James White Has Completely Lost It [Akin] – Part 2

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Teflon93 said:
That would be nice. Does White give any indication of interest in Christian unity OR Christian charity?
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I don’t know. But he has a life. And certainly in that life he must have the raw material on which to draw in order to desire peace. Does he think he is so different from any of us in this regard?
 
Ani Ibi:
Here is an even brighter idea: who do you think Pastor Dan might be less defensive with? Myself or
you?

(Hint: it isn’t me.)
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You’re assuming Don Fry has something about which to be defensive. 🙂
Ani Ibi:
But at what cost to the Body of Christ?
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You’re assuming that you have a correct understanding of the body of Christ. 🙂

If you don’t want to call Don Fry, don’t; it was just a suggestion; I have no reason to
contact him. 🙂
 
sandusky said:
Heck no—you have the perfect opportunity to interact personally with White on this issue, an issue which you seem to grasp quite well, given all of the links you have provided.

Call in, tell them who you are, and why you are calling, and I’m certain you will go to the head
of the line.
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I would hardly term calling a radio show a “perfect opportuinity.”

I am speaking from experience. I have a friend who is a disc jockey, and I have often been on his show both via phone and in the studio.

Well, my friend (and this was a friend, mind you), had complete control of what went out over the air and what didn’t. He would occasionally make me look silly by cutting off my microphone, not allowing me a chance to respond to something he had said. Now, this was all done in fun, but it made a huge impression on me about how much power the person in charge has about what the audience hears and what it doesn’t. My friend, for example, always made sure he had the last word. Always.

If White is so confident his position is right, he should relish the opportunity to debate the matter on a level playing field, not one in which he has control about what the audience hears and what it doesn’t.
 
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sandusky:
You’re assuming Don Fry has something about which to be defensive. 🙂
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Yes.
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sandusky:
You’re assuming that you have a correct understanding of the body of Christ. 🙂
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Am I?
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sandusky:
If you don’t want to call Don Fry, don’t; it was just a suggestion; I have no reason to
contact him. 🙂
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If you have no reason to contact Pastor Dan, then what reason do you have for goading us to engage Dr White in debate? In other words, what is the more Christian vision?

[SIGN]Friendship or Factitiousness?[/SIGN]
 
Hello Dandelion,

You posted:
Boy, did I get here late!
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What was the deal with Beckwith?>>

Me: Dr. Francis Beckwith, now the former President of the Evangelical Theological Society, was a very prominent Evangelical who recently (April, 2007) returned to the Catholic Church.

As to be expected, Evangelicals did not take too kindly to this event. One of the most vocal critics (“stalkers”) has been James White, a professional “Reformed Baptist apologist” (i.e. anti-Catholic).

The most recent barrage of chatter on this event is centered around Dr. Beckwith’s appearance (August 05, 2007) on an Evangelical radio talk-show “Stand To Reason” (http://www.str.org/ ).

The next day, a thread was started to discuss some of the content of the radio broadcast:

http://str.typepad.com/weblog/2007/08/when-did-we-get.html .

[To be continued due to length.]
 
 
In an attempt to help this discussion remain focused now that Part 1 is closed…
Catholic_Opinion said:
And by “it,” I mean two things: First, his mind, and second, the debate.
The reason I say that is that White has now posted pictures depicting those who have urged him to be more charitable with Frank Beckwith as radical Muslims protesting and urging beheading.
Here are the pictures.
To the first he gave the name “RCfatwa” (i.e., Roman Catholic fatwa):
jimmyakin.typepad.com/defensor_fidei/images/2007/08/09/rcfatwa.jpg
To the second he gave the name “RCcharity” (i.e., “Roman Catholic charity”–depicting the attitude of the man in the picture as the kind of charity that Catholics display):
jimmyakin.typepad.com/defensor_fidei/images/2007/08/09/rccharity.jpg
ORIGINAL SOURCE.
Toward the end of his post, White seeks to blunt criticism of these pictures (or appears to do so) by saying:Now, I have obviously attempted to insert a bit of levity, and a bit of humorous sarcasm here, for the simple reason that I’m to the point where you either have to laugh or cry.
I’m sorry, but no. This kind of excuse will not do. Not in the slightest.
You do not compare your interlocutors to Islamists or portray those who urge charity on your part as if they were advocates of beheading those who disagree with them. Whether you feel they are right or wrong, annoying or not, or even reasonable or not, the actions of people engaged in this discussion with White are simply incommensurate with the kind of actions undertaken by radical Muslims.
What White has done here is not humor.
It is vile. It is reprehensible. It is despicable. It is outrageous. If White were thinking rationally, he would see this.
Hence, White has lost his mind when it comes to this. He is not functioning as a rational agent on this topic.
He also loses any debate on this point via special application of Godwin’s Law.
Godwin’s Law holds that the longer an online discussion goes, the greater the odds of someone making a comparison to Hitler. It is standard practice in many Internet circles–because of the inflammatory nature of this comparison and its tendency to start flame wars and shut down rational discussion–to regard anyone who makes such a comparison (unless you are talking about real-life Nazis or mass murderers) as having automatically lost the debate in question.
Islamists are the Nazis of the post-9/11 world, and thus anyone who depicts his debate opponents as Islamists automatically loses whatever debate was underway due to forfeiture.
He has crossed a fundamental line that shows himself to be incapable of holding a rational discussion. Excuses like “it was just a little levity” count for nothing. Those are the remarks of a troll. The individual has shown that he is not willing to make a good faith effort to abide by the terms of Internet discussions, and there is no point in discussing anything with him–either ever or at least until he seriously and sincerely acknowledges just how far over the line he was.
Discussion over.
James, you lose.
If you were Catholic, I’d tell you to go to confession.
What you did was vile, unacceptable, and childish. You have reduced yourself to the status of a troll.
If you can’t immediately see that and make amends then no one, knowing that you are capable of this, should engage you in debate or discussions of any kind.
**UPDATE: **The above pictures are so vile, particularly in light of 9/11 and the ensuing history and those who have been threatened or killed by radical Muslims, that this should be a matter upon which individuals of all confessional affiliations should be able to agree, including Evangelicals. I would like to invite Evangelicals, including those who have been close to White, to both publicly and privately distance themselves from the actions of Mr. White in posting these pictures as an act fundamentally incompatible with Christian charity. Evangelicals, in particular, can play a spiritual service to White by making this clear to him, since as the pictures themselves illustrate, he is deaf to appeals to charity from Catholics.

More…
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Ani Ibi:
If you have no reason to contact Pastor Dan, then what reason do you have for goading us to engage Dr White in debate?
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Goading—stating that White has an open, and standing invitation for anyone on CAF to call into the Dividing Line and discuss this issue with him is hardly goading.
Ani Ibi:
In other words, what is the more Christian vision?
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That’s very close to goading; again, I have no reason to contact Don Fry.
 
Here is another blog carrying the story. Dr White says:
If a Cardinal of the Roman Curia became a Baptist tomorrow, tell me, how would you respond? link
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Thoughts? :highprayer:

Sandusky, in response to Dr White’s appearance on the blog above, this guy wants to debate Dr White, but it seems the good Dr has not taken him up on it. Waddupwidat?

:knight2:

Another guy has documented Dr White’s various and many ‘odes’ to Beckwith.

:harp:
Is Dr. Francis Beckwith Being Personally
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(Not Just Theologically) Maligned and Attacked for Becoming a Catholic? You be the Judge link
James White: Former President of the Evangelical Theological Society (Francis Beckwith) Was a Clss Imle Regarding Evangelical Theology link
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sandusky:
Goading—stating that White has an open, and standing invitation for anyone on CAF to call into the Dividing Line and discuss this issue with him is hardly goading.
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Persistently resisting our wishes not to debate Dr White is goading.
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sandusky:
That’s very close to goading…
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It’s nowhere close to goading.
… again, I have no reason to contact Don Fry.
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If you want a certain outcome then it only stands to reason that you should be part of the mechanism to achieve that outcome. So if you want something to change in this scenario, then why don’t you show us how to do it?

[SIGN]You debate Dr White![/SIGN]
 
sandusky said:
White has an open, and standing invitation to all on CAF to call-in to his Dividing Line program and discuss these issues with him, rather than, as he puts it, “hiding behind a keyboard.”

Give him a call 🙂
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Folks,
Code: 
I agree with Sandusky, if you have anything to say just call his program. Stop polluting CA with His nonsense. Have anybody stoped to thing that perhaps some of Mr White's most outrageous acts, like the infamous Muslim Fanatics-Catholic pictures, are an attempt to cause precisely the type of reaction these things cause? After praying and reflecting about this I realized that, every time we bring this kind of thing into this forum we are all playing into His sad game.
I honestly believe that ignoring Mr White is the best way of dealing with him. There is so much we could be discussing right now!!!

In His love

A Catholic Deacon
 
Given that America is at the moment at war with terrorists who behead Christians and Jews (not to mention those Muslims who “collaborate” with us), what is funny about the second picture, “Behead Those Who Lack Charity?”

Is it funny that there are murderous fanatics running around beheading innocent people?

Is it funny to mock the notion of Christian charity?

If White’s defenders truly think this is funny, that goes a long way to explaining why they think White is a theologian.
 
Catholicdeacon said:
Folks,
Code: 
I agree with Sandusky, if you have anything to say just call his program. Stop polluting CA with His nonsense. Have anybody stoped to thing that perhaps some of Mr White's most outrageous acts, like the infamous Muslim Fanatics-Catholic pictures, are an attempt to cause precisely the type of reaction these things cause? After praying and reflecting about this I realized that, every time we bring this kind of thing into this forum we are all playing into His sad game.
I honestly believe that ignoring Mr White is the best way of dealing with him. There is so much we could be discussing right now!!!

In His love

A Catholic Deacon
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Very wise: call him, or ignore him. 🙂
 
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