It is a Sin to Vote for Pro-Abortion Candidates

  • Thread starter Thread starter CPA2
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
elts1956 said:
First, we have to convince folks they don’t have to vote the party, either Dems. or Pubs. Few people vote because of individual voting records of the candidates. It is about time people start to think about what they truly want here in the U.S. And I don’t necessarily mean Palin or Romney.
Click to expand...
I agree. I want single payer health care for instance for as Jesus put it, to care for all the sick. So I assume that applies to the US as well for the sick to be cared for equally. Where the wealthier do not get better care. Not to mention it is easier for a camel to pass thru the eye of a needle than for the rich to get to heaven.

But who’s my candidate? Ralph Nader who stands no chance. Or a Dem over a Pub?
 
elts1956 said:
One would have to be awfully dim to not know that by voting for a pro abort pol, one is advancing the pro abortion cause. Advancing abortion is a NO NO.
Click to expand...
The simple act of voting for a given political candidate may or may not be sinful. It depends BOTH on the candidate’s positions and an individual’s reasons for voting for that candidate.
 
diggerdomer said:
The simple act of voting for a given political candidate may or may not be sinful. It depends BOTH on the candidate’s positions and an individual’s reasons for voting for that candidate.
Click to expand...
It also depends on comparative factors – who else is running. One is allowed to calculate the practical results of that vote in the particular election, according to the VP of Moral Theology for Catholic Answers, Colin Donovan. (Not sure if I spelled his name right.) He was on CA Live today, on Patrick Coffin’s show.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
It also depends on comparative factors – who else is running. One is allowed to calculate the practical results of that vote in the particular election, according to the VP of Moral Theology for Catholic Answers, Colin Donovan. (Not sure if I spelled his name right.) He was on CA Live today, on Patrick Coffin’s show.
Click to expand...
Elizabeth, you know me. I’m going to use my conscience and prayer to calculate regardless. 😉 But we’re actually given permission to calculate for ourselves?
 
Elizabeth502 said:
It also depends on comparative factors – who else is running. One is allowed to calculate the practical results of that vote in the particular election, according to the VP of Moral Theology for Catholic Answers, Colin Donovan. (Not sure if I spelled his name right.) He was on CA Live today, on Patrick Coffin’s show.
Click to expand...
I would include who else is running under the personal reasons for voting for one candidate as opposed to others. So I agree with you.
 
diggerdomer said:
The simple act of voting for a given political candidate may or may not be sinful. It depends BOTH on the candidate’s positions and an individual’s reasons for voting for that candidate.
Click to expand...
What about the reasoning of Pope John Paul II who said there is no other evil proportionate to abortion. I guess we have stopped listening to the Magisterium and Church teachings??? One’s conscience is faulty if one can truly think voting for a pro abortion candidate would reduce abortion. Abortion was the number one issue on the Bishop’s agenda which was to be fought against in this past POTUS election.

One would have to be awfully dim to not know that by voting for a pro abort pol, one is advancing the pro abortion cause. Advancing abortion is a NO NO. Ah, but I am repeating myself. What is so hard to understand about what I have said? I’ll repeat it again, if you wish.
 
Remember folks, just because a political candidate is anti-abortion, this does not preclude he/she is pro-life, not according to HMC. This candidate, while opposing abortion, may not be pro-life if he/she supports the death penalty, euthanasia, birth control, indeed, they themselves may use contraceptives. This is a slippery slope. Even a Catholic candidate may not be a true pro-lifer. How does one determin who to vote for if one is not privy to the candidate’s deep seeded personal practices/and or beliefs? Are you going to expect him/her to admit publically whether or not, for example, they practice contraception? I don’t think so. Maybe yes on their stand on the death penalty and euthanasia but not on the privacy of their bedroom. And that, my friends , brings up the provisions of the 9th Amendment which was recently brought into play on this forum.
 
CallistusPM said:
Remember folks, just because a political candidate is anti-abortion, this does not preclude he/she is pro-life, not according to HMC. This candidate, while opposing abortion, may not be pro-life if he/she supports the death penalty, euthanasia, birth control, indeed, they themselves may use contraceptives. This is a slippery slope. Even a Catholic candidate may not be a true pro-lifer. How does one determin who to vote for if one is not privy to the candidate’s deep seeded personal practices/and or beliefs? Are you going to expect him/her to admit publically whether or not, for example, they practice contraception? I don’t think so. Maybe yes on their stand on the death penalty and euthanasia but not on the privacy of their bedroom. And that, my friends , brings up the provisions of the 9th Amendment which was recently brought into play on this forum.
Click to expand...
Surely you see the difference between publicly promiting an intinsic evil and privately sinning? I hoe you are not suggesting it OK t vote for smeone who oppenly support asn intrinsic evil because his opponent *migth *privately support it???

The Church does now and always has allowed for the Death Penaly . The Pope speicfically said that Catholic can , in good conscience, support the death penalty,
 
elts1956 said:
What about the reasoning of Pope John Paul II who said there is no other evil proportionate to abortion. I guess we have stopped listening to the Magisterium and Church teachings??? One’s conscience is faulty if one can truly think voting for a pro abortion candidate would reduce abortion. Abortion was the number one issue on the Bishop’s agenda which was to be fought against in this past POTUS election.

One would have to be awfully dim to not know that by voting for a pro abort pol, one is advancing the pro abortion cause. Advancing abortion is a NO NO. Ah, but I am repeating myself. What is so hard to understand about what I have said? I’ll repeat it again, if you wish.
Click to expand...
I see the thread has returned to the two greatest rationalization Catholics use for supportng abortion. My Priest told me it was OK(this time its a priest on the radio so i guess that gives it more credibility) and I am following my conscience.
 
elts1956 said:
What about the reasoning of Pope John Paul II who said there is no other evil proportionate to abortion. I guess we have stopped listening to the Magisterium and Church teachings???
Click to expand...
You’re repeating it to the wrong people. Repeat it to Colin Donovan. Surely you’re enough of an expert to challenge the VP of Moral Theology on CAF. I was referring to his statement, which he offered live yesterday. Perhaps you should write to him and suggest that he doesn’t understand church teachings well enough to qualify him to hold his position.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
You’re repeating it to the wrong people. Repeat it to Colin Donovan. Surely you’re enough of an expert to challenge the VP of Moral Theology on CAF. I was referring to his statement, which he offered live yesterday. Perhaps you should write to him and suggest that he doesn’t understand church teachings well enough to qualify him to hold his position.
Click to expand...
If he is contradicting what the Church has said then yes I would challenge him in a minute. There simpleywere no proportionate reasons that would have a allowed a Catholic to vote for Obama-in fact i can not think of a national election in the last 40 years where a Catholic could have voted for the canidate that supported abortion
 
CallistusPM said:
Remember folks, just because a political candidate is anti-abortion, this does not preclude he/she is pro-life, not according to HMC. This candidate, while opposing abortion, may not be pro-life if he/she supports the death penalty, euthanasia, birth control, indeed, they themselves may use contraceptives. This is a slippery slope. Even a Catholic candidate may not be a true pro-lifer. How does one determin who to vote for if one is not privy to the candidate’s deep seeded personal practices/and or beliefs? Are you going to expect him/her to admit publically whether or not, for example, they practice contraception? I don’t think so. Maybe yes on their stand on the death penalty and euthanasia but not on the privacy of their bedroom. And that, my friends , brings up the provisions of the 9th Amendment which was recently brought into play on this forum.
Click to expand...
CONVOLUTED, RELATIVISTIC, SEAMLESS GARMENT THINKING.

I will say this AGAIN. The issue of ABORTION was number one on the agenda of the Bishops here in the US. It is an INTRINSIC EVIL. The death penalty is also an instrinsic evil, but it is ALLOWED if no other recourse to punishment is possible. ABORTION is NEVER allowed. There is a hierarchy of EVIL. ABORTION is at the apex. We cannot read another human being’s mind, BUT we can look at their VOTING RECORD. bo is pro abort through and through. Voting for him is supporting the SPREAD of abortion. We were to vote for the candidate LESS OR LEAST LIKELY TO SUPPORT AND SPREAD ABORTION. Read all the documents you can read about this. Don’t just lean on the USCCB’s document Voting with a Catholic Conscience, or whatever it was called. Read the encyclicals of Pope John Paul II, especially Evangelium Vitae and Veritas in Splendor. Read with an open focused mind. Don’t get side tracked by what ifs…
 
CallistusPM said:
Remember folks, just because a political candidate is anti-abortion, this does not preclude he/she is pro-life, not according to HMC. This candidate, while opposing abortion, may not be pro-life if he/she supports the death penalty, euthanasia, birth control, indeed, they themselves may use contraceptives. This is a slippery slope. Even a Catholic candidate may not be a true pro-lifer. How does one determin who to vote for if one is not privy to the candidate’s deep seeded personal practices/and or beliefs? Are you going to expect him/her to admit publically whether or not, for example, they practice contraception? I don’t think so. Maybe yes on their stand on the death penalty and euthanasia but not on the privacy of their bedroom. And that, my friends , brings up the provisions of the 9th Amendment which was recently brought into play on this forum.
Click to expand...
Elizabeth502 said:
You’re repeating it to the wrong people. Repeat it to Colin Donovan. Surely you’re enough of an expert to challenge the VP of Moral Theology on CAF. I was referring to his statement, which he offered live yesterday. Perhaps you should write to him and suggest that he doesn’t understand church teachings well enough to qualify him to hold his position.
Click to expand...
Please refer me back to your post you are talking about. Also tell me where I can find a copy of Colin Donovan’s statement. Thanks.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
It also depends on comparative factors – who else is running. One is allowed to calculate the practical results of that vote in the particular election, according to the VP of Moral Theology for Catholic Answers, Colin Donovan. (Not sure if I spelled his name right.) He was on CA Live today, on Patrick Coffin’s show.
Click to expand...
I hope he also said it depends greatly on the issues that are being advanced, like abortion? This statdment is very loosely worded. Very confusing.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
It also depends on comparative factors – who else is running. One is allowed to calculate the practical results of that vote in the particular election, according to the VP of Moral Theology for Catholic Answers, Colin Donovan. (Not sure if I spelled his name right.) He was on CA Live today, on Patrick Coffin’s show.
Click to expand...
Well let me see-the practical results of Obama being elected is the US taxayers are now paying for overseas abortions and sterilizations. We have one new pro-abortion Justice in the USSC and will by the end of the year have two new ones. Fundng for abstimnence education has been gutted and condoms (paid for with taxpayer monies are being handed out in our schools in record numbers The practical results of electing so called pro-life democrat congressmen is that we now have a health care bill that uses taxpayer funds to pay for domestic abortions aslo.

Not ONE single member of the magestrium stated there were proportionate reasons that would allow a Cathlic to vote for Obama-62 said there were not. The Pope himself made it clear that the usual excuse given for voting for Obama , his oppostion to the Iraq war , was not sufficient . For a Catholic to vote for Obama took either a delberate rejection of the Church’s teachngs or a complete dereliction of their duty to determine the techings of the Church and the stances of the canidates.
 
elts1956 said:
I hope he also said it depends greatly on the issues that are being advanced, like abortion? This statdment is very loosely worded. Very confusing.
Click to expand...
People hear what they want to hear. Given CAF stance on the 5 non-negotiables and their adherence to the Chuschs teachings I seriously doubt anyone working for CAF is telling people it was OK to have voted for Obama.
 
elts1956 said:
I hope he also said it depends greatly on the issues that are being advanced, like abortion? This statdment is very loosely worded. Very confusing.
Click to expand...
🤷 It’s only confusing if you elevate a single issue above all others. It has to be loosely worded once you understand Christ talked much more about the poor, the hungry, the sick.

Peace. Oh he talked about that too.
 
elts1956 said:
What about the reasoning of Pope John Paul II who said there is no other evil proportionate to abortion. I guess we have stopped listening to the Magisterium and Church teachings??? One’s conscience is faulty if one can truly think voting for a pro abortion candidate would reduce abortion. Abortion was the number one issue on the Bishop’s agenda which was to be fought against in this past POTUS election.

One would have to be awfully dim to not know that by voting for a pro abort pol, one is advancing the pro abortion cause. Advancing abortion is a NO NO. Ah, but I am repeating myself. What is so hard to understand about what I have said? I’ll repeat it again, if you wish.
Click to expand...
Where did JPII say that? And yes, I think it’s sad that some have stopped listening to the Magisterium and Church teaching.

Whether or not an individual’s conscience is faulty is hardly determined by one political vote. One would have to be quite uninformed of Church teaching to think otherwise.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top