Jesus didn't die on the cross?

  • Thread starter Thread starter FightingFat
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Having spikes driven through His hands and feet would not make a traveler to India.
Hi

Besides Jesus’ Tomb in Mohalla Khanyar, Sirinagar, Kashmir, India there is a sculpture of his wounded feet in stone that shows the marks of wounds of spikes driven through Jesus’ feet, so he made the travel. Kindly see BBC Documentary for this. Amazing

Thanks
 
OK, I’m still talking to Muslims! They believe Jesus survived crucifixtion and moved to India. This is the argument-
The point of crucifixion is to give the victim a slow and painful death by asphixation, (suffocation). Why did they not hang him, or simply execute him? But by beating him to near death and then to put him on the cross, seems somewhat an unnecessary ordeal.
This website
freeminds
Lays claim that if the arms were overhead, then asphixation would occur in minutes, however if a person is on a cross with outstretched arms then he is able to breathe for hours on end. So the site claims that jesus died on the cross from shock more than anything else.
The minimum time of death on the cross ranged between 24 and 28 hours, this was for people that were scourged, but in some cases it took several days to die on the cross. In such cases it became necessary to break the legs of the criminals so that death may be hastened and consumated. But Jesus was on the cross for a mere 3 hours according to the new testament. Jesus Christ who was in the prime of his youth (33 years) and enjoyed excellent health, could not be expected to have died within so short a time.
Another point relevant to this issue relates to the fixing of the date and time by Pilate for carrying out the Crucifixion. Even before he fixed the date and time we read of other things, which one should not be surprised to believe, might have played an important role regarding his final decision. First of all we know on the authority of the New Testament that Pilate’s wife was strongly averse to her husband passing judgement against Jesus because of the influence of a dream she had the night before Jesus’ trial. matthew 27 :19
She was so terrified by the effect of the dream, which led her to believe that Jesus was absolutely innocent, that she thought it imperative to disturb the court proceedings to convey the message of the dream to her husband
Pilate made a show of absolving himself of the responsibility of his condemnation of Jesus.
When Pilate saw that he was getting no where, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd. ‘I am innocent of this man’s blood,’ he said. ‘it is your responsibility!’ (Matt 27:15–17)
Pilate had also made another attempt to save Jesus. He gave the enraged crowds an option either to save Jesus’ life or that of a notorious criminal called Barabbas.
Matthew 27:15-17
This provides us with a significant clue to the state of Pilate’s mind at that time. He was quite obviously against the idea of sentencing Jesus. It was in this psychological state that he fixed Friday afternoon to be the day and time of the execution. What actually happened, leaves one to believe, was a clear indication that he did it on purpose because the Sabbath was not very far from Friday afternoon and he, as the custodian of law knew better than anyone else that before the Sabbath began by sunset, Jesus’ body would have to be taken down; and that is exactly what happened.
Also his death was only the impression of an observer who was neither a physician nor had he any opportunity to medically examine him. An onlooker, watching with such anxiety and concern lest death should overtake his beloved master, merely observed the dropping of the tired head with chin resting against the chest of Jesus.
Pilate himself was surprised when the incident of death was reported to him.Mark 15:44
He must have had a long experience of crucifixion during his tenure as Governor of Judea and could not have expressed his surprise unless he was convinced that it is unusual for death to overtake a crucified person, within the short period of only a few hours.
Yet he had to accept the plea to release the body under mysterious circumstances. That is why he is forever accused of conspiracy.
“Then came the soldiers and break the legs of the first and of the other which was crucified with him. But when they came to Jesus, and saw that he was dead already, they break not his legs. But one of the soldiers with a spear pierced his side, and forthwith came there out blood and water”.
(John 19: 3-234)
Hi

Your approach is very positive and you have drawn correct conclusions.

Thanks
 
The soldiers did not break the legs of Jesus for they took him for a dead man while actually he was in a state of swoon, or just to silence the angry Jews he was declared be a ‘dead’ man. But one of the soldiers incidentally “pierced his side and forthwith there came out blood and water”, which is a surer sign of life for blood and water do not come out of a dead man’s body.
If he was dead and his heart had stopped beating, such active bleeding as causing the blood to rush out or gush out would be impossible. At most coagulated blood and plasma could have passively seeped out. But that is not the picture which the New Testament presents, it says that blood and water rushed out. As far as the mention of water is concerned it should not be surprising for Jesus to have developed pleurisy during the extremely exacting and punishing hours of trial that he spent upon the cross. Also, the stress of the Crucifixion could have resulted in exudates from the pleura to collect likes bags of water, which is medically termed as wet pleurisy. This condition, which is otherwise dangerous and painful, seems to have turned into an advantage for Jesus because when his side was pierced the swollen pleura could easily have played the role of a cushion protecting the chest organs from being directly penetrated by the spear. Water mixed with blood rushed out because of an active heart.
Remember his side was pierced, so the wound wasn’t too deep, and it wasn’t at the heart as has been claimed.
There was no eyewitness to the time of the crucifixion, and statements made in the gospels were added at a later date and not in the original scripts!
in a state of unconsciousness the body functions perform slowly, so jesus could easily have survived the extra hour on the cross, which u have presumed.
Right, lets have some comments my firends!!!
Hi

I think your arguments are very correct and seem positive to me.

Thanks
 
thank you brother 🙂

My own ideas run like this. Ever read Luke 22:44?

“as Jesus was in agony, he prayed even more earnestly and great drops of blood formed like sweat and fell to the ground”

At this stage of the agony in the garden, Jesus has taken the weight of all the sins of every person who ever was and ever will be upon himself. Do you sin parrsurrey? Look around the room you’re in now and imagine it full of people you know if it is empty. Imagine bearing the weight of the sin of all those people, not just the sin for today, but for every day. Every day they have lived and every day they will live. Now imagine doing that for every person who will ever live and has ever lived. Jesus is sweating blood in the garden… Jesus suffered the punishment that we had to suffer, says Isaiah 53:5, so, Jesus was suffered for us, and the chastisement he bore restored us to health… Jesus suffering the on behalf of billions, you and me!.. no wonder he was in agony, sweating blood, exhausted, dying of love… so much, that “an angel from heaven appeared to give him strength” (Lk.22:43)…

I submit that you are right. Crucifixtion did not kill Jesus. By this point he would have died anyway from the weight of the sin he bore.
 
Hi

Besides Jesus’ Tomb in Mohalla Khanyar, Sirinagar, Kashmir, India there is a sculpture of his wounded feet in stone that shows the marks of wounds of spikes driven through Jesus’ feet, so he made the travel. Kindly see BBC Documentary for this. Amazing

Thanks
**Jesus founded His Church BEFORE His crucifixion. He summoned His apostles to, “…Go and preach the Gospel to all nations…”

It was the mission of the Church to travel the four corners of Earth to make His Name known. I do not believe Jesus preached and continued His ministry after His ascension whether in India or anywhere else. It was the mission of the Church.

As for the tomb that shows the stone sculpture…I believe that as much as that “other tomb” the Naked Archeologist" foisted on the Christian world.

That also begs the question: Jesus died in India?

Also, the earliest known introduction of Christianity to India was through the Jesuits. St. Aloysius Gonzaga was an early missionary there. **
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top