IVF delimma

[vera_dicere]

Recently my sister and her partner [not married] have been experiencing fertility issues. The doctor has put my sister on a drug to stimulate ovulation in the hope that she will fall pregnant in the next few months. The doctor, however, does not beleive this will work, and has booked her in for IVF.

My sister has mentioned to my brother if she and her partner can stay with my brother and his wife when they have their IVF done - its in a different city to my sister.

Anyway, my brother is really quite upset, he doesn’t know much about IVF, but he knows it involves the creation and destruction of multiple human beings and possible abortions. He has always tried to be non-judgemental towards my sister, he’s always tried to be the peacemaker between her and I, seeing as I’m quite the black and white Catholic.

So, my brother wants to know what’s the most tactful way to say no. Ive given him a few ideas, but my ideas always come out sounding as blunt as a sack of hammers to the back of the head.

Not only that, but my sister has told me she’s being kept up at night by the moral implications of those left over embryos once created, ie. what happens to them? I’m glad she’s having those thoughts as it could lead to a better understanding of the seriouenss of the situation and perhaps disuade her from having it go further than simple ovulation drugs, and I told her so.

Any ideas?

 

[BlueEyedLady]

I think that you should stay out of your sister’s fertility issues. If your brother wants to say no then let him just say “I’m sorry, but we won’t be able to accommodate you”. Etiquette does not require a reason.

You need to stay out of it and stop judging her feelings. What her and her partner are going through is incredibly painful and difficult, and you butting in is only going to make things worse for everyone. It is between them.

 

[Aggies08]

As far as hosting her, I’d be inclined to say that it “won’t be possible.” You have a big project at work that week, the kids have lots of events, won’t be up to hosting, etc. If she says she doesn’t mind, well YOU wills till feel bad if you can’t host properly.

Why not gently encourage her to try all these other avenues before IVF? There is nothing wrong with trying to correct hormones, or encourage ovulation. Can you send her resources on the Pope Paul 4th institute? How about Dr. Hilgers? drhilgers.com/about/

They do work with clients from afar; it may be worth looking into “even though you don’t do the Catholic stuff, they’ll sort out what’s wrong/try other approaches first.”

 

[daisybee]

As far as hosting her, I’d be inclined to say that it “won’t be possible.” You have a big project at work that week, the kids have lots of events, won’t be up to hosting, etc. If she says she doesn’t mind, well YOU wills till feel bad if you can’t host properly.

Why not gently encourage her to try all these other avenues before IVF? There is nothing wrong with trying to correct hormones, or encourage ovulation. Can you send her resources on the Pope Paul 4th institute? How about Dr. Hilgers? drhilgers.com/about/

They do work with clients from afar; it may be worth looking into “even though you don’t do the Catholic stuff, they’ll sort out what’s wrong/try other approaches first.”

Aggies08, I’m guessing you didn’t notice in the original post that the sister and her partner are not married. Therefore encouraging her to become pregnant outside of the sacrament of marriage, encouraging her in sin would not be the loving thing to do.

 

[bzkoss236]

My best idea is the following:

Sister: “Can you be there with us?”
Brother: “I’m sorry, but I cannot.”

and if she asks why:

Brother: “I love you, but I do not agree with what you are doing.”

I don’t know where the conversation might go past that point…

I with him good luck in finding a suitable response and will say a prayer for your sister and her partner.

 

[daisybee]

Recently my sister and her partner [not married] have been experiencing fertility issues. The doctor has put my sister on a drug to stimulate ovulation in the hope that she will fall pregnant in the next few months. The doctor, however, does not beleive this will work, and has booked her in for IVF.

My sister has mentioned to my brother if she and her partner can stay with my brother and his wife when they have their IVF done - its in a different city to my sister.

Anyway, my brother is really quite upset, he doesn’t know much about IVF, but he knows it involves the creation and destruction of multiple human beings and possible abortions. He has always tried to be non-judgemental towards my sister, he’s always tried to be the peacemaker between her and I, seeing as I’m quite the black and white Catholic.

So, my brother wants to know what’s the most tactful way to say no. Ive given him a few ideas, but my ideas always come out sounding as blunt as a sack of hammers to the back of the head.

Not only that, but my sister has told me she’s being kept up at night by the moral implications of those left over embryos once created, ie. what happens to them? I’m glad she’s having those thoughts as it could lead to a better understanding of the seriouenss of the situation and perhaps disuade her from having it go further than simple ovulation drugs, and I told her so.

Any ideas?

Vera dicere,

This summer I heard Dr. Greg and Lisa Popcak’s More 2 Life show on Catholic radio, and the topic of discussion was “when to speak and when not to speak” to family members and friends regarding matters of faith.

The person they interviewed (Damon Owens, Theology of the Body Institute Director) made several points that I plan to consider in the future, including:

1. 1 Peter 3:13 - It’s important to always approach/respond with gentleness and reverence.
2. Consider the degree of intimacy you have with the person–this will help you discern how much of an impact you will have, how open the person will be to what you have to say. (In general, the closer we are to the person, the more we can say.)
3. Take the time to understand why the person is saying what s/he is saying. (I’m interpreting this to mean that there would need to be time for some “Why do you say that?” and “What do you mean?” questions.)
4. PAUSE - to avoid an angry or flippant response (back to #1).
5. Frame response in terms of "What can I say that will be for the good of the other person?

The July 12 podcast archive is here if you want to have a listen: avemariaradio.net/showArchive.php?id=hms

Maybe this framework will help your brother in discussing the situation with your sister. It seems to be an excellent opportunity to have a talk about the issue and Church teachings (especially given her concerns about the destruction of embryos), although of course it won’t be an easy talk to have.

 

[vera_dicere]

I think that you should stay out of your sister’s fertility issues. If your brother wants to say no then let him just say “I’m sorry, but we won’t be able to accommodate you”. Etiquette does not require a reason.

You need to stay out of it and stop judging her feelings. What her and her partner are going through is incredibly painful and difficult, and you butting in is only going to make things worse for everyone. It is between them.

Well, you mght be on to something, if not for the fact my sister has made public every step of the way her fertility issues. Including asking my advice both professionally and ethically.

 

[vera_dicere]

Aggies08, I’m guessing you didn’t notice in the original post that the sister and her partner are not married. Therefore encouraging her to become pregnant outside of the sacrament of marriage, encouraging her in sin would not be the loving thing to do.

That’s exactly the ethical delimma some of the other family members have had. I’ve spoken to a priest about it, actually, and he gave me the whole “you’re not your sister’s keeper” argument.

Do we pray/hope for pregnancy naturally occuring or with the assistance of drugs? Which is essentially praying/hoping for the continued sin of fornication and degrading the human persons involved? Endangering souls?

The lesser of two evils? But both being intrinsically evil. I’ve simply been praying for her and her partner to come to God, to combine their will with His, and realise the dignity of the human persons they seek to create through such abominable means.

 

[daisybee]

I’ve simply been praying for her and her partner to come to God, to combine their will with His, and realise the dignity of the human persons they seek to create through such abominable means.

That sounds wise. I wouldn’t feel comfortable aiding someone in doing evil, even if it were a “lesser” one among other possibilities. I’d still speak with her about it, especially since she’s come to you about it. Maybe try the non-hammer, gentle approach Popcak recommends.

 

[Trishie]

Praying for your sister and your family, and your sister’s partner.
If your sister goes ahead with this, and children do result, welcome the children despite any other sadness, because these innocent children who survive deserve love and welcome as much as any other child born into this world.

Merciful God we implore You to guide vera dicere’s sister to decide against doing something she already fears is likely to involves the death of little ones.
May Your loving will prevail, and may Your graces find welcome in vera dicere sister’s heart, mind, and action.