It's Simply One Or The Other!

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El_Paulo

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I hope people don’t mind being asked to take part in a bit of an experiment. Of the two scriptures, which one do you most identify with…

In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. (John 14:2 NIV)

Small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. (Matthew 7:14 NIV)

You might want to say why you opted for the one you did, but remember, there’s no right or wrong answer!
 
I honestly don’t see that it does have to be one or the other. The first quote has to do with the Father’s generous provision for us and our salvation. He is prepared to accept everyone in the event that they genuinely seek salvation. There is no one who he is unwilling or unable to assist if they seek Him and His grace and His help.

The second quote reminds us of our own human frailty and tendency to go for the easy path which ultimately leads to damnation.

In other words all can be saved, the Father wants all to be saved, but not all choose to co-operate in their own salvation because it involves some sacrifice.
 
My theology is definitely inclusive. I believe that God is accessable to all mankind (1 Cor 15:28). Some may decide against Catholicism because of personal experiences or because of a lack of appropriate evangelism; is this any fault of their own?

Though they may stay outside the Church, will God throw them into a firey pit for all eternity? Doesn’t sound much like the loving God I have formed a relationship with over the last 30 odd years.

Some people are Christians-- they just haven’t formalised their relationship.

That said, for those of us in full communion with the Holy Catholic Church, I think we need to pay great heed to the warnings of Jesus in scripture such as Matthew 7:14 and do everything in our power to be sincere followers of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Inclusivist theology proposes that all religions, without knowing it, are moving toward Christianity. It is from this lead that they derive their power to save: they lead to salvation insofar as they carry the mystery of Christ hidden within them [Ratzinger, J: *Truth and Tolerance, Ignatius].
Vatican II introduced us to the concept of partial communion [see LG8] and I believe we are all drawn to the truth; we must demonstrate our Christianity with our actions and not be content to simply criticise others for not belonging to our club.
 
If given a choice (and please don’t interpret this to be totally conclusive of my opinions) - at the point in my journey I’m at, I most definately identify with the second statement. I’ve got so much work ahead of me!

BTW - has anyone seen any road-signs to that gate???
 
LilyM said:
I honestly don’t see that it does have to be one or the other. The first quote has to do with the Father’s generous provision for us and our salvation. He is prepared to accept everyone in the event that they genuinely seek salvation. There is no one who he is unwilling or unable to assist if they seek Him and His grace and His help.

The second quote reminds us of our own human frailty and tendency to go for the easy path which ultimately leads to damnation.

In other words all can be saved, the Father wants all to be saved, but not all choose to co-operate in their own salvation because it involves some sacrifice.
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+1 There is no dichotomy between these two passages. This IS a case of “both/and”.

Scott
 
Tonks40 said:
If given a choice (and please don’t interpret this to be totally conclusive of my opinions) - at the point in my journey I’m at, I most definately identify with the second statement. I’ve got so much work ahead of me!

BTW - has anyone seen any road-signs to that gate???
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They’d be the ones that say ‘Catholic Church’ (don’t know about the US, but here we do tend to have street signs pointing to the different places of worship) 😉
 
Tonks40 said:
If given a choice (and please don’t interpret this to be totally conclusive of my opinions) - at the point in my journey I’m at, I most definately identify with the second statement. I’ve got so much work ahead of me!

BTW - has anyone seen any road-signs to that gate???
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:bible1: 👍 😃
 
I agree with LilyM
one is the grace of God, his callings to us.
the other is our response to his prodding.

two sides of the coin

Tak
 
It is truly amazing what you can say when all context is removed.

Catholic doctrine and theology, faith and morals are all based on the as broad of a context that can be found in Sacred Scripture and Sacred Traditon.

This poll does not represent that. It tries to fool peole into a false and heretcal belief that the Bible somehow contradicts itself in matters of Faith Morals.
 
rpp said:
It is truly amazing what you can say when all context is removed.

Catholic doctrine and theology, faith and morals are all based on the as broad of a context that can be found in Sacred Scripture and Sacred Traditon.

This poll does not represent that. It tries to fool peole into a false and heretcal belief that the Bible somehow contradicts itself in matters of Faith Morals.

Shame on you El Paulo.
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:confused:

It’s just a bit of speculative fun! Get over yourself!
 
FightingFat said:
I thought that was quite rude!
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There is a fundamental differnce between telling someone that they did something quite wrong and telling someone to “get over yourself”.

How exactly am I supposed to do that? Slash my wrists, swallow poison or immolate myself? Please tell me.:mad:
 
rpp said:
There is a fundamental differnce between telling someone that they did something quite wrong and telling someone to “get over yourself”.

How exactly am I supposed to do that? Slash my wrists, swallow poison or immolate myself? Please tell me.:mad:
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Oh no- God forbid!!! 😦 Please! There really is no need to over react: - look-- if I upset you please accept my sincere appology.

Your remark struck me as rude in that you are calling the OP to be ashamed of his question and his thoughts. That IMO is highly unappropriate, especially on a forum where all kinds of people you know pretty much zero about talk about all kinds of nonsense. In your post, you do not question his motives or ask for further clarification- you just condemn him out of hand for his post. It suggests to me that you take yourself a little too seriously (an opinion which is, frankly, confirmed by your over reaction) and my remark was aimed to shame you into rembering sacred scripture- specifically Matthew 7:3.

Peace be with you 🙂
 
FightingFat said:
Oh no- God forbid!!! 😦 Please! There really is no need to over react: - look-- if I upset you please accept my sincere appology.

Your remark struck me as rude in that you are calling the OP to be ashamed of his question and his thoughts. That IMO is highly unappropriate, especially on a forum where all kinds of people you know pretty much zero about talk about all kinds of nonsense. In your post, you do not question his motives or ask for further clarification- you just condemn him out of hand for his post. It suggests to me that you take yourself a little too seriously (an opinion which is, frankly, confirmed by your over reaction) and my remark was aimed to shame you into rembering sacred scripture- specifically Matthew 7:3.

Peace be with you 🙂
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Thank you for you apology. I do not believe I take myself that seriously, but matters of faith are serious; look at my signature line.

Where I grew up, the phrase you used is slang for telling soneone to commit suicide. Your phrase, according to my mother, is the second most evil thing one person can say to another. The most evil is telling them where to go after death, and it is not Heaven or Purgatory.
 
The idiomatic phrase “Get over yourself” has never meant “commit suicide”. It means “put aside your empty pride”.

It’s not a very polite way of saying so, and of course none of us know the true state of another’s issues. But I have often thought that the great Christian writers would have appreciated the simple and profound wisdom of it.

We must all get over ourselves, and go from empty pride of self to humility and love of God. If we do not get over ourselves, we will be stuck on ourselves. We will crown ourselves Lord, and send ourselves to Hell.
 
El_Paulo said:
I hope people don’t mind being asked to take part in a bit of an experiment. Of the two scriptures, which one do you most identify with…

In my Father’s house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. (John 14:2 NIV)

Small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. (Matthew 7:14 NIV)

You might want to say why you opted for the one you did, but remember, there’s no right or wrong answer!
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I looked at your profile and was surprised. The question you posed of “which” a person identifies with is one I would have expected of a Protestant.

I did not vote as IMHO both of these go together and can not be separated.
 
The beginning of chapter 14 in John is simply one of my favorite places in the bible, so I answered on that score. I naturally like the first better because it calls to mind the verses that follow, which I love.

Have I been with you all this time, Phillip, and you still do not know me?
 
Mintaka said:
The idiomatic phrase “Get over yourself” has never meant “commit suicide”. It means “put aside your empty pride”.
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So my mother, my teachers, all my brothers and all the people I grew up with lied to me.

Thanks for the heads up.
 
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