Jesus and the Law

[SimpleGift]

Jesus says that he came not to change one letter of the law. Rather, he came to fulfill the law.

If this is the case, then why in the Catholic Church is there a turn from the law of the Old Testament? What happened to the observation of the festivals, for example, which should be for all time (Exodus)?

In 1 Timothy, Paul says that the law was not made for the righteous but for the lawless and insubordinate.

Yet, the Catholic Church does have “laws” - or rules. Cannot one be righteous, then, and also have laws to follow and question?

Thanks! I am just a confused 21-year-old.

 

[NotWorthy]

The Law was instituted to free us from our sinful ways. But it couldn’t do it. For instance, all the daily Sacrifices of the Law? They weren’t in the original Covenant. It wasn’t until the Israelites instituted “Calf-Gate” that God saw the Israelites were returning to the Egyptian gods. If you’ll notice, pretty much all the daily sacrifices instituted in the subsequent texts after Calf-Gate were Egyptian gods. It was God’s way of reminding Israel of what happens when they turn away from him - they return to sin.

Jesus freed us from sin with his once-for-all Sacrifice. Hence, the Old Law is fulfilled in Christ. And we are not saddled with all these laws of Deuteronomy.

Which is a good thing!

 

[Christy_Beth]

Can you imagine what it would be like if we still had to make all those offerings? It’s my understanding that the sacrifices had to be done at the temple. And some of it was animal sacrifices. How long would it take to get everybody through the line to make one? Especially with animals.

 

[NotWorthy]

Can you imagine what it would be like if we still had to make all those offerings? It’s my understanding that the sacrifices had to be done at the temple. And some of it was animal sacrifices. How long would it take to get everybody through the line to make one? Especially with animals.

PETA would have a cow, eh?

 

[Nita]

Welcome to the forum Simplegift.

Here’s some commentary on that passage from the Geo. Haydock Bible (a good resource at this website: haydock1859.tripod.com ):

Ver. 17. Not to destroy the law, &c. It is true, by Christ’s coming, a multitude of ceremonies and sacrifices, and circumcision, were to cease; but the moral precepts were to continue, and to be complied with, even with greater perfection. (Witham) — To fulfil. By accomplishing all the figures and prophecies, and perfecting all that was imperfect. (Challoner) — Our Saviour speaks in this manner, to prepare the minds of the Jews for his new instructions. For although they were not very solicitous about fulfilling the law, still they were extremely jealous of any change being made in the letter of the law; more particularly, if the proposed change exacted a more perfect morality. Our Lord fulfilled the law three several ways: 1. By his obedience to the prescribed rites; therefore he says, it behoveth us to fulfil all justice: and who shall accuse me of sin? 2. He observes the law, not only by his own observance of it, but likewise by enabling us to fulfil it. It was the wish of the law to make man just, but found itself too weak; Christ therefore came justifying man, and accomplished the will of the law. 3. He fulfilled the law, by reducing all the precepts of the old law to a more strict and powerful morality. (St. Chrysostom, hom. xvi.)

In regard to the animal sacrifices, most were to make reparation for and redeem us from our sin - which they could never do even tho they were offered over and over again. Jesus’ sacrifice made perfect reparation for the sins of all men thruout time. He fulfilled the requirement of the Law that called for reparation for sin. He became the sacrificial “lamb” offered for our sins. (cf John 1:29; 1 Cor 5:7)

The Old Covenant Law and Prophets had foretold the time of a New Covenant. This implies some changes/differences would then occur - or it wouldn’t be something “new”. The OT festivals commemorated events that occurred in the establishment or the Old Covenant. When the Old Covenant gives way to the New, it is the New Covenant events that become the festivals.

If you take all the OT sacrfices, examine their meaning and purpose, you will see that none of that meaning/purpose/need has passed away. Instead it is all fulfilled perfectly by Jesus — and His perfect fulfillment **continues **in and through the Sacrifice of the Mass and the 7 Sacraments.
Jesus did not abolish the Law and the Prophets in the New Covenant He established. Instead, you might say that He arranged to have new festivals and rites that carry on and express His fulfillment of the Law and the Prophets.

The moral law of the Ten Commandments continues to be part of the New Covenant because Jesus continued to include them as part of His teaching as to how we are to live. (cf Mt 19:18-19; Mt. 22:36-40)

Nita

 

[Nita]

In 1 Timothy, Paul says that the law was not made for the righteous but for the lawless and insubordinate.

Yet, the Catholic Church does have “laws” - or rules. Cannot one be righteous, then, and also have laws to follow and question?

You know, most times laws do not get enacted UNTIL someone starts doing the offensive act!! Only then does it become necessary to enact a law forbidding it - and decreeing a punishment against those who break it. It was because of those “lawless” one/s, that the law came into being - and they are the only ones who have to worry about the punishments which are part of that law.

Those who are “righteous” do what is good out of a desire to please God. They would do it whether or not there was a Law.

When Paul speaks of the law, he doesn’t mean that the Church should not have any rules or regulations. If you examine his letters, you’ll see he himself gives many orders/regulations that he expects to be heeded. You’ll find quite a few right in 1 Timothy.

Jesus also gives rules that He says we are to live by.

Nita

 

[fhansen]

Jesus says that he came not to change one letter of the law. Rather, he came to fulfill the law.

If this is the case, then why in the Catholic Church is there a turn from the law of the Old Testament? What happened to the observation of the festivals, for example, which should be for all time (Exodus)?

In 1 Timothy, Paul says that the law was not made for the righteous but for the lawless and insubordinate.

Yet, the Catholic Church does have “laws” - or rules. Cannot one be righteous, then, and also have laws to follow and question?

Thanks! I am just a confused 21-year-old.

God’s promise in Hebrew chaps. 8 & 10 quoted from Jeremiah is:

I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.

This is an interior process -of conversion. Until then none of us are perfected in righteousness.

 

[RobbyS]

Can you imagine what it would be like if we still had to make all those offerings? It’s my understanding that the sacrifices had to be done at the temple. And some of it was animal sacrifices. How long would it take to get everybody through the line to make one? Especially with animals.

Can you imagine the smell of the Temple with all those blood sacrifices? The whole city mist have been like a slaughter house.

 

[steve53]

They had a seventy by seventy foot square bronze alter in front of the sanctuary, and many sacrifices could be made at the same time. And about twenty-five people could share a sacrifice. They probably had ten groups of twenty-five going at once non-stop for the Passover. They would only sacrifice late in the day for a couple of hours- probably using the day to line things up and get things organized.
The temple sacrificial alter was at the highest point of the city, so the winds maybe helped out with the smoke. They had special drains for the blood, which was channeled away down into some valley.
The priests made out like bandits. They got to keep the meat of the sacrificed animals, and the leather too.

 

[asd72]

salvationhistory.com/studies/courses/audio/feasts_of_faith

This goes through all the main festivals and explains how Jesus fulfilled them.

 

[bmonk]

Jesus says that he came not to change one letter of the law. Rather, he came to fulfill the law.

If this is the case, then why in the Catholic Church is there a turn from the law of the Old Testament? What happened to the observation of the festivals, for example, which should be for all time (Exodus)?

In 1 Timothy, Paul says that the law was not made for the righteous but for the lawless and insubordinate.

Yet, the Catholic Church does have “laws” - or rules. Cannot one be righteous, then, and also have laws to follow and question?

Thanks! I am just a confused 21-year-old.

We believe that Jesus did fulfill the law–particularly in his suffering death on the Cross, having been perfectly obedient to the Father.

Given that, and under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, we could see that some laws and ideals were still binding–such as the command to love, or the 10 commandments–while others were temporary and had served their purpose–as when Peter realized all foods were clean (Acts 10, esp. 10:15; Mark 7:1-23). The laws that we no longer observe include the specific sacrifices and festivals of the Jews, the dietary laws, and such things.

 

[jcrichton]

Jesus says that he came not to change one letter of the law. Rather, he came to fulfill the law.

If this is the case, then why in the Catholic Church is there a turn from the law of the Old Testament? What happened to the observation of the festivals, for example, which should be for all time (Exodus)?

In 1 Timothy, Paul says that the law was not made for the righteous but for the lawless and insubordinate.

Yet, the Catholic Church does have “laws” - or rules. Cannot one be righteous, then, and also have laws to follow and question?

Thanks! I am just a confused 21-year-old.

Hi!

…your confusion is understandable… why certain things yes and others no… why Church Doctrine and why do they differ so much from the Old Testament’s?

1 Timothy… St. Paul is making a statement about the Law that seem perplexing… here’s the reason why he makes such statement:

The Mosaic Law demands that everything be observed… since man is fragile (and stupid) we cannot fulfill the requirements of the Law so we fail and the Law points not to our perfection but to our failures… hence the lawless proof the Law righteous but they cannot themselves become righteous… (simple take: we sin and the Law tells us we sin).

Jesus, on the other hand, Gave His Life as Ransom for our sin… it is in Him that we are reconciled to God:

10 On the other hand, all those who depend on the works of the Law are under a curse, since scripture says: Accursed be he who does not make what is written in the book of the Law effective, by putting it into practice…

13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law by being cursed for our sake since scripture says: Anyone hanged is accursed…

19 Then what is the purpose of the Law? It was added to deal with crimes until the ‘progeny’ to whom the promise had been made should come; and it was promulgated through angels, by the agency of an intermediary.

21 Is the Law contrary, then, to God’s promises? Out of the question! If the Law that was given had been capable of giving life, then certainly saving justice would have come from the Law. 22 As it is, scripture makes no exception when it says that sin is master everywhere; so the promise can be given only by faith in Jesus Christ to those who have this faith. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the Law, locked up to wait for the faith which would eventually be revealed to us. 24 So the Law was serving as a slave to look after us, to lead us to Christ, so that we could be justified by faith…

29 And simply by being Christ’s, you are that progeny of Abraham, the heirs named in the promise. (Galatians 3:1-29–condensed due to site’s limits)

…since Christ has been Revealed, the mandates of the Mosaic Law are no longer a requirement for the Believer… does this mean that its a free-for-all new religion? No… Christ Himself founded the Church and He sent the other Paraclete, the Holy Spirit, to Teach and Guide the Church:

but you will receive the power of the Holy Spirit which will come on you, and then you will be my witnesses not only in Jerusalem but throughout Judaea and Samaria, and indeed to earth’s remotest end.’ (Acts 1:8)

39 The promise that was made is for you and your children, and for all those who are far away, for all those whom the Lord our God is calling to himself.’ 40 He spoke to them for a long time using many other arguments, and he urged them, ‘Save yourselves from this perverse generation.’ 41 They accepted what he said and were baptised. That very day about three thousand were added to their number. 42 These remained faithful to the teaching of the apostles, to the brotherhood, to the breaking of bread and to the prayers. 43 And everyone was filled with awe; the apostles worked many signs and miracles. 44 And all who shared the faith owned everything in common; 45 they sold their goods and possessions and distributed the proceeds among themselves according to what each one needed. 46 Each day, with one heart, they regularly went to the Temple but met in their houses for the breaking of bread; they shared their food gladly and generously; 47 they praised God and were looked up to by everyone. Day by day the Lord added to their community those destined to be saved. (Acts 2:39-47)

…so Christ’s Church begin to take shape… first the Eleven replace Judas Iscariot, then they gather together in constant prayer, some of Jesus’ other disciples gather with them… once Pentecost takes place (Holy Spirit’s Coming) the Twelve begin to preach the Gospel… at St. Peter’s urging people begin to understand about Jesus and the Church gains disciples by the hundreds… Doctrine begins as these who are received must be Taught the Gospel… since the Church emerges out of Judaism there are religious and cultural remnants in the Christian practice of Worshiping God in the New Covenant… eventually the Church gains the various tenents needed to both deepen the Faith of the Believers and refute the heresies the threaten against the Truth, these sprang almost immediately after Christ’s Ascension!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

They had a seventy by seventy foot square bronze alter in front of the sanctuary, and many sacrifices could be made at the same time. And about twenty-five people could share a sacrifice. They probably had ten groups of twenty-five going at once non-stop for the Passover. They would only sacrifice late in the day for a couple of hours- probably using the day to line things up and get things organized.
The temple sacrificial alter was at the highest point of the city, so the winds maybe helped out with the smoke. They had special drains for the blood, which was channeled away down into some valley.
The priests made out like bandits. They got to keep the meat of the sacrificed animals, and the leather too.

…don’t think it was such a great take… didn’t they have to share with the whole tribe of Levi (the priestly tribe) since they could not own land, animals and other customary currencies?

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[steve53]

Josephus reported that if everyone paid their tithe, the Priests would be wealthy.
And the priests probably took a cut of sacrificial animals, as well. No one could just bring their own.
As the Jewish revolt approached, people stopped tithing and the priests organized bands of thieves to steal from the businessmen.
The Second Temple high Priesthood could be thought of as a class of criminals, and the the running of the Second Temple as a shake-down racket.
The Roman historian Tacitus was hard on the Jews for that reason.

 

[TimothyH]

Owe no one anything, except to love one another; for he who loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law. (Romans 13:8)

Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law. (Romans 13:10)

For the whole law is fulfilled in one word, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” (Galatians 5:14)

If you really fulfil the royal law, according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well. (James 2:8)

-Tim-

 

[bmonk]

The priests made out like bandits. They got to keep the meat of the sacrificed animals, and the leather too.

…don’t think it was such a great take… didn’t they have to share with the whole tribe of Levi (the priestly tribe) since they could not own land, animals and other customary currencies?

Maran atha!

Angel

Also, the priests and Levites only got certain portions of the sacrifices. Some when to God (burned on the altar), some to the officiating priests and their Levite assistants, and some to the person offering the sacrifice for their sacrificial meal. Other sacrifices–the holocausts, or “wholly burned,” also called a “burnt offering”–were special, and considered a greater sacrifice, since God got all of it.