Jesuits and TLM learning from the FSSP

[adawgj]

God willing, I am in discernment and thinking about joining the Jesuits after college to one day become a priest.

Now this is far in the future for me, but is it possible for Jesuit priests to learn the TLM with the help from FSSP priests? Because God willing I would love to one day celebrate Mass in the Extraordinary form.

 

[The_Walrus_1]

What are relations like between FSSP and SoJ? I had the impression that Jesuits were pretty liberal.

 

[Attempto]

I had the impression that Jesuits were pretty liberal.

So had I … But I don’t know, one of my relatives is a member of SJ and professor at University and I don’t think he likes TLM …

Deus te benedicat,
in Christo, frater, Attempto

 

[PaulfromIowa]

Some Jesuits are liberal but not all. Father Mitch Pacwa of EWTN is a Jesuit.

 

[Usige]

Yes, it is possible. I have read a handful of articles over the last couple years about Jesuit priests who have learned the EF. I know one article that talked about a newly ordained SJ priest offering a high mass with a diocesan priest serving as the deacon and an FSSP priest that served as subdeacon. I don’t think it is common for Jesuits to learn the EF, but maybe for some reverting to tradition is their way of expressing “radical” thought (hint look at Latin “root” of radical )

 

[BertBlyleven]

Possible, yes, there are several Jesuits who are friends with the FSSP priests. Many priests in the FSSP adopt an Ignation spirituality, and many would be Jesuits if they were a bit more sane (I will let you decide who I mean by “they”). Fr Calvin Goodwin, FSSP is a former Jesuit. The important thing to remember is the years leading up to ordination. With the FSSP, it is 7 years centered around the Old Mass. With the Jesuits, your formation is longer in duration, but is probably centered around silly stuff.

Remember, there are many religious orders that adopt Ignatian spirituality and live similar lives as Jesuits…and they aren’t Jesuits for a reason.

 

[adawgj]

Possible, yes, there are several Jesuits who are friends with the FSSP priests. Many priests in the FSSP adopt an Ignation spirituality, and many would be Jesuits if they were a bit more sane. Fr Calvin Goodwin, FSSP is a former Jesuit. The important thing to remember is the years leading up to ordination. With the FSSP, it is 7 years centered around the Old Mass. With the Jesuits, your formation is longer in duration, but is probably centered around silly stuff.

Remember, there are many religious orders that adopt Ignatian spirituality and live similar lives as Jesuits…and they aren’t Jesuits for a reason.

Yes, but regardless of how the Jesuits have been lately there seems to be something that interests me about the order. I just hope if God lets me go up to theology studies that the theology is good theology. I hope by the time I join the Jesuits will be a little more orthodox like.

 

[BertBlyleven]

Yes, but regardless of how the Jesuits have been lately there seems to be something that interests me about the order. I just hope if God lets me go up to theology studies that the theology is good theology. I hope by the time I join the Jesuits will be a little more orthodox like.

Find out what that something is, and see where else it exists. Know specifically. The name or history or patrons is not enough to sustain. I’m not saying this is you, but I’ve seen guys pursue the Jesuits because of admiration for the order, only to be let down by what they encounter.

EDIT: If you like Kant, you might be in the right place.

 

[adawgj]

Find out what that something is, and see where else it exists. Know specifically. The name or history or patrons is not enough to sustain. I’m not saying this is you, but I’ve seen guys pursue the Jesuits because of admiration for the order, only to be let down by what they encounter.

EDIT: If you like Kant, you might be in the right place.

I know one of the main parts of discernment is the 30 day silent retreat. And just an FYI I’m still learning about religious orders and trying to find the perfect one that God wants me to be.
It’ll be years till I actually further into discernment right now I’m still in beginning stages.

 

[kozlosap]

Possible, yes, there are several Jesuits who are friends with the FSSP priests. Many priests in the FSSP adopt an Ignation spirituality, and many would be Jesuits if they were a bit more sane (I will let you decide who I mean by “they”). Fr Calvin Goodwin, FSSP is a former Jesuit. The important thing to remember is the years leading up to ordination. With the FSSP, it is 7 years centered around the Old Mass. With the Jesuits, your formation is longer in duration, but is probably centered around silly stuff.

Remember, there are many religious orders that adopt Ignatian spirituality and live similar lives as Jesuits…and they aren’t Jesuits for a reason.

LOL! Obviously you haven’t investigated the difference in education between the 2 orders. Putting down one order to make another seem superior is ridiculous.

 

[Cojuanco]

What are relations like between FSSP and SoJ? I had the impression that Jesuits were pretty liberal.

If you mean heterodox, I’ve never actually met a Jesuit who was nothing less than orthodox.

As to relations with the FSSP, I would say probably no different than relations with other consecrated religious - they have different charisms, so they’ll be different. Hence why most probably aren’t interested in the TLM - it’s not part of their charism, or usually necessary to their assignments. It’s like expecting Army officers to learn all there is to know about ships - nothing wrong with it, but they’re not the Navy.

 

[BertBlyleven]

LOL! Obviously you haven’t investigated the difference in education between the 2 orders. Putting down one order to make another seem superior is ridiculous.

On the contrary, I have done both.

Look at what modernist Jesuit theology and philosophy has done in the past hundred years. Look at what Thomism has done in its history. Read Leo XIII and Pius X. Viewing the two as “equals” is far more ridiculous.

 

[Cojuanco]

On the contrary, I have done both.

Look at what modernist Jesuit theology and philosophy has done in the past hundred years. Look at what Thomism has done in its history. Read Leo XIII and Pius X. Viewing the two as “equals” is far more ridiculous.

And yet, they haven’t been suppressed yet, nor has any Pope in the past century resolved to do so.

The Jesuits I know have been anything but heterodox. Maybe unconventional, but in the realm of orthodoxy. Of course, unconventionality within orthodox bounds is kinda their hat. Now that might not attract some people. But I can assure you the vast majority of Jesuits are orthodox. What they will not be is conventional intellectually. But that is not the character of the Order, never has been.

I might also remind you that the rules of this forum state we are not to imply that any religious order or institute in good standing with Rome is anything but orthodox. Individuals, perhaps, but entire orders, no.

 

[Iveinfo]

I too find Jesuit spirituality and history very appealing, but I’ve met and read of people who had some issues with formation in the US.

Like Fr. Pacwa, Fr. Joseph Fessio is also a Jesuit and also very traditional. Probably best to try to get in touch with a few Jesuits like them and get their (name removed by moderator)ut. If you get on the phone and are blunt in leaving them messages “orthodox/traditional guy, interested in Jesuit vocation, need your (name removed by moderator)ut” I think they’ll make time.

Just keep your eyes wide open going through this process with the Jesuits. Also, as an aside, if it doesn’t work out with the Jesuits, be careful of some of the new Latin/Spanish founded orders trying to be the “new Jesuits.” Many have had serious issues:

underachindolea.blogspot.com/2009/02/jesuit-obedience-and-legionaries-of.html

 

[choliks]

@adawgj:

Some simple tidbits for your journey:

1. Attend a Jesuit Vocation Seminar. Ask your nearest Jesuit community. Go on retreats with the Jesuits. See if you really want to live your life as a Jesuit.
2. All religious orders and congregations have problematic members. No exemption. Ergo, there are good Jesuits and bad Jesuits. I think the good ones are more visible than the bad ones. It’s just sad that people judge an order based on a few bad apples. With that said…
3. Celebrating the EF/TLM does not equate to orthodoxy.
4. If ordained and want to learn from the FSSP and celebrate the EF, ask permission from your superior. If he says yes, obey. If he says no, obey. That is covered in Summorum Pontificum.
5. The bulk of learning how to celebrate the Sacrament of the Eucharist is during the last 4 years of your formation: Theology and Diaconate. You can probably ask your superiors to get additional training from the FSSP during this times. Again, #4.

I know a Jesuit who celebrates the EF of the Mass regularly. Check him out.

1. To be a Jesuit means BEING a Jesuit. You have to live and breath Jesuit, a companion of Jesus.
2. Become a faithful son of St. Ignatius of Loyola, you become a faithful son of the Church.

God bless every step of your journey.