Jesus DID predict the protestants!!!

[papaltruth]

I know it’s very hard to accept this, but it is true. BTW, Protestants are the ones who think they are going straight to heaven, not the Catholics. Remember we believe in Purgatory also.

I don’t believe in purgatory. However I don’t believe that we go straight to heaven either. Once we die, we will sleep in Christ until His angels are sent out to gather his followers at the second coming. Various scriptures support the notion and it doesn’t contradict anything.

 

[papaltruth]

Papal, I believe the Jews WERE the chosen people but not anymore…

Yes, now we are grafted into the spiritual Israel.

 

[papaltruth]

So…just curious when did Jesus say that God no longer recognizes the Jewish people as his Chosen People??? Where in the world do you get that statement from?

God never came out and said that. However in Romans 11 speaks of the Jews and Gentiles being grafted into one tree. Since we are not physically Israelites, we become Israelites by the means of Christ.

 

[bluestarsneyes]

Grafted in…you do know that there were Non Jewish people that were following the Jewish Religion in the time of Moses and before correct? Gentiles have always had a place in the Jewish faith otherwise they wouldn’t have built a temple that made a place for them to worship as well.

Now…that being said…you say all non-jews were grafted in but WHERE in that statement that you just said does grafted mean to replace?

the statement said Jews were no longer God’s choosen people…I think that statement is FALSE!

So then the question I guess is that what is a Jew then… Do Catholics now consider themselves the TRUE JEWS? I’m just wondering because in other threads that’s kind of the gist I get…because I find that quite interesting to say the least.

 

[papaltruth]

So then the question I guess is that what is a Jew then… Do Catholics now consider themselves the TRUE JEWS? I’m just wondering because in other threads that’s kind of the gist I get…because I find that quite interesting to say the least.

Based on the Unam Sanctam (We believe in her [Catholic church] firmly and we confess with simplicity that outside of her there is neither salvation nor the remission of sins), they may feel that way. However I do not speak for them.

 

[bluestarsneyes]

Seriously…I’m asking this question quite simply is it a tenant of the Catholic Faith that outside of the Catholic Church and it’s teachings there is NO Salvation or NO Remission of sins…seriously the Catholic Church believes this still…period?

I mean I’m not asking if all Catholics buy into this or not…I’m asking because I’ve been told differently…but I want to know the facts…is this the position of the Church.

 

[mangy_dog]

The Jews are Gods chosen people. How many times were they destroyed or scattered leaving just a remnant? Many!

Why do people fail to remember that the Protestant denominations were part of the same church at one time.

Maybe the Catholic church has stood for so long because it allied itself with governments bent on conquering the world, thus killing off those opposed to the Catholic church. The Catholic church has been a rock from that perspective. The Church allied itself with the Roman empire about 313 ad and up until its collapse shortly after 600 ad. Then it resurged again to become part of the Holy Roman empire from 800 ad to 1806 ad. They it reasserted itself to try to form alliances with Napoleon, Hitler, and various other dictators. Maybe this is why it’s survived.

Whether or not your “historicity” is accurate or fair - it does not invalidate my previous thread. Furthermore, up until the time of the great schism 1054 (give or take a couple of years) there were no “protesters” to the one, true faith. You move on to “greener pastures” and look back on the church with an accusing finger - consider that in the not so distant future you and all protestants will return to the one, true Catholic Church.
And don’t dwell on the murky allegations of the past…the gates of hell will not prevail against the catholic church but may prevail against your denomination. At that moment you may find yourself coming home.

 

[paarsurrey]

Most of them have collapsed and they keep collapsing everyday. But also everyday new Protestant churches are being established. My guess is that no matter how many protestant churches there are they will always collapse.

Hi

I think to wish churches,synagogue, temples, mosques etc get collapsed/destroyed is not Catholic, and against free will. Please win them over with arguments and love, that would be more Catholic.

Thanks

 

[papaltruth]

Whether or not your “historicity” is accurate or fair - it does not invalidate my previous thread. Furthermore, up until the time of the great schism 1054 (give or take a couple of years) there were no “protesters” to the one, true faith. You move on to “greener pastures” and look back on the church with an accusing finger - consider that in the not so distant future you and all protestants will return to the one, true Catholic Church.
And don’t dwell on the murky allegations of the past…the gates of hell will not prevail against the catholic church but may prevail against your denomination. At that moment you may find yourself coming home.

Don’t say the one true faith. Just as God seen the persecution of his people Israel in Egypt thus commanding Moses to leave Egypt. He also saw the persecution of Christians by the Roman Catholic church thus commanding Luther to leave the Catholic church. It was a monarchy bent on world domination via first the Roman Empire, then the Holy Roman empire. It could have been the Holy Spirit guiding Luther. I suppose this is why it’s faith.

The gates of hell will not prevail against the Catholic church? Try reading the book of Revelations. Look at the ecumenical movement being pushed forth by the Catholic church, which is interfaithism which is the work of Satan.

 

[mangy_dog]

Don’t say the one true faith. Just as God seen the persecution of his people Israel in Egypt thus commanding Moses to leave Egypt. He also saw the persecution of Christians by the Roman Catholic church thus commanding Luther to leave the Catholic church. It was a monarchy bent on world domination via first the Roman Empire, then the Holy Roman empire. It could have been the Holy Spirit guiding Luther. I suppose this is why it’s faith.

The gates of hell will not prevail against the Catholic church? Try reading the book of Revelations. Look at the ecumenical movement being pushed forth by the Catholic church, which is interfaithism which is the work of Satan.

All your rantings will not change what you will someday come to know as the truth - or more accurately, someday you will return to the truth which you so vehemently obscure with protestantism. Go on, it won’t change a thing…at least not in the one, true faith (catholic).
Oh and by the way, I am no advocate of ecumenism at the expense of compromise or “watering down” the true catholic faith and tradition…and neither will Pope Benedict XVI the true successor of Peter, first pope of the One, True Catholic Faith.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

 

[stmaria]

Seriously…I’m asking this question quite simply is it a tenant of the Catholic Faith that outside of the Catholic Church and it’s teachings there is NO Salvation or NO Remission of sins…seriously the Catholic Church believes this still…period?

I mean I’m not asking if all Catholics buy into this or not…I’m asking because I’ve been told differently…but I want to know the facts…**is this the position **of the Church.

Yes it is and will always be. It is an infallible dogma. There is no salvation outside of the Church except for those who are innocently ignorant of the Church.

Lumen Gentium Vatican II Council 1964
vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html

1. This Sacred Council wishes to turn its attention firstly to the Catholic faithful. Basing itself upon Sacred Scripture and Tradition, it teaches that the Church, now sojourning on earth as an exile, is necessary for salvation. Christ, present to us in His Body, which is the Church, is the one Mediator and the unique way of salvation. In explicit terms He Himself affirmed the necessity of faith and baptism(124) and thereby affirmed also the necessity of the Church, for through baptism as through a door men enter the Church.** Whosoever, therefore, knowing that the Catholic Church was made necessary by Christ, would refuse to enter or to remain in it, could not be saved.**"

Pius IX’s encyclical, Quanto Conficiamur Moerore
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9quanto.htm

1. Here, too, our beloved sons and venerable brothers, it is again necessary to mention and censure a very grave error entrapping some Catholics who believe that it is possible to arrive at eternal salvation although living in error and alienated from the true faith and Catholic unity. Such belief is certainly opposed to Catholic teaching. There are, of course, those who are struggling with **invincible ignorance **about our most holy religion. Sincerely observing the natural law and its precepts inscribed by God on all hearts and ready to obey God, they live honest lives and are able to attain eternal life by the efficacious virtue of divine light and grace. Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments.
2. Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church."

No need for you to worry. At this time you are innocently ignorant of the Catholic faith. But if you continue to stay on this site and learn more and more about the Catholic Church you will surely come to know, like so many before you, the truth and then, should you refuse to enter the Church you can not be saved. You will no longer be innocently ignorant. To refuse His Church is to refuse Him.

 

[mangy_dog]

You know these threads that are posted by Catholics that 'THINK" the Catholic Church is the only Church is really starting to annoy me. You know when I was Catholic I couldnt understand why so many people didnt like the Catholic Church, but now Im learning why. Catholics think they are the only ones assured of Heaven and thats just not true, No one is assured of Heaven until you hear Christ say Well done good and faithful servent. We all strive to serve Christ and love Him just as much as the Catholics do, although they dont think that. Im starting to think the Catholic Church thinks its inferior to any other Church, and that just drives people away.

Those veres the OP posted were not about protestants, thats just their intepretaion of it. I believe it means that any man who doesnt build his foundation on Christ will fall when the storm comes.

Two very big items on your thread: 1. …“you know, when I was a catholic…” Your first mistake, thinking that the grass is greener outside of the one, true faith (and church) that Christ intended to exist after His ascension into heaven and of which He left Peter as its first pope - 263 popes later to Pope Benedict XVI.
…don’t you miss the Eucharist?

1. Catholics think that they are the only ones assured of heaven…
   This is a protestant assumption, not a catholic one. You hear it everywhere and everytime…“I’m saved” and " if I die right now, I’m going straight to heaven". Catholics have never assumed this position.

The rest of your thread,…well it’s useless to comment on.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

 

[2ndGen]

Sorry but these verses implicate people and the foundations they stand upon whether that be Christ, or something else, not churches.

SE

house=Church
rock=Peter

Jesus called The Temple (The Church) His Father’s house.
Jesus called Simon, “rock” (Peter).

Jesus never called Himself a or the rock (Peter).
He called Peter “rock”.

This verse is talking about the Protestant revolt.

No matter how we slice it.

Only the house (Church) built upon the foundation of The Apostles/Peter (EPH 2/MATT 16) stood after the floods (swarms of Protestant attacks) came.

The Catholic Church has only been attacked by one group…fallen away Christians. Muslims never went into Rome and killed 8,000 innocent women and children in their bloodlust to overtake The Church. Only Christians did.

 

[2ndGen]

Another statement based on opinion not fact…Jesus did not say…Peter Feed My Sheep…and make sure you have Popes after you to lead the church and make sure that you teach that there is only one true church!!!

John 21:
17He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

HE WAS AND IS JEWISH!!! GOD CREATED THE JEWISH PEOPLE!!! Anyone that is NOT a Jew can be a follower now of God…but if you think on the Cross Jesus died to create a NEW CATHOLIC religion you are mad and there is nothing to base that on!

Heb. 10:9 The will of God is, that all men be saved. The word “all” means “universal”. Catholic is a Greek derivative of the word universal (katolicos). The Catholic Church is The Universal Church…Jesus came for “all” men…universally.

I’m sorry salvation is not found in the Catholic Church alone

The belief that the Catholic Church believes that salvation comes through the Catholic Church alone is Protestant Doctrine (teaching). Here is what Catholicism teaches on salvation outside of The Church.

catholic.com/library/Salvation_Outside_the_Church.asp

 

[2ndGen]

I don’t believe in purgatory. However I don’t believe that we go straight to heaven either. Once we die, we will sleep in Christ until His angels are sent out to gather his followers at the second coming. Various scriptures support the notion and it doesn’t contradict anything.

Ok, riddle me this…

When Moses and Elijah were seen with Jesus in His Transfiguration, if they weren’t in heaven and they were’nt in Purgatory and they weren’t “dead in Christ”, where were they?

And…what about all dead The Saints that were raised when Jesus died in Mattew 27? If they didn’t go straight to heaven after they were raised from the dead and they weren’t sleeping in Christ anymore, where did they go?

 

[2ndGen]

Seriously…I’m asking this question quite simply is it a tenant of the Catholic Faith that outside of the Catholic Church and it’s teachings there is NO Salvation or NO Remission of sins…seriously the Catholic Church believes this still…period?

I mean I’m not asking if all Catholics buy into this or not…I’m asking because I’ve been told differently…but I want to know the facts…is this the position of the Church.

catholic.com/library/Salvation_Outside_the_Church.asp

 

[2ndGen]

Hi

I think to wish churches,synagogue, temples, mosques etc get collapsed/destroyed is not Catholic, and against free will. Please win them over with arguments and love, that would be more Catholic.

Thanks

Only God can change their hearts, not man, not Scripture, not any Church. Only God.

 

[2ndGen]

All your rantings will not change what you will someday come to know as the truth - or more accurately, someday you will return to the truth which you so vehemently obscure with protestantism. Go on, it won’t change a thing…at least not in the one, true faith (catholic).
Oh and by the way, I am no advocate of ecumenism at the expense of compromise or “watering down” the true catholic faith and tradition…and neither will Pope Benedict XVI the true successor of Peter, first pope of the One, True Catholic Faith.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

Know what’s funny?

Everybody will believe in Mary when they meet her in Heaven.

Then, they’ll remember which Church loved and believed in her first.

Then it’ll hit them like a V-8 commercial.

There are going to be more conversions at that moment than any Pope could’ve ever have hoped for! LOL!

 

[bluestarsneyes]

No need for you to worry. At this time you are innocently ignorant of the Catholic faith. But if you continue to stay on this site and learn more and more about the Catholic Church you will surely come to know, like so many before you, the truth and then, should you refuse to enter the Church you can not be saved. You will no longer be innocently ignorant. To refuse His Church is to refuse Him.

I didn’t consider myself ignorant of the Catholic Faith…attended a Catholic Church for three years…am a Theological Student…

I do not reject the Catholic Church I recognize her as a denominatin within Christianity. I can’t however sign up on the dotted line so to speak to call myself strictly a Catholic Christian…but rather a Christian at this point because this is appauling to me!

I was listening to the Catholic Channel…and a Priest was asked this question and his name escapes me now…but he said that the church had backed away from this teaching that salvation outside the church was not possible. That salvation could be found outside the church but was possible, but this teaching was really meant to say the church does hold the true teachings of Christianity, therefore the true way TO salvation…not that it IS the way to salvation.

Sorry I am not worried…I’m confident in my salvation with Jesus…whether I some think I go to Heaven straight away or purgatory first…either way isn’t something I focus on because as long as I have salvation through Christ as he described how to get it…then I’m cool…and I don’t remember Christ teaching us to live our lives focused on what happens after death. It’s a reward and it’s eternal life WITH GOD…not separated from him…and therefore no matter what it’s wrapped in…it’s cool by me.

However I am really taken aback because it appears that even though some Catholics may not buy into this belief it is a tenant of the faith!!!
That assumption no matter how you look at it in my book is NOTHING like the teachings of Jesus…salvation is in Christ alone…no one comes to the Father except by him.

I do value the teachings of the Catholic Church and Traditions…but to sign on the dotted line when it makes a statement that salvation outside of the church is no possible is so beyond my understanding…I"m going to research more because I just am not sure your spin on that belief was the intention behind it.

I mean how can Catholics really believe that…I’ve never met a Catholic that thought that…I’m just stunned.

 

[episcogirl]

Thanks for that!