Jesus is the Messiah. But

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Why does this make Him God? I know Jesus- and only Jesus- fits the role of the Messiah, but why does being the Messiah make Him God? Couldn’t he be like Moses who worked miracles and things of the sort? Even the Resurrection (sp., I apologize) - couldn’t have God just raised Him up? Why does this prove His Divinity?

I know, this is a stupid set of questions from a Catholic such as myself. I feel as if I’m going through a Dark Night of the Souls or just doubting God in general 😦

Again, sorry.

Thanks in advance,
coolduude
 
coolduude said:
Why does this make Him God? I know Jesus- and only Jesus- fits the role of the Messiah, but why does being the Messiah make Him God? Couldn’t he be like Moses who worked miracles and things of the sort? Even the Resurrection (sp., I apologize) - couldn’t have God just raised Him up? Why does this prove His Divinity?

I know, this is a stupid set of questions from a Catholic such as myself. I feel as if I’m going through a Dark Night of the Souls or just doubting God in general 😦

Again, sorry.

Thanks in advance,
coolduude
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  1. perfect sacrifice issue
  2. Moses was not perfect, never saw the promised land
  3. God was risen, Jesus rose after he died. 3 days later.
  4. The divinity of Jesus can be “proved” in many ways in the eyes of a believer. One of the best ways is his being foretold in scripture (even if that is debatable)
 
coolduude said:
Why does this make Him God? I know Jesus- and only Jesus- fits the role of the Messiah, but why does being the Messiah make Him God? Couldn’t he be like Moses who worked miracles and things of the sort? Even the Resurrection (sp., I apologize) - couldn’t have God just raised Him up? Why does this prove His Divinity? I know, this is a stupid set of questions from a Catholic such as myself. I feel as if I’m going through a Dark Night of the Souls or just doubting God in general 😦

Again, sorry.

Thanks in advance,
coolduude
Click to expand...
Hey! I too have doubts sometimes as well.:o But anyway Jesus was foretold through the old testament. Even the Angel Gabriel when he told our Mother Mary that she was to have a son, it was not a regular son but the Son of the Most High. Who just like Gabriel said would have a kingdom of no end. I mean, who else but GOD can do that? And maybe he had to be God as well to pay for our salvation because no earthy sacrifice would be enough. It had to have been one that was different than anything else and only God could do that.

Well, that’s all I can think of for now. Sorry, if I didn’t answer it correctly.
 
coolduude said:
Why does this make Him God? I know Jesus- and only Jesus- fits the role of the Messiah, but why does being the Messiah make Him God? Couldn’t he be like Moses who worked miracles and things of the sort? Even the Resurrection (sp., I apologize) - couldn’t have God just raised Him up? Why does this prove His Divinity?

I know, this is a stupid set of questions from a Catholic such as myself. I feel as if I’m going through a Dark Night of the Souls or just doubting God in general 😦

Again, sorry.

Thanks in advance,
coolduude
Click to expand...
cooldude,
It seems you are struggling with the meaning of the Trinity.
The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.

Jn.1:1-3 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. he was with God in the beginning. through him all things were made; and without him nothing was made that has been made.”
Col.1:15 Jesus is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation; for by him all things were created.

Jesus Christ is the same yestersay and today and forever. Heb.13:8

If you have a study bible, please look these passages up for study.
Pray for the Lords help each time you do this. 🙂

God bless,
bluelake
 
Cooldude,

If you are led to this by your own ideas, that is one thing. If however, you are being pressured by Islam, you can PM me anytime and I will destroy all of their arguments one by one.
 
No, it’s not the Muslims. Although I would be intrested in seeing your arguments, SJ.

Anyway, I’ve really been putting a lot of thought into this. Here’s my logic:
Jesus claimed he was/is God
Jesus has the miracles to back it up.
And, as far as I know, Jesus was sane when he made this claims.

Therefore, you can’t call him crazy when he claimed to be God, because he was sane. He must have been telling the truth. Right? Maybe?

How else can we prove Jesus is God and not a great miracle worker? Thoughts?
 
coolduude said:
Why does this make Him God? I know Jesus- and only Jesus- fits the role of the Messiah, but why does being the Messiah make Him God? Couldn’t he be like Moses who worked miracles and things of the sort? Even the Resurrection (sp., I apologize) - couldn’t have God just raised Him up? Why does this prove His Divinity?

I know, this is a stupid set of questions from a Catholic such as myself. I feel as if I’m going through a Dark Night of the Souls or just doubting God in general 😦

Again, sorry.

Thanks in advance,
coolduude
Click to expand...
Being Messiah did not “lock down” the God debate. The Jews were NOT expecting their Messiah to be God in the Flesh.

“Messiah” simply means “annointed one”.

One of the reason that God intended Himself to be the Messiah was because Israel was still under the Covenant curses outlined in Deuteronomy - chapter 28 or so - because of her infidelity. The only way that God could free Israel from this last Covenant curse is if God could dissolve the Covenant. The only way to dissolve a covenant between two people is if one of them dies; remember the words in the Marriage Covenant? “Til Death do us part”.

So by giving us His only Son, Who is also fully God, to die on the Cross, God freed Israel from the Covenant Curse and allowed the Jews to follow the Apostles into the new Covenant (as well as their fellow Gentiles).
 
NotWorthy said:
Being Messiah did not “lock down” the God debate. The Jews were NOT expecting their Messiah to be God in the Flesh.

“Messiah” simply means “annointed one”.
Click to expand...
Exactly.

Understanding Jesus as God is something the Church wrestled with for centuries, and it took the ecumenical councils of the 4th and 5th centuries to iron this out.
 
NotWorthy said:
Being Messiah did not “lock down” the God debate. The Jews were NOT expecting their Messiah to be God in the Flesh.

“Messiah” simply means “annointed one”.

One of the reason that God intended Himself to be the Messiah was because Israel was still under the Covenant curses outlined in Deuteronomy - chapter 28 or so - because of her infidelity. The only way that God could free Israel from this last Covenant curse is if God could dissolve the Covenant. The only way to dissolve a covenant between two people is if one of them dies; remember the words in the Marriage Covenant? “Til Death do us part”.

So by giving us His only Son, Who is also fully God, to die on the Cross, God freed Israel from the Covenant Curse and allowed the Jews to follow the Apostles into the new Covenant (as well as their fellow Gentiles).
Click to expand...
Very interesting! This sure explains a lot.
 
NotWorthy said:
Being Messiah did not “lock down” the God debate. The Jews were NOT expecting their Messiah to be God in the Flesh.

“Messiah” simply means “annointed one”.

One of the reason that God intended Himself to be the Messiah was because Israel was still under the Covenant curses outlined in Deuteronomy - chapter 28 or so - because of her infidelity. The only way that God could free Israel from this last Covenant curse is if God could dissolve the Covenant. The only way to dissolve a covenant between two people is if one of them dies; remember the words in the Marriage Covenant? “Til Death do us part”.

So by giving us His only Son, Who is also fully God, to die on the Cross, God freed Israel from the Covenant Curse and allowed the Jews to follow the Apostles into the new Covenant (as well as their fellow Gentiles).
Click to expand...
Good response! 😃
This brings me back to a theology course I took on the Scriputres. It did mention covenants so this helps (and makes a lot of sense).

But can you (or anyone) explain more about the covenant system? Why did one of the parties have to die? Was it custom?
Please explain this whole system 🙂

thank you! 👍
 
coolduude said:
Anyone? Any responses?
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The understanding of covenant is ESSENTIAL, I believe in understanding the Jesus’s Incarnation. It is more than we could get into in a post. I can give you several excellent books to read.

1)The first is “A Father Who Keeps His Promises” by Scott Hahn. Mr. Hahn starts with Genesis and explains all of the OT Covenants and how they come to fruition in Christ. That book would be an excellent help for you. Basically, humanity needed a perfect Sacrifice to atone for the curses of the OT covenants. Only God could do that.
  1. “Swear to God” by Scott Hahn, again is all about the OT covenants foreshadowing Christ’s New Covenant, and how they relate to the Sacraments.
I strongly suggest you read the first one I mentioned. Scott Hahn has written extensively on the subject. Check out his free website: www.salvationhistory.com

God Bless and you are in my prayers,
Pakesh
 
Pakesh said:
The understanding of covenant is ESSENTIAL, I believe in understanding the Jesus’s Incarnation. It is more than we could get into in a post. I can give you several excellent books to read.

1)The first is “A Father Who Keeps His Promises” by Scott Hahn. Mr. Hahn starts with Genesis and explains all of the OT Covenants and how they come to fruition in Christ. That book would be an excellent help for you. Basically, humanity needed a perfect Sacrifice to atone for the curses of the OT covenants. Only God could do that.
  1. “Swear to God” by Scott Hahn, again is all about the OT covenants foreshadowing Christ’s New Covenant, and how they relate to the Sacraments.
I strongly suggest you read the first one I mentioned. Scott Hahn has written extensively on the subject. Check out his free website: www.salvationhistory.com

God Bless and you are in my prayers,
Pakesh
Click to expand...
I haven’t read “Swear to God” yet, but I definitely second your first suggestion.

EVERYONE should read the Old Testament and NOBODY should read the Old Testament without reading “A Father Who Keeps His Promises” as a companion reader!
 
That is because many qualities of the Son are the qualities of the Father. Jesus is called Lord, and the Father is called Lord. Jesus is called savior, and the Father is called savior. The Father doesn’t change and the Son doesn’t change. The list could go on and on.
 
coolduude said:
Good response! 😃
This brings me back to a theology course I took on the Scriputres. It did mention covenants so this helps (and makes a lot of sense).

But can you (or anyone) explain more about the covenant system? Why did one of the parties have to die? Was it custom?
Please explain this whole system 🙂

thank you! 👍
Click to expand...
No the covenant system did not require death.
 
diggerdomer said:
No the covenant system did not require death.
Click to expand...
… but death is one of the things that dissolved a covenant. For example, what are the words of the marriage covenant?

“… do you promise to love, honor, and cherish… til death do you part?”.
 
diggerdomer said:
No the covenant system did not require death.
Click to expand...
Well, what do you mean by “required death?” Jesus had to bear the Curses and Penalties of the Old Covenant because Israel was unfaithful to it. Remember, Moses set the choice to Israel between “Blessings and Curses, Life and Death.” Jesus had to die b/c of the Old Covenant.
 
Pakesh said:
Well, what do you mean by “required death?” Jesus had to bear the Curses and Penalties of the Old Covenant because Israel was unfaithful to it. Remember, Moses set the choice to Israel between “Blessings and Curses, Life and Death.” Jesus had to die b/c of the Old Covenant.
Click to expand...
[SIGN]BINGO![/SIGN]
If Jesus didn’t die, then Israel would have had to, for that was the last curse pending on the Mosaic Covenant.
 
coolduude said:
Good response! 😃

But can you (or anyone) explain more about the covenant system? Why did one of the parties have to die? Was it custom?
Please explain this whole system 🙂

:
Click to expand...
The Covenant is a Contract that cannot be broken without consequences

If they kept the Covenant, Israel would enjoy all the Covenant Blessings
However breaking the Covenant would cause the Curses to fall on Israel
To read about the Covenant God made with the Israelites read Deut.Ch.26 V 16-19
To learn about the Covenant Blessings and Curses read Deut. 28 🙂
 
coolduude said:
Anyway, I’ve really been putting a lot of thought into this. Here’s my logic:
Jesus claimed he was/is God
Jesus has the miracles to back it up.
And, as far as I know, Jesus was sane when he made this claims.

How else can we prove Jesus is God and not a great miracle worker? Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Hi Cooldude
Hebrews Ch.1 V6 states
And again when he brings the firstborn into the world he says 'And let all the angels of God adore him "
The whole Chapter is worth reading and meditating. 👍
 
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