Jehovah's Witnesses Believe in Hell

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DonCameron

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Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe in Hell. It’s just that what they believe about Hell is different from what most other people believe.

They believe that Hell is “the common grave of mankind.” And that when people die (good or bad) they all go to Hell where they are sleeping in death, awaiting the resurrection of the dead.

They believe what it says in Ecclesiastes 9:10…

All that your hand finds to do, with your very power (while you are alive), because there is no work, no devising, nor knowledge nor wisdom in Hell, the place to which you are going.

The feel that none of these things go on in Hell because of what it says in verse 5…

For the living are conscious that they will die, but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all.

And so again, Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe in Hell. It’s just that what they believe about it is different from what most everyone else believes about it.

Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com
Former elder
 
I went ahead and bought this book “captives of a concept” it is very good. I bought the pdf and the hard copy, so I can get my instant satisfaction (good old american culture) and keep it too.

I am using it to talk to one of my Jehovah’s Witness friends and it has helped me tremendously. I haven’t talked to him about Hell yet and actually haven’t talked to him for about a week, so I am reading more of this book to bolster my confidence in constructive dialogue.

God Bless
Scylla
 
I find it odd that they would have to turn to a place like Ecclesiastes to define that teaching, books like Psalms and Probverbs and Ecc use too much poetic talk, not that its bad, but not all passages are as clear cut as they look.
 
Jehovah’s Witnesses do believe in Hell. It’s just that what they believe about Hell is different from what most other people believe.
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In my Conversations with JW I have asked whether or not they believe in hell, all have told me no. However they do believe in a common grave as you say but when I say hell I am talking about an eternal punishment when they talk about eternal punishment they believe that the punishment is in ceasing to be with God so it is ceasing to exist. When they refer to gehena or the common grave, which actually they believe that all who die share this common grave. Basically that there in this dead state until the Resurection where then again as I said earlier believe that there is no eternal punishment “hell” the evil person or the non JW will cease to exist. How ever the 144,000 will be in heaven and the rest of the JW on paradise earth. That my understanding of the issue.
 
Hi Christian84,

You said…

*In my conversations with JW I have asked whether or not they believe in hell, all have told me no. *

If they say “No” they are saying it from the standpoint that they don’t believe in the “Hell” that you have in mind. As you then said…

When I say hell I am talking about an eternal punishment.

This is another thing they believe in, but not the same way most others believe about it. See below…

You then correctly explain…

*When they talk about eternal punishment they believe that the punishment is in ceasing to exist. *

You said…

*When they refer to Gehenna or the common grave, which actually they believe that all who die share this common grave. *

Witnesses do not believe that “Gehenna” has anything to do with “the common grave.” The Hebrew word for this common grave is “sheol.” The Greek word is “hades.” They believe that the Greek word “Gehenna” is the place of “eternal punishment” that is represented in Revelation 20:20:14 as “the second death, the lake of fire.”

It is interesting (I think) to note that even "hell’’’ (Hades) itself eventually ends up empty (verse 13) and then is thrown into this “lake of fire.”

You then said…

Witnesses "believe that there is no eternal punishment.
T
his is another case where they do believe in “eternal punishment” but not the same way most everyone else believes about it. They believe that the gift God gives is everlasting life but that wages sin pays is everlasting death in the above symbolic “lake of fire.” -Romans 6:23

You said…

The evil person or the non JW will cease to exist. How ever the 144,000 will be in heaven and the rest of the JW on paradise earth. That my understanding of the issue.

You are correct.

The place where they “cease to exist” is Revelation’s “the second death” - the “lake of fire.” They do not believe this “lake” literally exists but that it simply represents “everlasting destruction.” Again, interestingly, not only “hell” is thrown into that “lake,” but the condition of “death” itself eventually ends up there. Rev. 20:13,14

Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com
 
Hi Scylla,

Glad to hear that you have the book. You have probably noticed that I don’t encourage the reader get involved with debating with Jehovah’s Witnesses about what the Bible does or doesn’t teach. Most Witnesses are much more prepared to do this than most non-Witnesses.

And too, it isn’t what they believe about “Hell” or any other teaching of the Bible that holds them captive. It’s what they believe about the Watchtower Society that blocks them.

If you have any questions please e-mail me at camryn@bluefrog.com

I’m not allowed to talk about the book on this forum.

Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com
 
Good advice, I just received the hard copy yesterday and have read the majority of the book. Once I finish, I will read it again to make sure I absorb it and am comfortable with using them teaching me to teach them about the organization.

Before I got the book I already got kinda deep into discussions about the Bible, and actually was able to make some good points. Unfortunately since I was able to make some good points they stopped coming to my house. Yet I tracked down the phone of one of them who came to my house. (not recommended, I am not crazy or anything) He happened to be someone I knew from High School and we have been talking ever since. This is the guy who let me take a tour of Kingdom Hall and now is talking to me.

You are right about how most non-witnesses are unable to engage them in normal dialogue and get anywhere, over the Bible. It was interesting and a little saddening to me how much they prepare to talk to people. Do all Kingdom Halls have a table, with 2 chairs and microphones, where they can pretend they are visiting someone and practice? Do they do this as part of their service?

God Bless
Scylla

You can PM me about the book if you want to talk.
 
Hi Scylla,

You asked…

Do all Kingdom Halls have a table, with 2 chairs and microphones, where they can pretend they are visiting someone and practice? Do they do this as part of their service?

Yes. This is one of the things that goes on during their “Service Meeting.” (I assume this is still what they call that meeting.) This is where they receive training on how to talk to people when they go door-to-door or during their “Bible Studies.”

They also have an hour “Ministry School” each week where they learn to give public talks, defend their faith, etc.

Their five hours of meetings each week help to explain why they are better prepared to discuss the Bible’s teachings then the average non-Witness who usually has had little, if any, training on either how to defend their faith or how to deal with Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com
 
Well you pretty much summed up what my friend explained to me when we were looking at the charts\schedules and assignments in the entrance of the Kingdom Hall. So it is true that they are pretty much standardized in their design?

Except I don’t remember what they called their meeting, I will find out later next time I talk to them.

God Bless
Scylla
 
All meetings are under the direction of the one centralized authority - “the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses” who are located in Brooklyn, New York.

Witnesses view the fact that they all do everything the same way no matter where they live on earth as one of the proofs that it is “the true religion.”

There is very little that is left up to the imagination of the local elders. Even their “Public Talks” on Sunday morning are pretty well scripted by the Governing Body.

Don
 
Don,

I’ll disagree in one context…most Witnesses are uncomfortable speaking about the bible outside of the proof texts the Society uses…and generally aren’t comfortable when reading around those proof texts to give context to the verses. Having said that, most Catholics don’t have scripture verses memorized…which you really need to if you plan on witnessing to the Witnesses.

From my perspective the hardest thing about dealing with a JW is that they are very good at deflecting questions and changing the subject.
 
Yerusalyim,

You said…

“From my perspective the hardest thing about dealing with a JW is that they are very good at deflecting questions and changing the subject.”

This seems to be a common human tendency where we tend to want to ‘deflect questions and change the subject’ when confronted by something we are not ready or willing to accept.
It seems easy to recognize when others do this but not so easy to notice when we ourselves do it.

You acknowledged…

Most Catholics don’t have scripture verses memorized…which you really need to if you plan on witnessing to the Witnesses.

But there is a way to approach Jehovah’s Witnesses that doesn’t require any Scripture verses to be memorized. It completely avoids debating with them about what the Bible does or doesn’t teach.

It is designed to gently lead them in a position where they end up teaching themselves that they have not been told the truth about their organization’s history. And it is this realization that wakes most Witnesses up to the reality that God and Jesus Christ have never had anything to do with the Watchtower Society.

For example, a former elder from Ireland expressed his feelings this way once he realized this…

“What really shocked me to my core was this: We were so convinced that the Governing Body would never tell one lie. They would always speak the truth no matter what the truth was. That is a fabrication; it is a lie. They have lied to us. They have deceived us. And we have the documented evidence. And because we have spoken about it, we were silenced. And that’s what will happen to any Jehovah’s Witness listening to this program. And he knows it in his heart.”

This is the usual reaction once Witnesses discover that they have not been told the truth by those they have trusted the most within their organization.

Witnesses usually need to at least to begin to have serious doubts in the Watchtower Society before they can begin to allow themwselves to notice if what they believe about the Bible may not be true.

Unfortunately I am not able to explain this approach on this Forum because it is presented in my book. And I’m not allowed to say anything that gives the impression that I’m promoting the book.

Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com
(I have been given permission list the books website.)
 
DonCameron,

I think that I may not have expressed my understanding of the issue well enough, But what you explaind very well was the understanding that I had of JW Teaching on hell. Thanks for making it so clear. 👍
 
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DonCameron:
All meetings are under the direction of the one centralized authority - “the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses” who are located in Brooklyn, New York.

Witnesses view the fact that they all do everything the same way no matter where they live on earth as one of the proofs that it is “the true religion.”

There is very little that is left up to the imagination of the local elders. Even their “Public Talks” on Sunday morning are pretty well scripted by the Governing Body.

Don
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This is news to me, it is interesting as well.

Could you enlighten us on some examples of some scripted “Public Talks”? Like what happens? Do they open the mailbox on Saturday night and have a script sent from Brooklyn and they just read word for word out lound?
 
Catholic Dude,

You asked…
*Could you enlighten us on some examples of some scripted “Public Talks”? *

When I was an elder in the 1970s and 1980s we received Outlines from the Governing Body for our Public Talks that were given on Sundays. At that at time they were considered more like ‘suggested outlines.’ We could drift from the outline and add our own comments (which I often did), which we developed as a result of our own personal research.

This was also true, but to a lesser degree, when preparing talks for the three Assemblies held during the year. But even then, we were given some leeway when it came to how we presented what the Governing Body wanted the Witnesses to hear. But my understanding is that this is no longer the case.

There are many Witnesses (including elders) who are on the way out of the Watchtower Society today but who still go to meetings. They post on Ex-Witness Forums and let us know what is going on at the meetings and assemblies.

Elders have explained that they are no longer free to ‘punch up’ the public talks. And that these talks are not just outlines any more. They are full manuscripts that are not be deviated from.

Whether the Governing Body does this consciously or subconsciously, the end result is that this arrangement gives them more control over the rest of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Don
 
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