It's Not About the Media

[unafraid]

And I dare say that I also find it odd that for all the false compassion that they offer to sinners and criminals, they have no compassion whatsoever for pedophiles.

In the Gospels, there exist the greatest treasures the world has ever known. These are the very words of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. God, directly speaking to humanity. Each utterance is made even more precious because there are so few of them recorded. Yet, of this sparse compendium, Christ found it so important that he speaks of two particular sins in a way which separates them from the others, setting them apart by His very mentioning of them. One is sinning against the Holy Spirit, and the other is sinning against the innocence of children. It appears that these are sins for which there is no redemption. Jesus singles them out in such a way so that alternative interpretations can never be definitive.

Therefore, if people find it difficult to muster compassion for the pedophiles of the world, no one should impune them as having some sort of undeveloped sense of mercy. Personally, I have no sympathy for pedophiles, and I am perfectly comfortable to meet my Creator with such an attitude in my heart. Somehow, I think He’ll understand.

 

[Teelynn]

In the Gospels, there exist the greatest treasures the world has ever known. These are the very words of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. God, directly speaking to humanity. Each utterance is made even more precious because there are so few of them recorded. Yet, of this sparse compendium, Christ found it so important that he speaks of two particular sins in a way which separates them from the others, setting them apart by His very mentioning of them. One is sinning against the Holy Spirit, and the other is sinning against the innocence of children. It appears that these are sins for which there is no redemption. Jesus singles them out in such a way so that alternative interpretations can never be definitive.

Therefore, if people find it difficult to muster compassion for the pedophiles of the world, no one should impune them as having some sort of undeveloped sense of mercy. Personally, I have no sympathy for pedophiles, and I am perfectly comfortable to meet my Creator with such an attitude in my heart. Somehow, I think He’ll understand.

I can see where you’re coming from, but if one is repentant, and truly sorry for his/her sin, seeking reconciliation, Jesus won’t forgive him? The mercy of Jesus is deeper than the Ocean. It is something so deep, we cannot with our human minds understand it. I think with true sorrow there is forgiveness.

It is a hard thing however to forgive something so heinous…anyone that claims it is easy to forgive hasn’t had to forgive something that hurt them to the core. It is a struggle…and one needs much prayer at times for the grace to forgive. I myself have at times, begged the Lord to help me with it. He has always helped me, but not at times without a serious struggle. If we are to be forgiven ourselves, however, we have no choice but to forgive, and sometimes over and over, and over again.

I also agree whole heartedly with BR JR and Catharina. I have often thought that the lack of prayer for our clergy on the part of the laity has been a contributing factor so to speak in the sins of the clergy. Catholics have to begin to realize how much they need our prayer. I do believe that Satan’s main prey is the Clergy. Bring down the Clergy and the sheep scatter.

The media is definitely a contributing factor, but it isn’t the core of the problem. Doesn’t mean Satan isn’t using the media to magnify the sin, twisting and turning facts around to deceive. Satan LOVES the media, but they are not the core issue.

 

[RobbyS]

We have to be careful here. More than 90% of these priests entered after WW II and these cases go as far back as the 1950s. It’s not a by-product of Vatican II. It predates Vatican II and goes forward until the late 80s or early 90s. Then the numbers drop significantly. Last year there were only nine reported cases in the USA. We have 25 million Catholics, maybe more. There are countries with less people and more reported cases of abuse.

I’m not proud of the abuse. But I am proud of the fact that we are getting controls in place in the USA.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

I agree with you about not putting it all on Vatican II. The issue is part and parcel about modernism in the Church, and that can be traced to the middle of the 18th Century when so many priests. embraced the Enlightenment. Not only them. The elites were on board, so “freemasonry” began its long march through western culture. The French Revolution brought this way of looking into power and, ironically, purged the Church of its most liberal elements. They weren’t “hard” enough–except cynics like Talleyrand–for the true
revolutionaries, who wanted to remove all “medieval” elements from European culture. In the 19th Century, positivism became a perennial part of Catholic education, although it was subsumed under a kind of pietism that enduring until the '60s. Pius X pushed under ground the most subversive elements, but one could see them beginning to reemerge during the '50s, when the reaction against totalitarianism began to recede. What happened during Vatican II was a kind of co-option of the Church for liberal causes.

So what is the connection with the child abuse thing? Too many priests had childish faiths and their seminaries did not equip them for the society they faced, a world that regards theology–all theology–as nonsense.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

Your opinion is stated above.

Er, yes,

When the laity refuse to pray for the Bishops, when they mock bishops, when they spread scandalous reports about bishops, then that failure by the laity can result in various failures among Bishops. It’s hard to believe but many Catholics joined this campaign of disrespect from the 1960s onward. Surely, in the end, culpability will be shared by many. IMO, that’s terribly chilling.

When the sheep start running rings around the shepherd, maybe some shepherds need to rethink their position.

If catholics are behaving in such an unacceptable way towards their Bishops, maybe they feel it’s the only option open to them given they have been mocked, lied about and scandalised by the Bishops and clergy when they tried to get the church to face up to the abuse going on.

 

[puzzleannie]

if there had not been actual sins and crimes, the media would have had nothing to report, in 1984 when some local papers broke local stories, in the early 90s ditto, in 2000, or now. They are reporting what happened. Don’t kill the messenger. Maybe there are very lax journalistic standards, bad writing, lousy reporting, editorializing, but the fact remains, they did not make this stuff up.

 

[JReducation]

In the Gospels, there exist the greatest treasures the world has ever known. These are the very words of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. God, directly speaking to humanity. Each utterance is made even more precious because there are so few of them recorded. Yet, of this sparse compendium, Christ found it so important that he speaks of two particular sins in a way which separates them from the others, setting them apart by His very mentioning of them. One is sinning against the Holy Spirit, and the other is sinning against the innocence of children. It appears that these are sins for which there is no redemption. Jesus singles them out in such a way so that alternative interpretations can never be definitive.

Therefore, if people find it difficult to muster compassion for the pedophiles of the world, no one should impune them as having some sort of undeveloped sense of mercy. Personally, I have no sympathy for pedophiles, and I am perfectly comfortable to meet my Creator with such an attitude in my heart. Somehow, I think He’ll understand.

Just a point of theology here. These two passages don’t mean what you are saying. St. Jerome clarified their meaning for us in his early commentaries and the Church has subscribed to Jerome’s interpreation for over 1600 years. We cannot ascribe another meaning to them.

The first passage, the “Sin against the Holy Spirit” refers to the belief that a sin, any sin, is too big for God to forgive. That belief is blasephemous, because it is stating that there is an evil that is too great even for God to forgive. It places a limit on God’s omnipotent power to forgive. Sin is the product of bad choices and the influence of Satan. God is not overruled by either man’s choices or the power of Satan. There is nothing that God can’t forgive or nothing that God won’t forgive when there is a contrite heart.

The second passage, the one where Jesus calls the children into his presence and speaks about those who scandalize one of these would be better off if he tied a rock to himself and commited suicide does not mean what it says. It was a metaphoric way of speaking. St. Jerome reminds us that Jesus would never advise that one commit suicide to avoid another sin. So it raises the question, what is Jesus speaking about?

St. Jerome tells us that Jesus is talking about moral innocence, not children. This statement goes along with another, “Unless you become like a child, you cannot enter the Kingdom of Heaven.” Jesus is equating the leading of the innocent into sin with spiritual suicide. In other words, when we lead another person into sin, regardless his age, we are commiting spiritual suicide.

However, no where does Jesus say that the sin cannot be forgiven. Just the opposite. Jesus reminds us that all sins can be forgiven, except the sin against the Holy Spirit. He can forgive even this sin, unless the person no longer believes in forgiveness. God cannot give what man does not accept.

Therefore, we are morally bound to take the Beatitudes to heart. “Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy.” Jesus also reminds us, “Be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect.” God cannot deny us forgiveness when we ask for it. It is against his nature. If we are to be like the Father, we cannot deny anyone forgiveness either. If we read the writings of St. Faustina, Jesus repeats the same message of the Gospels. His mercy is infinite and he desires mercy. The Church accepts that the revelations made to St. Faustina must be observed by all Catholics, because they are the same statements that appear in the Old and New Testaments. There is nothing new there, except the manner of wording the message. That’s why the Church instituted Divine Mercy Sunday.

Since Catholics must believe as we pray, if we worship God’s infinite mercy on Divine Mercy Sunday, then we must believe that his mercy is infinite and we must also believe that our mercy has strive to be equally infinite.

No, we cannot present ourselves to our final judgment withholding mercy from anyone. We shall be measured with the same rod that we measure others.

We have to be very careful how we use the scriptures. We must always use them in the manner that the Church interprets them. There is no allowance for private interpretation of scripture in the Cathollic Church. St. Paul forbade this.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[catharina]

Er, yes,

When the sheep start running rings around the shepherd, maybe some shepherds need to rethink their position.

If catholics are behaving in such an unacceptable way towards their Bishops, maybe they feel it’s the only option open to them given they have been mocked, lied about and scandalised by the Bishops and clergy when they tried to get the church to face up to the abuse going on.

Oh. So one good kick deserves another?
That’s sort of the opposite of the message of Christ.

 

[catharina]

Just a point of theology here. These two passages don’t mean what you are saying. St. Jerome clarified their meaning for us in his early commentaries and the Church has subscribed to Jerome’s interpreation for over 1600 years. We cannot ascribe another meaning to them.

The first passage, the “Sin against the Holy Spirit” refers to the belief that a sin, any sin, is too big for God to forgive. That belief is blasephemous, because it is stating that there is an evil that is too great even for God to forgive. It places a limit on God’s omnipotent power to forgive. Sin is the product of bad choices and the influence of Satan. God is not overruled by either man’s choices or the power of Satan. There is nothing that God can’t forgive or nothing that God won’t forgive when there is a contrite heart.

The second passage, the one where Jesus calls the children into his presence and speaks about those who scandalize one of these would be better off if he tied a rock to himself and commited suicide does not mean what it says. It was a metaphoric way of speaking. St. Jerome reminds us that Jesus would never advise that one commit suicide to avoid another sin. So it raises the question, what is Jesus speaking about?

St. Jerome tells us that Jesus is talking about moral innocence, not children. This statement goes along with another, “Unless you become like a child, you cannot enter the Kingdom of Heaven.” Jesus is equating the leading of the innocent into sin with spiritual suicide. In other words, when we lead another person into sin, regardless his age, we are commiting spiritual suicide.

However, no where does Jesus say that the sin cannot be forgiven. Just the opposite. Jesus reminds us that all sins can be forgiven, except the sin against the Holy Spirit. He can forgive even this sin, unless the person no longer believes in forgiveness. God cannot give what man does not accept.

Therefore, we are morally bound to take the Beatitudes to heart. “Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy.” Jesus also reminds us, “Be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect.” God cannot deny us forgiveness when we ask for it. It is against his nature. If we are to be like the Father, we cannot deny anyone forgiveness either. If we read the writings of St. Faustina, Jesus repeats the same message of the Gospels. His mercy is infinite and he desires mercy. The Church accepts that the revelations made to St. Faustina must be observed by all Catholics, because they are the same statements that appear in the Old and New Testaments. There is nothing new there, except the manner of wording the message. That’s why the Church instituted Divine Mercy Sunday.

Since Catholics must believe as we pray, if we worship God’s infinite mercy on Divine Mercy Sunday, then we must believe that his mercy is infinite and we must also believe that our mercy has strive to be equally infinite.

No, we cannot present ourselves to our final judgment withholding mercy from anyone. We shall be measured with the same rod that we measure others.

We have to be very careful how we use the scriptures. We must always use them in the manner that the Church interprets them. There is no allowance for private interpretation of scripture in the Cathollic Church. St. Paul forbade this.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Amen.

 

[RobbyS]

if there had not been actual sins and crimes, the media would have had nothing to report, in 1984 when some local papers broke local stories, in the early 90s ditto, in 2000, or now. They are reporting what happened. Don’t kill the messenger. Maybe there are very lax journalistic standards, bad writing, lousy reporting, editorializing, but the fact remains, they did not make this stuff up.

Well, Joe McCarthy was making No stuff up either. Alger Hiss was an actual Soviet Spy, and at the elbow of FDR. Our atomic weapons program was riddled by scientists spying for the Soviets. The Progressive Party in 1948 had many communists involved in it. Colleges and universities had many professors who were marxists. The screen actors guild in Hollywood, whose president was Ronald Reagan. Reagan was fearful enough to carry a gun on his person. Joseph Stalin backed the North Korean attack on South Korea in 1950. Communist spies in Great Britain, our chief ally, were informing the Soviets and China about how far we were willing to go militarily.

The question is, however, how does one interpret all these “facts.” Real historians get beyond these broadly general “truths” and present many more facts that support these conclusions. Enough facts and good argumentation result in history.

There is really no such think as objective journalism,however, especially when journalists deal with breaking events.
Journalism requires a story line and it uses whatever facts may be handy to build that story. Likewise it represses facts that do not build that story line. So the press, even if it does not make up facts, makes up stories. Some of these stories are true, some are false, and some are just entertainment. Very little journalism ever counts as history, even bad history. In short, Journalism is ipso facto, biased.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

Oh. So one good kick deserves another?

Are you asking a question, or insinuating that’s what I was saying?

If you’re asking a question, no, I don’t think one good kick deserves another.

If you’re insinuating that’s what I was implying, you’re wrong.

I’ve just been watching a report on a parish in Germany where lifelong catholics are going to the civic authorities and deregistering (for tax purposes) as catholic worshipers.

Many are fuming at the church and the bishops and their handling of the scandals. But many germans remain faithful to the church and her teachings. And I am incredibly impressed with the compassion, forgiveness and fortitude of these faithful people.

That’s sort of the opposite of the message of Christ.

I know.

 

[catharina]

Are you asking a question, or insinuating that’s what I was saying?

If you’re asking a question, no, I don’t think one good kick deserves another.

If you’re insinuating that’s what I was implying, you’re wrong.

I’ve just been watching a report on a parish in Germany where lifelong catholics are going to the civic authorities and deregistering (for tax purposes) as catholic worshipers.

Many are fuming at the church and the bishops and their handling of the scandals. But many germans remain faithful to the church and her teachings. And I am incredibly impressed with the compassion, forgiveness and fortitude of these faithful people.

I know.

I’m sure that the faithful Catholic Germans are wise enough to pray -
and to remember that judging another leads one to being judged by God.

 

[Guyonthestreet]

I’m sure that the faithful Catholic Germans are wise enough to pray -
and to remember that judging another leads one to being judged by God.

I’m sure the ones who have been deeply wounded are praying also, and are in need of much prayer.

We will ALL be judged by God.

 

[JReducation]

I believe that the greatest challenge to the Catholic critics is to be saints. The greatest reformers of the Catholic Church were her greatest critics, yet they became the greatest and best remembered saints such as Francis of Assisi, Dominic Guzman, Teresa of Avila, Catherine of Siena, Ignatius Loyola, John XXIII, Teresa of Calcutta, et al.

But let’s take a closer look at these men and women. They saw the grave sins around them, inside and around the Church. What did they do? They responded with a solution, not an attack. They never demanded anything from the leadership of the Church. They only asked for one thing from the Church, the Church’s blessing on their proposed changes. Their approach was very pro-active. They set out to change hearts and minds within the Church and outside the Church. But they did it without hostility, without anger, without attacking and accusing anyone.

These men and women were very wise. They knew that the guilty would fall on their own, because sin is heavy. As you begin to transform those around the sinner, the sinner suddenly is without protection. He is naked and exposed. He has only two choices: to admit his sin and do whatever needs to be done in justice or to continue with his sin and be destroyed by the consequences. But what these men and women understood was that if they got caught up in the passion of the crowd, they would lose their own souls. Anger has a way of destroying inner peace and silence. Once you lose that, you can’t hear the voice of God. As Jesus said, “He who hears me, hears the one who sent me.” But if you can’t hear, because there is so much anger in your heart, what is left for you?

If anyone believes that this crisis of today is greater or worse than the crises of the times when these men and women lived, think again. Francis and Dominic had to reform a Church that was caught up in power, sex, war, heresy, politics, and ignorance. They were surrounded by a laity that was worse than angry. It was indifferent. I’d rather deal with an angry man than with an indifferent one. At least an angry man cares. But the Catholics of that time didn’t’ care.

However, history tells us that Francis and Dominic, along with their sons, transformed the Church. Dominic conquered the enemies of the Church through his preaching. Francis converted the Catholics through his fidelity to the Church. To this day, we can’t think of one without the other. They were not only contemporaries and friends; they were two sides of a coin. But most importantly, they were models that we should follow.

One thing that I’ve learned from both of these men has been the power of silence. When I feel distressed over these issues, read a particularly disturbing piece of news, hear something that makes me want to scream with frustration, I always remember my Holy Father, Francis.

“Avoid all forms of quarrels, even for the sake of righteousness. For the brother who quarrels in defense of truth, may win the battle, but lose his soul. Quarrels do nothing more than feed the demons within us. Let the brothers seek out silence first. In silence, they will hear the voice of Christ. But let them not act on what they believe to be right. Let them always go to the Church to confirm their belief before acting. Churchmen can sin; but the Church cannot teach falsehood. Submit the fruit of your mediation to the scrutiny of the Church before you speak.” ** (Admonitions of St. Francis)**

I always end up in the same place, at the foot of the cross observing the silence of Mary. From her silence I draw my inspiration. Despite the injustice committed against her Son, she accepted humanity as her children with an immaculate heart, a heart where there was no anger, no passion, no indignation, and no desire for retribution, only forgiveness for the sinner and a mother’s compassion for the victim.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF