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Peter_J
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In that case you should study the councils of Ephesus and Chalcedon.
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Even_So
Guest
Why commission people to teach? This is a serious question? The same reason not everyone can pick up any text book, specially math, and master it. And I am far from a master so don’t read into that.
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Even_So
Guest
Feel free to throw 1 Timothy 2:5 at me too.
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Even_So
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What is the difference between a Catholic Bishop and Martin Luther? Both were well versed.
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Even_So
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As I said, don’t accept anyone without fact checking. For that we go to…
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Even_So
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Sorry, wrong Timothy. Should have been 2. But that one is good!
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Even_So
Guest
Brother, all I am saying is it is so easy to see CHRIST as a person, as you prolly unwittingly did by saying our faith is in a person. We all need to see Him as LORD and Savior, not that you are wrong. Praise you, JESUS! You alone are worthy! We are not. We are persons. Amen? Even so, come LORD JESUS!
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Peter_J
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However, I think I should stress that the Lord did not *start *to be a person when he became man. He was always the Second Person of the Trinity – and, for that matter, the Father was always the First Person of the Trinity, and the Holy Spirit was always the Third Person of the Trinity.
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clem456
Guest
That’s great. It should be easy to see Christ as a person!.
God identifies himself in scripture with a personal pronoun: “I Am”
God is a person. As God is a person, he is knowable in a personal sense. We can be in relationship with him. Protestants like to rightly say “We need a personal relationship with Jesus”. Great. What is sometimes left out is the communitarian aspect of relationship.
Just as God desires relationship with him, so he desires us to be in relationship with one another. Because we are all persons, we can do that as a body, with Christ as our head. Catholics express community as “Communion of Saints” and “Church”.
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CatholicKnight3
Guest
I will reiterate that IF the Church was NOT given authority, then we would ALL still be subjected to the Mosaic Law.
Jesus is clear in Matthew 23:1
Acts 15 establishes what the AUTHORITY OF THE CHURCH is and how it is the HOLY SPIRIT that guides THE CHURCH. The POWER of the CHURCH is also shown just with the SHADOW OF PETER.
How is that the we are not subjected to the Mosaic Law if we are only subject to scripture and NOT THE CHURCH?
What, the AUTHORITY OF THE CHURCH stopped with the death of the disciples? Really?
Huh…
Then by what AUTHORITY was the Bible put together? If it was so imperative that OUR ENTIRE SALVATION was totally and completely dependent on the Bible then I am wondering why there was no emphasis on teaching ALL followers to read. I mean wouldn’t that be rather important. In fact, most (at least 90%) of the early Christians did not read. Even if they did, they did not have nice pocket Bibles to refer to.
Nowhere in the scripture itself is there this great need or push to have all of the converts learn to read. The Bible was not separated out into chapter and verse until medieval times which was at least 1000 years later. The Bible as we know it today (yes 73 books) was not put together until the latter half of the 4th century. Again, by the AUTHORITY OF THE CHURCH which is referred to as the “whore of babylon” by many.
The KJV was not written until the 1600s. Many claim and teach that the KJV is the only TRUE version. Sometimes I cannot believe the audacity of some. The Holy Spirit did not give us the TRUE VERSION of the written word 1600 years later?
What did the early Christians rely on then? Well, Paul in scripture tells us, does he not? Holding fast to the traditions passed down. The ORAL traditions, since there was not New Testament as we know it today.
I just do not understand where certain people get the nerve. I really do not.
Jesus is clear in Matthew 23:1
23 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 2 “The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.
Authority was indeed recognized by the Lord given to the pharisees. Now, if that authority was NOT given to THE CHURCH then THE CHURCH would not have had the AUTHORITY to do this…Acts 15 establishes what the AUTHORITY OF THE CHURCH is and how it is the HOLY SPIRIT that guides THE CHURCH. The POWER of the CHURCH is also shown just with the SHADOW OF PETER.
How is that the we are not subjected to the Mosaic Law if we are only subject to scripture and NOT THE CHURCH?
What, the AUTHORITY OF THE CHURCH stopped with the death of the disciples? Really?
Huh…
Then by what AUTHORITY was the Bible put together? If it was so imperative that OUR ENTIRE SALVATION was totally and completely dependent on the Bible then I am wondering why there was no emphasis on teaching ALL followers to read. I mean wouldn’t that be rather important. In fact, most (at least 90%) of the early Christians did not read. Even if they did, they did not have nice pocket Bibles to refer to.
Nowhere in the scripture itself is there this great need or push to have all of the converts learn to read. The Bible was not separated out into chapter and verse until medieval times which was at least 1000 years later. The Bible as we know it today (yes 73 books) was not put together until the latter half of the 4th century. Again, by the AUTHORITY OF THE CHURCH which is referred to as the “whore of babylon” by many.
The KJV was not written until the 1600s. Many claim and teach that the KJV is the only TRUE version. Sometimes I cannot believe the audacity of some. The Holy Spirit did not give us the TRUE VERSION of the written word 1600 years later?
What did the early Christians rely on then? Well, Paul in scripture tells us, does he not? Holding fast to the traditions passed down. The ORAL traditions, since there was not New Testament as we know it today.
I just do not understand where certain people get the nerve. I really do not.
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zz912
Guest
The collection of bishops have been given authority, handed down from the Apostles, to declare such things.
Martin Luther, a single priest, was never given such authority.
The level of education is not the determining factor of who has authority to speak in God’s name.
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zz912
Guest
…the Church, just as Jesus and Paul taught.
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zz912
Guest
You are misunderstanding the term “person”. God is three persons in one Godhead. Father, Son and Holy Spirit are each a person.
You are correct that Jesus is King, Lord and Savior, and far too often Christians of all stripes forget one or all of those offices/titles He holds. Far too many view Jesus as just their good buddy they hang around with, and forget He is the Creator of the Universe and King of Kings. They become disrespectful around Him.
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