- Status
Seems to me to be picking a bone where there is none. Even at the beginning he admits that Jesus is called friend or calls others friends, then just flippantly dismisses it, because it’s mentioned only once in Matthew and once in John, and once in Luke, and none in Paul’s letters.
Well guess what? ONCE is enough, and still, that is THREE times in the Gospels. What does that tell us?
That Jesus IS a Friend. Just as he is a Brother, and he is our Savour, and he is our Lord, and he is our God.
His beef is somehow with the “personal” relationship aspect, despite the correct dispositions that we approach him within that Personal relationship through prayer, the Sacraments, and especially the Eucharist.
I think it’s lame writing. He just wants to diss one aspect of what is really a multifacted, rich relationship with the Redeemer.
Don’t know about him, but Jesus, my Lord, IS my Friend, and I’ll keep him that way.
Well guess what? ONCE is enough, and still, that is THREE times in the Gospels. What does that tell us?
That Jesus IS a Friend. Just as he is a Brother, and he is our Savour, and he is our Lord, and he is our God.
His beef is somehow with the “personal” relationship aspect, despite the correct dispositions that we approach him within that Personal relationship through prayer, the Sacraments, and especially the Eucharist.
I think it’s lame writing. He just wants to diss one aspect of what is really a multifacted, rich relationship with the Redeemer.
Don’t know about him, but Jesus, my Lord, IS my Friend, and I’ll keep him that way.
Last edited:
P
pianistclare
Guest
Great response. This came up in another recent thread.
G
goout
Guest
I agree with you. Thought it was an article picking a fight where there is none.
He takes the exhortation to a personal relationship with Jesus and assumes the weakest motivations.
I really don’t get that mindset.
What is Christianity if not intensely personal? That’s the whole point. Without personal relationships there is no community (ecclesia, Church). Incarnation, the Word Made Flesh. Communion.
The essential personal relationship is of a person with God, and with the Church, through Christ, with Christ, and in Christ.
It’s the thing we are fighting for in the battle for religious freedom.
It’s what gave us St Paul.
This is the invitation of one who is kind to others and approachable, not a distant monolith. That translates pretty well as friend.
Last edited:
Right.porthos11:
I agree with you. Thought it was an article picking a fight where there is none.
He takes the exhortation to a personal relationship with Jesus and assumes the weakest motivations.
I really don’t get that mindset.
What is Christianity if not intensely personal? That’s the whole point. Without personal relationships there is no community (ecclesia, Church). Incarnation, the Word Made Flesh.
The essential personal relationship is of a person with God, and with the Church, through Christ, with Christ, and in Christ.
It’s the thing we are fighting for in the battle for religious freedom.
It’s what gave us St Paul.
He seems to forget that God condescended to become like us, precisely because of that personal relationship he wants of us. Precisely because he wanted us to draw close to him. All that stuff he draws from St. Paul are all true, and that should make us ever happier to think that all for these lofty things that God is, he has condescended—while shedding none of them—to be our Friend. That is something to rejoice over, not shirk from.
T
Thom18
Guest
Isn’t his point simply that Jesus is Lord first and “buddy” second?
I see nothing wrong with that.
po18guy
Well-known member
One man’s opinion is worth what one pays for it. A human friend will always come to us, but has no power to save us - only to accompany, as did Job’s friends. Jesus bids us come to Him, yet offers infinitely more than any purely human friend. At Bethany, although He knew where they lived, He waited outside the town and made both Martha and Mary come to Him. Even when He raised Lazarus from the dead, He did not enter the tomb, but called Lazarus forth from the tomb and then to Him.
There is a message for us in all of that.
There is a message for us in all of that.
Last edited:
And if that’s what the article said, sure.
That’s not what the article says. It’s a bone-picking exercise, trying to attack what is clearly an acceptable aspect of one’s relationship with Christ. We clearly can approach Christ as Friend, while always keeping in mind that he is also Lord and God. There is no separating those. And that is why the Incarnation is so important to Christians, because the God-Man is all of that. He is Lord and God, who is also Friend. That puts us in a great position in the created order.
For all these Scriptural examples of Jesus calling people out to him, I can never forget that before all these, God came to us first.
Last edited:
G
goout
Guest
You have inadvertently demonstrated the problem.
Casting this personal relationship as “buddy” is a caricature. It’s not exactly an honest representation of what is asked for in our relationship with Christ.
I know of no one who refers to their relationship with Christ in this casual manner.
Caricatures are not helpful.
It’s also a false dichotomy. A relationship with Christ is demanding, and at the same time can be friendly and full of kindness.
Last edited:
T
Thom18
Guest
But isn’t Jesus as “buddy” exactly what people like Joel Osteen preach about? (I haven’t actually listened to him at length or read his books, but I’m aware of his “prosperity gospel”)Thom18:
You have inadvertently demonstrated the problem.
Casting this personal relationship as “buddy” is a caricature. It’s not exactly an honest representation of what is asked for in our relationship with Christ.
I know of no one who refers to their relationship with Christ in this casual manner.
Caricatures are not helpful.
I’ve encountered many people like this on the internet, even some in person. They’re very casual about Jesus, talking about Him like a friend- which isn’t problematic in itself, but they don’t give Him due reverence as Lord.
“Jesus doesn’t mind that I don’t go to church on Sunday- he knows my heart” is one of the attitudes I’ve had the unpleasant experience of hearing.
Last edited:
G
goout
Guest
You can find many buts and what ifs.goout:
But isn’t Jesus as “buddy” exactly what people like Joel Osteen preach about? (I haven’t actually listened to him at length or read his books, but I’m aware of his “prosperity gospel”)Thom18:
You have inadvertently demonstrated the problem.
Casting this personal relationship as “buddy” is a caricature. It’s not exactly an honest representation of what is asked for in our relationship with Christ.
I know of no one who refers to their relationship with Christ in this casual manner.
Caricatures are not helpful.
I’ve encountered many people like this on the internet, even some in person. They’re very casual about Jesus, talking about Him like a friend- which isn’t problematic in itself, but they don’t give Him due reverence as Lord.
“Jesus doesn’t mind that I don’t go to church on Sunday- he knows my heart” is one of the attitudes I’ve had the unpleasant experience of hearing.
This article strikes me as fearful and a little scrupulous over something that is basic Christian stuff.
That is wrong, and I think you will get no argument from anyone here.goout:
But isn’t Jesus as “buddy” exactly what people like Joel Osteen preach about? (I haven’t actually listened to him at length or read his books, but I’m aware of his “prosperity gospel”)Thom18:
You have inadvertently demonstrated the problem.
Casting this personal relationship as “buddy” is a caricature. It’s not exactly an honest representation of what is asked for in our relationship with Christ.
I know of no one who refers to their relationship with Christ in this casual manner.
Caricatures are not helpful.
I’ve encountered many people like this on the internet, even some in person. They’re very casual about Jesus, talking about Him like a friend- which isn’t problematic in itself, but they don’t give Him due reverence as Lord.
“Jesus doesn’t mind that I don’t go to church on Sunday- he knows my heart” is one of the attitudes I’ve had the unpleasant experience of hearing.
But this author goes the other extreme. He would have us approach Christ as Lord only, despite the clear passages—which he cites—that Christ the Lord also wants to be our Friend.
If Christ has revealed himself as Lord, and he as revealed himself as Friend, then he doesn’t intend for us to dismiss either of those aspects in our relationship with him.
He published an article. That makes him fair game for criticism.
G
goout
Guest
G
Genesis315
Guest
Rather than simply ignoring our friendship with God/Jesus, I think the better approach would be to explain the nature and depths of Christian friendship and contrast them to the more superficial relationship that the term “buddy” might call to mind.
Last edited:
The problem is that his title and conclusion are disjointed from his argument. He rightly writes against the use of “buddy” but his framework is a lame attempt to disprove Christ’s relationship to us as Friend. As if buddy is the only equivalent we can draw from the word friend.
In his attempt to discourage the “Jesus is my buddy” attitude, he presented a rather bizarre method of arguing against Christ as Friend.
For the sheer fun of it, of course. And perhaps he may be alerted to this kind of review or feedback, but more importantly, so that those who drop by these forums, see the link and read the article don’t get misled by what’s clearly a faulty argument.
- Status