that they have not been changed? And why does it matter, if the word was inscribed into our hearts anyway; shouldn’t we live the gospel with our own free will and conscience without having to put a label on ourselves?

Rob, I’ll be in trouble for this but I reiterate: First: learn to write a sentence that means what you want it to mean. Then learn to construct a paragraph that will contain a unit of thought. What you have done here is throw up a wave of dissociated, and rather incoherent reactions to something you don’t specify. Re-reading this post and your original post, I see in your outcry the subjectivism you denigrate in your brothers and sisters.

 

[Jenlyn]

I have always tried to go out into this world and preach the gospel by molding myself to fit in with other groups and then spread the joy that God has given me.

As a Christian following Christ, we do not try to mold ourselves to fit into what society thinks we should be. That is where we lose our self. The devil uses ideas like this one to steer good people the wrong way. We must die to our will and follow Christs. Reading any book about Saint’s lives will open your eyes to this truth.

From your ranting in both post, you are allowed to rant, shows that you are young and lacking knowledge of your very own faith. Before you start pointing fingers, assuming things, and believing what non-Catholics say you should study your own faith. Talk to a priest. Ask us your questions, minus the rant.

Whe you start to look at the Catholic faith you will finds years and years of learning. In fact you will enjoy all the learning you will encounter because there is so much.

 

[Jenlyn]

By the way…

Just because I have “Senoir Member” under my name doesn’t make me an expert. All I’ve done is made the required number of posts. Mostly in the Water Cooler forum.

 

[Robster]

Whatever…kick a brother while he’s down.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Rob, take a deep breath, maybe a nice cup of tea, and slowly read the posts above.

One of the most endearing characteristics I see of you is that you have a strong sense of what you see is wrong–and you are definitely looking at what hurts GOD. This passion and desire to do RIGHT and to HELP others is a wonderful gift which God has given you and which you are trying to give to others.

But God also requires of us balance. Because emotions are indeed so strong in people, it is especially necessary that they are balanced with logic and reason.

Sadly, too many people get so caught up with feelings, and think that, because they have such passion, the FEELING is what matters, not the person or the idea or the object one has the feeling ABOUT.

This explains why so many people (I know you have seen this) who are Christian (or not) can get into fits of screaming mimis over whether Paul or Peter is more important, or whether evolution can be biblically sanctioned, whether to receive communion on the tongue or in the hand, what to do about rampant lack of morals in society, etc. . .to the degree that it seems that they are ONLY concerned about one, or a few “issues” and NOT about God.

But again (and here is where age can be a blessing) you have to realize that just because you, one person, are seeing in one place at one time a really very tiny amount of people whose APPEARANCE is that they are not focused on God, does not mean that the entire bastion of Catholicism, or Christianity, is, was, and will always be like this.

Think St. Francis, St. Dominick, St. Theresa of Avila, St. Catherine of Siena, St. Maximilian Kolbe, and Mother Teresa.

All of these people lived in times and places when it looked as though just about everybody throughout the world was paying no attention to God. All of them, just one individual each, had such an IMPACT on that world. . .by THEM deciding that THEY would focus on what God wanted. What was the result? That because of their example, lots of OTHERS quietly did the same.

We don’t know the individual names of the people who followed these good examples of people who LIVED FOR CHRIST so much as we know the names of the good examples.

If you, say, decided to emulate one of the above saints, nobody might ever really appear to notice you, and it might still look as though everything was rotten. . .but you would be working out YOUR salvation, and you will in heaven (believe me) find out that all sorts of people you never even noticed will have been brought there too because of YOUR example.

You might be one who will be the 21st century’s “saint”. . .but it will have to be, not so much because you are “disgusted” at other people’s failings, but because you are determined to be the person God wishes you to be, and that means living for God, and that means living to love Him AND TO LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.

God bless.

 

[PraRFLEsEkHm]

Tantum ergo:

Rob, take a deep breath, maybe a nice cup of tea, and slowly read the posts above.

One of the most endearing characteristics I see of you is that you have a strong sense of what you see is wrong–and you are definitely looking at what hurts GOD. This passion and desire to do RIGHT and to HELP others is a wonderful gift which God has given you and which you are trying to give to others.

But God also requires of us balance. Because emotions are indeed so strong in people, it is especially necessary that they are balanced with logic and reason.

Sadly, too many people get so caught up with feelings, and think that, because they have such passion, the FEELING is what matters, not the person or the idea or the object one has the feeling ABOUT.

This explains why so many people (I know you have seen this) who are Christian (or not) can get into fits of screaming mimis over whether Paul or Peter is more important, or whether evolution can be biblically sanctioned, whether to receive communion on the tongue or in the hand, what to do about rampant lack of morals in society, etc. . .to the degree that it seems that they are ONLY concerned about one, or a few “issues” and NOT about God.

But again (and here is where age can be a blessing) you have to realize that just because you, one person, are seeing in one place at one time a really very tiny amount of people whose APPEARANCE is that they are not focused on God, does not mean that the entire bastion of Catholicism, or Christianity, is, was, and will always be like this.

Think St. Francis, St. Dominick, St. Theresa of Avila, St. Catherine of Siena, St. Maximilian Kolbe, and Mother Teresa.

All of these people lived in times and places when it looked as though just about everybody throughout the world was paying no attention to God. All of them, just one individual each, had such an IMPACT on that world. . .by THEM deciding that THEY would focus on what God wanted. What was the result? That because of their example, lots of OTHERS quietly did the same.

We don’t know the individual names of the people who followed these good examples of people who LIVED FOR CHRIST so much as we know the names of the good examples.

If you, say, decided to emulate one of the above saints, nobody might ever really appear to notice you, and it might still look as though everything was rotten. . .but you would be working out YOUR salvation, and you will in heaven (believe me) find out that all sorts of people you never even noticed will have been brought there too because of YOUR example.

You might be one who will be the 21st century’s “saint”. . .but it will have to be, not so much because you are “disgusted” at other people’s failings, but because you are determined to be the person God wishes you to be, and that means living for God, and that means living to love Him AND TO LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.

God bless.

Amen.

I say this in all Love Robster…please…GET A GRIP.

While it is true - people make up the church…the FAITH is not people. People make mistakes, go their own way, do things we shouldn’t, act in ways we ought not, and generally get our fingers into things we would be best to just LEAVE ALONE, at times.

BUT the faith, that is ROCK SOLID - read through
the Catechism, find out what the Faith is all about - it isn’t about people acting out their own insecurities/confusion/fear/uncertainty/mis-understandings…NO. The Faith is about the revealed word of GOD, the living testamony of Christ Jesus, Gods will for US, now, today, and forever. The Faith is about dying to ourselves and living for/with/in and OF GOD. MANY people are only starting that journey, many more are only just finding out that living for God/dying to ourselves is necessary. Many, many more don’t even know that yet. It is a process, and sadly - a course of action many will never take on.

Robster - instead of focusing on what is wrong in the church, and in the world - maybe try focusing on what you CAN change - YOU. Even there you will learn…YOU can do NOTHING but give your permission for GOD to do it for you. Submission is everything, obediance is all, Fear is the motivation - Love is the goal.

All the things you see wrong in the Church - are that way because they are supposed to be. This is the only absolute in life - ABSOLUTELY NOTHING happens in Gods world by ACCIDENT. Everything is exactly as it is supposed to be right now, and forever, and it always HAS BEEN. His Will WILL be done. Accept it…and perform His will FOR YOU. Everything else will take care of itself…God is making SURE of it.

Peace to you

 

[tossolul]

Rob- I don’t know how much this will help, but let me try to explain why I am Catholic…

When I realized God’s role in my life, about a year and a half ago- I soon after realized I also needed to start going to church again. I am married to a lutheran, and so felt the obvious choice was to go to his church with my children and him- even though I was raised and confirmed catholic. I had the viewpoint that it didnt’ matter what church you worshipped in, as long as your heart was with God. So I went. The sermons were wonderful, the music was beautiful, they have a great sunday school program and outreach that connects with the children. Basically it is a very welcoming church, and I enjoyed going. Then…

I started feeling that something was not right. This wasn’t coming from any outside source, or people telling me anything. It was a feeling inside of me as I sat in church and noticed things. There was a much different atmosphere in the lutheran church from what I remembered when going to the catholic church when I was younger.

So I also started going to my old Catholic church along with the lutheran, and then it seemed obvious why I had that feeling. There was a sacredness in the mass that I did not feel at the lutheran church. The way the altar is set up so the focal point of the church is where His body and blood is kept. The fact that only men are allowed to celebrate this mass as is how I believe God intended it to be. Kneeling out of respect and worship to our God. Making the sign of the cross over our bodies upon entering church with holy water to clense ourselves, and through out the mass. Watching the consecration take place and the sacredness and miracle that we believe happens at that time that other faiths do not see. Recognizing Mary’s importance in all of this. Here are some of the reasons I will always be a Catholic, no matter how difficult it would ever become to keep my faith.

1. Reconciliation- Other faiths can say what they want about believeing all you need is to believe that Jesus died for our sins and you are saved, or that you can take your sins on your own to God and He will forgive you…IT IS NOT THE SAME. When you go to reconciliation on a regular basis, it strengthens your consciesness. Having to speak your sins to another person, causes things to take place inside of you that can not happen when you keep them silent.
2. Communion- Receiving Jesus in Communion, is the greatest gift I believe possible. I believe that He is truelly present in this sacrament, and that when we recieve Him with a contrite heart, free of mortal sin He will be able to stregthen us in ways you never imagined. He is real in the bread. Other faiths do not practice this, or if they do- they then feel it alright to toss the blessed bread in the garbage that is left over. To me, that is no way to treat the most precious gift you will ever receive.
3. Eucharistic Adoration- an incredible intimate way to communicate with Jesus. Believing that He is truelly present in the eucharist, is totally reaffirmed while doing prayer in His presence.
4. Mary- was behind me coming back to Jesus, and the Catholic church in ways I can not explain here. She is deserving of recognition for her role in God’s eternal plan.
5. Recognizing the saints- Seeing them as people who were graced so much with God’s love they literally devoted their lives to His will for them. Seeing them as role models of how we can strive to do better. I have been helped a great deal by reading the lives of some saints, and what they went through- all for the love of God.

To me, these are some very important aspects that you will not find in any other church. But I also remember that just because one is not Catholic does not mean that they are not close to God, and able to be with Him in heaven. I know this, but I also know that as far as I know, the Catholic church seems to be the shortest route there, so that is the one I will take.

Please don’t let others tear down your faith Rob. It is a wonderful thing to have the heart you have. Believe in yourself, but don’t rely on yourself or others for all the answers- look to God and the resources He has left us through His church, and the bible.

God Bless you and your searching.