D
- Status
A
AgnosTheist
Guest
I love to challenge traditional religious thinking. Ive been to many different forums and this is one of the best. On the positive note, i am ‘encouraged’ to be charitable here. Maybe it would make sense the saying 'keep your friends close, and enemies closer (and under control)". 
A
AgnosTheist
Guest
i thought you implied that only straight men are allowed for ordination:
Oh so you’re saying ‘gay Catholics’ are lying about their sexual orientation when they take up a position they know to be extremely sacred?
Yeah lets. Someone said that pregnant nuns are stripped of being nuns. Even if its the result of sex abuse?
D
dmelosi
Guest
You are better off ignoring him. He gets pretty sarcastic and has 1 thing in mind only…to bait people.
L
Lost_Wanderer
Guest
I was merely repeating the Church’s stance. We are to…
“…prohibit any individual who has present deep-seated homosexual tendencies or support the so-called “gay culture”, or any individual having had such “tendencies” within the past three years…”
…from entering the clergy.
Meaning if you’re a sexually active homosexual and you won’t be able to eliminate your sexual tendencies (and keep it that way for three years), the priesthood is not for you. The same goes for straight people.
When it comes down to it, celibacy is basically refraining from any form of sexual thought and activity in order to have a deeper relationship with the Lord and all that stuff.
Funny, I was just about to get out of here and go to another thread. Arguing over old stuff like this bores me. :yawn:
Oh well, Ja-ne…
J
johncatholic
Guest
Even if some of the accusations against priests and nuns are true does that refute the whole Catholic church? What Jack Chick preaches is so ridiculous and untrustworthy that it is laughable. What skeleton’s does he and his cohorts have? What gets me is these anti-Catholics groups are so blatent in their hostility to the Catholic church and though he doesn’t speak favorably against Muslims he wouldn’t show such hostility to them nor to Jews at all. He would be afraid they would have his head on a platter. He should realize that the true anti-Christ and enemies of Christians is not the Catholic church but others that try to eradicate Christ and Christians from the world and those who fight against Christian ideas in this country such as you can’t even say ''Merry Christmas" without offending some people. He is a jerk, schmuck and moron.
A
AgnosTheist
Guest
no it doesnt. only affects its reputation.
R
Rachel_Malloy
Guest
It’s reputation as what? It’s a hospital for sinners.
That there are people in it that are sinful is, well to put it bluntly “duh.”
The Church does not have any dogma or doctrine that mandates sex abuse.
That there are people in it that are sinful is, well to put it bluntly “duh.”
The Church does not have any dogma or doctrine that mandates sex abuse.
A
anamchrist
Guest
It isn’t so much the abuse itself that blackens the Church’s eye (horrible though it may be), as much as the Church’s response to the abusive behavior. Denying it ever happened, moving priests to new parishes rather than laicising them, covering up, blaming others (including the victims) for the abuse and cover up (all the media’s fault I think the dear Pope once said before his election), etc. And these things, starting with the Vatican and working its way down to the parish clergy and many laity, THAT is what makes the Church look bad to the world. If you can’t trust the Church to tell the truth about these things, what can you trust the Church to tell the truth about?
A
AgnosTheist
Guest
^ thats absolutely true. 
D
dmelosi
Guest
All the media’s? I am guessing you have site or article to back that up. Surely you wouldn’t just make that up?
M
mercygate
Guest
A
anamchrist
Guest
Here you go:
poynter.org/dg.lts/id.46/aid.11984/column.htm
snapnetwork.org/Papal%20visit%202008/040808_benedicts_record_on_sexual_abuse.html
“- In 2002, when the clergy sexual abuse crisis exploded in the United States, Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger blamed the scandals on an “intentional, manipulated…desire to discredit the church” by the media.”
orangepunch.freedomblogging.com/2008/04/17/unfortunately-pope-blamed-society/
“the sex-abuse scandal in the church is not “society’s” fault, any more than crime is the fault of poverty rather than individuals who choose to commit crimes. Here, the pope fell into the fallacy of the Left: that broad societal factors undermine personal responsibility. In past years, when the pope was the head of doctrine for the Vatican, he blamed the sex-abuse scandal on the media, and its supposed antipathy to Catholicism.”
traditioninaction.org/religious/m016rpBenedictAbuseCrisis.html
" it seems clear to me he played a large role in the earlier cover-up of the pedophile priests and Bishops. Then, in the more recent past he has often taken a clear position supporting the priests and Bishops, affirming that the public reaction against clergy sexual abuse was chiefly media-produced. "
fatherlasch.com/article/315/three-witnessesthree-witnesses
bestofneworleans.com/dispatch/2004-11-16/news_feat.html
Enough?
Here’s one more for good measure:
time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,397520,00.html
“German Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, perhaps the most powerful policymaker in Rome besides the Pope, told a Catholic news wire that the U.S. sex-abuse scandal was an “intentional, manipulated … desire to discredit the church” by the media.”
D
dmelosi
Guest
I went back and read your post and found it confusing the first time. My first response to you was that I thought you were saying the pope blamed the scandal on the media.
I read it a second and third time and think that you are saying is that the pope knew about the abuse and the cover up at the time and blamed the media for making it as big a scandal as it was??? Is that correct?
E
Eden
Guest
The original article is from 2001 and is about some African priests abusing nuns. It sounds like corrupt local priests in Africa were abusing their power, much as so many of their dictators do in government in Africa, sadly. Perhaps this kind of abuse is why the Vatican issued a caution to the bishops in Africa to be more careful in screening seminary applicants, as there is no shortage of applicants to seminaries in Africa, but many were clambering to become priests simply because they got food and lodging.
E
Eden
Guest
The Pope didn’t cover up anything when he was Cardinal Ratzinger. He read every single case against each priest and was reportedly appalled by what was happening in the American Church. The criticism that he “covered up” for pedophile priests is simply unfounded. What if some of the accusations had been false? Surely, those priests deserved to have each case considered and investigated, not have their names and the accusations immediately revealed to the public. And I completely agree with his statements at the time, the scandal of abuse in the American Church* was* largely led by media-driven anti-Catholicism. I don’t remember Philip Jenkins’ **“The myth of the ‘pedophile priest’” **making headlines in 2002 to temper the image that priests are pedophiles. From the media coverage, I thought at least 50% of priests must have been involved. God forbid the media should make clear that less than 2% of priests were involved or that pedophilia is more common amongst the general population. No, it was clear that the media had an anti-Catholic agenda fueling their coverage.
R
rpp
Guest
Are people differentiating between the actions of individuals and teachings of the Church? I do not see many making that important distinction here.
One might as well argue that all Americans are serial murders because Ted Bundy was an American.
One might as well argue that all Americans are serial murders because Ted Bundy was an American.
D
dmelosi
Guest
I agree, I am trying to get to the bottom of what he was saying.
R
rpp
Guest
Ah yes. I see that. It appears that your very important point was, sadly, ignored.
- Status