It seems like there is an advocacy for permissive parenting in today's society or is it just me?

[Serap]

I struggle with how to discipline my kids due to society’s pressures. I do all I can to make my children feel loved and cared for and it seems like any kind of discipline these days, is seen as some kind of abuse.

It just seems to me, that we are going through a new era of permissive parenting. It seems like spanking is becoming less and less acceptable and parents who use it are made to feel guilty about it, like they are abusing their children. When I say spanking, I mean one wrist flick with an open hand on a clothed bottom…I’m not talking about anything else to mean spanking.

I just see a bunch of kids these days, ruling their parents. It seems like parents now tip toe around their kids in fear of being seen as being abusive or too harsh. Many parents seem to see their children as equals and they don’t seem to discipline effectively.

Is it just me, or am I on to something here? Has the pendelum swung too far the other way? Are we in an era of permissive parenting? What happened to children respecting their parents and respecting authority?

Is this new movement in parenting a good thing for society? Am I too old fashioned?

 

[UbiCaritas]

I struggle with how to discipline my kids due to society’s pressures. I do all I can to make my children feel loved and cared for and it seems like any kind of discipline these days, is seen as some kind of abuse.

It just seems to me, that we are going through a new era of permissive parenting. It seems like spanking is becoming less and less acceptable and parents who use it are made to feel guilty about it, like they are abusing their children. When I say spanking, I mean one wrist flick with an open hand on a clothed bottom…I’m not talking about anything else to mean spanking.

I just see a bunch of kids these days, ruling their parents. It seems like parents now tip toe around their kids in fear of being seen as being abusive or too harsh. Many parents seem to see their children as equals and they don’t seem to discipline effectively.

Is it just me, or am I on to something here? Has the pendelum swung too far the other way? Are we in an era of permissive parenting? What happened to children respecting their parents and respecting authority?

Is this new movement in parenting a good thing for society? Am I too old fashioned?

It is not just you. Talk to anyone who works with the public, and they’ll tell you that you’re dead on.

I worked in retail through college and shortly afterwards, a bit over five years total. What I saw boggled the mind. At the first store at which I worked, the policy was to never, ever interfere in what a child was doing, even if it was potentially dangerous, because the parents might get angry at you for “disciplining” their child. Example: a family came into the store’s café, and two of the kids immediately ran over to the glass bottle display and started arguing over who’d get what drink. One of them dropped a bottle of root beer on the stone floor, smashing it. Realizing just how “fun” this was, they proceeded to grab all the bottles they could and THROW them on the floor. The parents remonstrated, but only mildly, and did nothing to stop them: “Oh, honey, you shouldn’t do that, you’re kind of making a mess.” These kids were about 8 and 10 respectively. Broken glass EVERYWHERE. The café supervisor came out with a mop and dustpan to clean up the mess, and told the kids to be careful because the glass they broke was very sharp, and they could slip in the spilled drinks and cut themselves. She told them to stand away from the broken glass et all while she mopped up. Parents promptly complained to management that the café supervisor “made their kids feel bad,” and the supervisor was reprimanded. I saw this sort of nonsense DAILY.

At the next store, I had that rarity among retail managers: a store manager with a spine. If we saw a kid doing something stupid, disruptive, or dangerous we were to tell them to stop immediately and call a manager if they didn’t. We still had no shortage of kids misbehaving and parents turning a blind eye, but since management had no problem telling the parents to supervise their kids or leave, it wasn’t nearly so bad.

Parents overall (obviously, I’m generalizing here) don’t want to be parents. They want to be their kids’ friends. Never mind that the happiest kids I saw were the ones whose parents had firm, reasonable, and reinforced rules! For most parents, instant gratification was the rule, which meant unhappiness in the long run.

One last example: every. single. night., we’d dread having to clean up the children’s section because parents would bring their kids in there and then let them trash the place. Displays totally destroyed, books and toys thrown all over the floor, etc. In my five years of retail, I remember seeing a parent make their child clean up their mess exactly twice. On one of those occasions, I was rendered speechless by the mom catching the kid in the act of (with some other kids) destroying a display, seizing their kid, saying firmly, “You know better and were brought up better than this. This behavior is unacceptable. Now apologize to that lady for making a mess in her department, and ask her how to clean it up.” After the kid apologized (?!) and cleaned up (!!!), he went to the bathroom and I made a point of telling the mom how much I appreciated not only that he cleaned up his mess, but that she was taking the initiative to raise him well.

I don’t advocate child abuse, for heaven’s sake. My husband and I don’t plan on using corporal punishment except possibly, in very specific circumstances, a single swat to the diapered backside of a child too young to understand, for example, why one must never touch the stove–read, a swat used to get their attention, not for punishment. At the same time, I’d argue that never disciplining your kids is child abuse, and sets them up for long-term failure at life.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

I struggle with how to discipline my kids due to society’s pressures. I do all I can to make my children feel loved and cared for and it seems like any kind of discipline these days, is seen as some kind of abuse.

It just seems to me, that we are going through a new era of permissive parenting. It seems like spanking is becoming less and less acceptable and parents who use it are made to feel guilty about it, like they are abusing their children. When I say spanking, I mean one wrist flick with an open hand on a clothed bottom…I’m not talking about anything else to mean spanking.

I just see a bunch of kids these days, ruling their parents. It seems like parents now tip toe around their kids in fear of being seen as being abusive or too harsh. Many parents seem to see their children as equals and they don’t seem to discipline effectively.

Is it just me, or am I on to something here? Has the pendelum swung too far the other way? Are we in an era of permissive parenting? What happened to children respecting their parents and respecting authority?

Is this new movement in parenting a good thing for society? Am I too old fashioned?

It’s definitely not just you and you aren’t too old fashioned. Spankings are not abuse. So many people think that if you swat the backside of a child that you will go to jail. That isn’t the case in the states I have live in. It seems like less children were out of control when parents actually did their job: raising those kids they had. I don’t believe that spankings should be used for every type of misbehavior. I actually know a person who swats for everything, even typical age things that should be corrected, but not by force.
I do know that when I was acting up repeatedly during the day, nothing set me straighter than a couple of swats. A belt was used on me when I was school age. My mom never gave me more than 3 swats and I never had any bruises afterwards. I don’t see it as child abuse and the state I grew up in doesn’t see it as such, either.
Also, not every child reacts to spankings the same way. I would get a couple swats and I wouldn’t do whatever it was for at least a few days. My little brother, on the other hand, could get a spanking and go right back to doing whatever it was he was doing. My mom had to learn her children and figure out what type punishments worked best.
I can’t say it is all parents because I know some wonderful young parents who are raising wonderful, respectful children, but there are also a good percentage of parents who need to stop acting like a friend and start acting like a parent.

 

[EasterJoy]

Do not think that because some parents do not think spanking works for them (I am such a parent) that this means that all spanking is automatically abuse. Spanking has to be administrated in a very self-disciplined way and can be counter-productive with children of a certain temperament. That some parents have concluded that some particular form of discipline is not OK for their parenting does not imply that spanking is always wrong or always ineffective. It is a caution that it sometimes spanking does more harm than good.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

This has been going on for awhile now. One thing to remember is that you don’t have to talk about how you are disciplining your children to others.

If you are concerned about how they behave in public and what kind of discipline to administer then, try to set them up for good behavior before you go out. It is hard, but try to schedule errands and other activities when they aren’t tired or hungry.

Talk regularly about what kind of behavior you expect in different places - and keep them close to you when out. (They won’t be smashing rootbeer bottles if you are standing right there!)

When mine were little, I carried snacks and water with us everywhere and timed errands and visits around naptime. Later, I made sure they had clear expectations as to their behavior (and knew what the consequenses would be!) and also that they developed good eating and sleeping habits so I wasn’t dealing with sugar rushes or exhaustion.

“Other people’s children” are always going to be around. But if we each do our best with our own children hopefully there will be fewer and fewer out of control kids!

I struggle with how to discipline my kids due to society’s pressures. I do all I can to make my children feel loved and cared for and it seems like any kind of discipline these days, is seen as some kind of abuse.

It just seems to me, that we are going through a new era of permissive parenting. It seems like spanking is becoming less and less acceptable and parents who use it are made to feel guilty about it, like they are abusing their children. When I say spanking, I mean one wrist flick with an open hand on a clothed bottom…I’m not talking about anything else to mean spanking.

I just see a bunch of kids these days, ruling their parents. It seems like parents now tip toe around their kids in fear of being seen as being abusive or too harsh. Many parents seem to see their children as equals and they don’t seem to discipline effectively.

Is it just me, or am I on to something here? Has the pendelum swung too far the other way? Are we in an era of permissive parenting? What happened to children respecting their parents and respecting authority?

Is this new movement in parenting a good thing for society? Am I too old fashioned?

 

[EasterJoy]

It is not just you. Talk to anyone who works with the public, and they’ll tell you that you’re dead on.

I worked in retail through college and shortly afterwards, a bit over five years total. What I saw boggled the mind. At the first store at which I worked, the policy was to never, ever interfere in what a child was doing, even if it was potentially dangerous, because the parents might get angry at you for “disciplining” their child. Example: a family came into the store’s café, and two of the kids immediately ran over to the glass bottle display and started arguing over who’d get what drink. One of them dropped a bottle of root beer on the stone floor, smashing it. Realizing just how “fun” this was, they proceeded to grab all the bottles they could and THROW them on the floor. The parents remonstrated, but only mildly, and did nothing to stop them: “Oh, honey, you shouldn’t do that, you’re kind of making a mess.” These kids were about 8 and 10 respectively. Broken glass EVERYWHERE. The café supervisor came out with a mop and dustpan to clean up the mess, and told the kids to be careful because the glass they broke was very sharp, and they could slip in the spilled drinks and cut themselves. She told them to stand away from the broken glass et all while she mopped up. Parents promptly complained to management that the café supervisor “made their kids feel bad,” and the supervisor was reprimanded. I saw this sort of nonsense DAILY.

At the next store, I had that rarity among retail managers: a store manager with a spine. If we saw a kid doing something stupid, disruptive, or dangerous we were to tell them to stop immediately and call a manager if they didn’t. We still had no shortage of kids misbehaving and parents turning a blind eye, but since management had no problem telling the parents to supervise their kids or leave, it wasn’t nearly so bad…

One last example: every. single. night., we’d dread having to clean up the children’s section because parents would bring their kids in there and then let them trash the place. Displays totally destroyed, books and toys thrown all over the floor, etc. In my five years of retail, I remember seeing a parent make their child clean up their mess exactly twice. On one of those occasions, I was rendered speechless by the mom catching the kid in the act of (with some other kids) destroying a display, seizing their kid, saying firmly, “You know better and were brought up better than this. This behavior is unacceptable. Now apologize to that lady for making a mess in her department, and ask her how to clean it up.” After the kid apologized (?!) and cleaned up (!!!), he went to the bathroom and I made a point of telling the mom how much I appreciated not only that he cleaned up his mess, but that she was taking the initiative to raise him well.

I don’t advocate child abuse, for heaven’s sake. My husband and I don’t plan on using corporal punishment except possibly, in very specific circumstances, a single swat to the diapered backside of a child too young to understand, for example, why one must never touch the stove–read, a swat used to get their attention, not for punishment. At the same time, I’d argue that never disciplining your kids is child abuse, and sets them up for long-term failure at life.

I have a counter-example, which has nothing to do with spanking. When our children were very small and we’d take them to a restaurant, we’d always a) take them something to do, b) bring something they could eat if the service was slow (asking the staff permission first), and c) bring a dustpan and handbroom in the back of the stroller, to clean up the floor afterward. They were taught to say “please” and “thank you” and to stay at the table for the duration of the meals at home, so it was no shock when it was required at restaurants, too. They were given to know that if they acted up in a restaurant, they would be leaving their food behind and escorted to the car by a parent who would not be engaging in enjoyable conversation when they got there (their best hope would be no conversation at all! ), while their behaving family members would be enjoying the rest of their meal at their leisure.

As you can imagine, they got a lot of positive feedback for their behavior by restaurant staff. As a result, they saw themselves as people who act a certain way, as patrons that restaurants actually wanted. They themselves were appalled by peers who acted like animals who needed to be on a leash. They could be allowed to supervise themselves in restaurants by the time they were in middle school.

My point is that punishment can never take the place of a self-concept that says, “I control myself so as to be thoughtful of others, and other people appreciate that about me.” I agree with you: Parents who do not teach that to a child leave their child impoverished.

I don’t think that the biggest mistake modern parents make is that they don’t spank. I think it is that they think a terrier can be trained to behave and a child can’t. It is that they think their child has some right to be liked no matter how he treats others, that because their child has some feelings of empathy for others that empathy alone will teach him the manners expected in our culture. IOW, people expect their children to be mind-readers, hoping blindly that they’ll behave but never giving them firm training regarding what “to behave” even means. “You’re kind of making a mess” and that you have room to complain when you feel bad because your own bad behavior is pointed out to you? Good grief! That is so short of the truth as to be a lie! Why would you lie to your kids like that?

 

[CarrieSpooner]

I don’t feel that way at all. I see the opposite. Parents overwhelmingly want to control their kids and do so with whatever attempts at coercion, manipulation and threat that they can come up with. I think the majority of our culture is in bondage to the evil one with these attitudes. I very rarely ever see true permissive parenting and when I do, it’s because they simply don’t know what else to do. People know in the deepest level of their heart, that spanking is wrong. They know that yelling is wrong. They know that shaming is wrong. They love their child. But no one shows them what is right or at least they don’t realize that someone is showing them. God shows us. Jesus Christ shows us. He doesn’t do any of those things to us. He provides the true consequences and we need not make them up on our own to discount/over-shadow his truths.

Why don’t we trust him and follow his ways, as God the Father? Because we have fallen for the lies that children must act in a way contradictory to the way that God designed them to be. We have fallen in bondage to cultural, non-scientific lies about the nature of the human child. We are selfish and we want to be looked at as a “good parent” based on the unrealistic expectations set by culture, not God.

I was recently reading from Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI’s book, The God of Jesus Christ where he talked about knowing the nature of God based on things we can understand. We can never know the true fullness of God’s nature until we have eternal glory with Him in Heaven but until then, he provides examples to help us understand his nature. One example is the nature of “Father”. The problem comes in when our culture changes what a Father is. And that’s what we have done. This is now a huge stumbling block for many people to Christianity. When they think of what Father means to them, in their lives, it certainly isn’t something they want to be a part of. Instead of changing the model, we should strive to parent more like He does to us. We must trust in his ways instead of trying to do it on our own.

Even the so-called “permissive parents” still hit their kids and take away their toys. They just get confused and don’t know where to go. They aren’t consistent. That’s a good thing, I’d rather a parent be permissive than coercive. The true problem is controlling parents. I think most people are falling for lies in thinking that parenting is so permissive. It’s not.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

This is a wonderful example EasterJoy! While we did not bring our own broom, we did use similar techniques when ours were little. Most sit down resturants serve bread before the meal and that was usual enough to stave off starvation.

Also because this was pre-everyone-get-out-your-smartphone, we did bring a few small toys or actually engaged our children in conversation. lol

This is an excellent self-image for our children to have - “I control myself so as to be thoughtful of others, and other people appreciate that about me.”

I have a counter-example, which has nothing to do with spanking. When our children were very small and we’d take them to a restaurant, we’d always a) take them something to do, b) bring something they could eat if the service was slow (asking the staff permission first), and c) bring a dustpan and handbroom in the back of the stroller, to clean up the floor afterward. They were taught to say “please” and “thank you” and to stay at the table for the duration of the meal at home meals, so it was no shock when it was required at restaurants, too. They were given to know that if they acted up in a restaurant, they would be leaving their food behind and escorted to the car by a parent who would not be engaging in enjoyable conversation when they got there (their best hope would be no conversation at all! ), while their behaving family members would be enjoying the rest of their meal at their leisure.

As you can imagine, they got a lot of positive feedback for their behavior by restaurant staff. As a result, they saw themselves as people who act a certain way, as patrons that restaurants actually wanted. They themselves were appalled by peers who acted like animals who needed to be on a leash. They could be allowed to supervise themselves in restaurants by the time they were in middle school.

My point is that punishment can never take the place of a self-concept that says, “I control myself so as to be thoughtful of others, and other people appreciate that about me.” Parents who do not teach that to a child leave their child impoverished, IMHO.

 

[EasterJoy]

…While we did not bring our own broom, we did use similar techniques when ours were little…

There were many restaurants where the staff was literally stunned to see us sweeping up the floor under our toddlers’ chairs. We just always felt sorry for the staff at busy restaurants when we saw the messes being left under “family” tables–those poor waiters and waitresses must hate to see small children come in!–and our kids were not “A” students when it came to keeping it on the plate, I’m afraid! We didn’t want them to grimace when they saw* us *coming in on a busy night!

 

[EasterJoy]

I don’t feel that way at all. I see the opposite. Parents overwhelmingly want to control their kids and do so with whatever attempts at coercion, manipulation and threat that they can come up with. I think the majority of our culture is in bondage to the evil one with these attitudes. I very rarely ever see true permissive parenting and when I do, it’s because they simply don’t know what else to do. People know in the deepest level of their heart, that spanking is wrong. They know that yelling is wrong. They know that shaming is wrong. They love their child. But no one shows them what is right or at least they don’t realize that someone is showing them. God shows us. Jesus Christ shows us. He doesn’t do any of those things to us. He provides the true consequences and we need not make them up on our own to discount/over-shadow his truths.

Why don’t we trust him and follow his ways, as God the Father? Because we have fallen for the lies that children must act in a way contradictory to the way that God designed them to be. We have fallen in bondage to cultural, non-scientific lies about the nature of the human child. We are selfish and we want to be looked at as a “good parent” based on the unrealistic expectations set by culture, not God.

I was recently reading from Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI’s book, The God of Jesus Christ where he talked about knowing the nature of God based on things we can understand. We can never know the true fullness of God’s nature until we have eternal glory with Him in Heaven but until then, he provides examples to help us understand his nature. One example is the nature of “Father”. The problem comes in when our culture changes what a Father is. And that’s what we have done. This is now a huge stumbling block for many people to Christianity. When they think of what Father means to them, in their lives, it certainly isn’t something they want to be a part of. Instead of changing the model, we should strive to parent more like He does to us. We must trust in his ways instead of trying to do it on our own.

Even the so-called “permissive parents” still hit their kids and take away their toys. They just get confused and don’t know where to go. They aren’t consistent. That’s a good thing, I’d rather a parent be permissive than coercive. The true problem is controlling parents. I think most people are falling for lies in thinking that parenting is so permissive. It’s not.

No, there are actually permissive parents who never hit, never yell, and never impose a consequence that the child finds all that unpleasant. They are like the people who have dogs who are so untrained as to be little short of feral. They expect everyone else to make accommodation for their darlings, with no direction given to the darlings that would make those darlings welcome in any serene gathering of reasonable people. As you say, they give such inconsistent, conflicting, and misdirected guidance that their charges have no idea what kind of behavior is required. Sometimes they are even unaware that anything other than what they happen to want ever is required, excepting as it conflicts with some unforeseeable whim of their guardians. These people raise pets and children who make others who see them think, “Oh no. Here they come.”

Some of us have had the experience of being spanked or yelled at by parents and do not think our parents handled us wrongly. (Shaming is another story. I cannot think of a single positive example of that.) If you and your parents and your children are of a particular temperament and training and situation, then there will be a time and a place for raising the parental voice and even corporal punishment. It can work.

It is not true that overly permissive parents are “better” than overly controlling parents. Those are simply two ditches, each on the opposite side of the road, but both leading to disaster. In one case, the worst is abuse; on the other, the worst is neglect. A child cannot thrive under either regime.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

There were many restaurants where the staff was literally stunned to see us sweeping up the floor under our toddlers’ chairs. We just always felt sorry for the staff at busy restaurants when we saw the messes being left under “family” tables–those poor waiters and waitresses must hate to see small children come in!–and our kids were not “A” students when it came to keeping it on the plate, I’m afraid! We didn’t want them to grimace when they saw* us *coming in on a busy night!

When I was a server in college I was grateful for parents like you. I couldn’t believe that some parents would allow kids to spill drinks, throw food on the floor, and then look at me like it was my fault.

 

[maryjk]

I have a counter-example, which has nothing to do with spanking. When our children were very small and we’d take them to a restaurant, we’d always a) take them something to do, b) bring something they could eat if the service was slow (asking the staff permission first), and c) bring a dustpan and handbroom in the back of the stroller, to clean up the floor afterward. They were taught to say “please” and “thank you” and to stay at the table for the duration of the meals at home, so it was no shock when it was required at restaurants, too. They were given to know that if they acted up in a restaurant, they would be leaving their food behind and escorted to the car by a parent who would not be engaging in enjoyable conversation when they got there (their best hope would be no conversation at all! ), while their behaving family members would be enjoying the rest of their meal at their leisure.

We actually used to bring small board games or other stuff to do at the table.

My son, now an adult, still remembers playing the portable size game of Guess Who at restaurants in Orlando.

We always had a “Go Bag” in the car. It contained games, small puzzles, paper and colored pencils, Matchbox cars and cup with a lid.

But I also didn’t spank.

 

[EasterJoy]

When I was a server in college I was grateful for parents like you. I couldn’t believe that some parents would allow kids to spill drinks, throw food on the floor, and then look at me like it was my fault.

I think they let the kids do it at home where the parent cleans up the mess, and so the parents figure that the price of a restaurant includes a “night off” from parenting, too. (I wish I could believe that the tips they leave always reflect the extra work they’re expecting the staff to do, which would still forget that on a busy night the staff has to make other patrons wait longer to be served in order to do it.)

 

[EasterJoy]

Did I mention that we never ever went to a Chuck-E-Cheese?

There used to be a story among the Italians that every cook would have to pick up every crumb of food wasted with his or her eyelashes before getting out of Purgatory. I have heard stories, and I wonder if some permissive parents will not find that their Purgatory will be unbroken years of learning to parent while in the confines of an eternally-out-of-control Chuck E Cheese restaurant.

 

[Serap]

This has been going on for awhile now. One thing to remember is that you don’t have to talk about how you are disciplining your children to others.

If you are concerned about how they behave in public and what kind of discipline to administer then, try to set them up for good behavior before you go out. It is hard, but try to schedule errands and other activities when they aren’t tired or hungry.

Talk regularly about what kind of behavior you expect in different places - and keep them close to you when out. (They won’t be smashing rootbeer bottles if you are standing right there!)

When mine were little, I carried snacks and water with us everywhere and timed errands and visits around naptime. Later, I made sure they had clear expectations as to their behavior (and knew what the consequenses would be!) and also that they developed good eating and sleeping habits so I wasn’t dealing with sugar rushes or exhaustion.

“Other people’s children” are always going to be around. But if we each do our best with our own children hopefully there will be fewer and fewer out of control kids!

I will admit that I am a strict no nonsense mother. I took my son out of a shoe store just last week b/c he had a temper tantrum after he picked out an umbrella and 2 pairs of shoes. His tantrum was over me wanting to measure his foot and he wouldn’t let me. The store clerk tried to give him a sticker and I wouldn’t let her give it to him and I gave him a swat on the bum and we left the store. We put all the things he had chosen behind (back in it’s place).

I had a chat with him when we got home and I told him that we would try again the next day and he would only get his new umbrella and shoes if he was a good boy in the store. He promised to be a good boy and we returned the next day (with his sister) and they picked out their shoes and umbrellas and behaved like angels. My son also let me measure his foot for sizing with no problems.

I am really afraid of spanking b/c it can easily be done in anger, so I try to avoid it unless my son needs to “snap out of it”. I am now only administering one smack with an open hand to his clothed bum b/c I find that it really snaps him out of his bad behaviour when nothing else works. I barely even need to do it anymore…maybe once a week.

Everytime I research “spanking” I find a million articles saying it’s abuse and that it completely messes up your child. I think to myself, what is society expecting from us parents and what kind of children do we want to raise?

I agree that forms of corporal punishment like the paddle and belt can be seen as abuse…yeah…it’s kinda harsh, but an open hand on the bum? How is that abuse? I don’t get it. I’m old fashioned I guess???

 

[Serap]

I don’t think that the biggest mistake modern parents make is that they don’t spank. I think it is that they think a terrier can be trained to behave and a child can’t. It is that they think their child has some right to be liked no matter how he treats others, that because their child has some feelings of empathy for others that empathy alone will teach him the manners expected in our culture. IOW, people expect their children to be mind-readers, hoping blindly that they’ll behave but never giving them firm training regarding what “to behave” even means. “You’re kind of making a mess” and that you have room to complain when you feel bad because your own bad behavior is pointed out to you? Good grief! That is so short of the truth as to be a lie! Why would you lie to your kids like that?

BINGO!!! As usual EasterJoy, you are brilliantly pointing out the issue.

 

[pensmama87]

Did I mention that we never ever went to a Chuck-E-Cheese?

There used to be a story among the Italians that every cook would have to pick up every crumb of food wasted with his or her eyelashes before getting out of Purgatory. I have heard stories, and I wonder if some permissive parents will not find that their Purgatory will be unbroken years of learning to parent while in the confines of an eternally-out-of-control Chuck E Cheese restaurant.

This post alone has me strengthening my resolve to be a better parent. Anything but that!

I wouldn’t describe myself as a permissive parent, but I’m definitely an exhausted one and not nearly as consistent as I should be, with a high-needs two year old who loves loves loves to push limits and a five month old (who’s a very happy little guy). Right now we stay at home a LOT.

 

[Serap]

No, there are actually permissive parents who never hit, never yell, and never impose a consequence that the child finds all that unpleasant. They are like the people who have dogs who are so untrained as to be little short of feral. They expect everyone else to make accommodation for their darlings, with no direction given to the darlings that would make those darlings welcome in any serene gathering of reasonable people. As you say, they give such inconsistent, conflicting, and misdirected guidance that their charges have no idea what kind of behavior is required. Sometimes they are even unaware that anything other than what they happen to want ever is required, excepting as it conflicts with some unforeseeable whim of their guardians. These people raise pets and children who make others who see them think, “Oh no. Here they come.”

Some of us have had the experience of being spanked or yelled at by parents and do not think our parents handled us wrongly. (Shaming is another story. I cannot think of a single positive example of that.) If you and your parents and your children are of a particular temperament and training and situation, then there will be a time and a place for raising the parental voice and even corporal punishment. It can work.

It is not true that overly permissive parents are “better” than overly controlling parents. Those are simply two ditches, each on the opposite side of the road, but both leading to disaster. In one case, the worst is abuse; on the other, the worst is neglect. A child cannot thrive under either regime.

Love your posts

 

[Serap]

When I was a server in college I was grateful for parents like you. I couldn’t believe that some parents would allow kids to spill drinks, throw food on the floor, and then look at me like it was my fault.

In the last year, now that my son is 3, I have often been complimented at how well my children are behaving in a restaurant.

However, on a bad day, there have also been times were I have noticed a couple changing tables b/c my darling son is acting up. On those days, I have left the resaurant and taken the kids to a nearby park or library while my husband and friends finish up and meet us.

There’s no point in keeping kids around if they are bored and showing it.

I’m not sure if that’s discipline though I just want others around me to enjoy their meal.

 

[Serap]

This post alone has me strengthening my resolve to be a better parent. Anything but that!

I wouldn’t describe myself as a permissive parent, but I’m definitely an exhausted one and not nearly as consistent as I should be, with a high-needs two year old who loves loves loves to push limits and a five month old (who’s a very happy little guy). Right now we stay at home a LOT.

You are in a very difficult stage of motherhood. Yes, it is better to stay home at this point. I stayed at home until my son was 3 and even then, we avoided restaurants until recently and he’s turning 4.

We even skipped vacations for a couple of years b/c our son was too temperamental.

Moma, this stage will pass…enjoy it as much as you can