Jesus' place in the Trinity

  • Thread starter Thread starter fish90
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
F

fish90

Guest
I have always questioned why Jesus talked to God. Since Jesus is God, would not that make him talking to himself?

Also, is this understanding of the Trinity correct? God is God. Jesus is both God and human who was sent to earth to redeem us. The Holy Spirit descended upon the earth during Pentecost (I believe). The Holy Spirit exists to lead us to the truth which was revealed by Jesus and the truth is God. The Trinity is three persons in one God.

Please be respectful with our responses
 
At one point in the Doughy bible, Jesus says “The Father is Greater than I” - I think it was in Luke - I will check.

But my question is how does the fact that Jesus is quoted as saying the Father is greater than he, yet the Church later taught that there are three undivided beings in one God under the notion of the Trinity?
 
I can think of no better way to answer this than with Psalm 110: The LORD says to my lord: “Sit at my right hand, till I make your enemies your footstool.”

Jesus quotes this in Mt 22:41-46:

Now while the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them a question, saying, “What do you think of the Christ? Whose son is he?” They said to him, “The son of David.” He said to them, “How is it then that David, inspired by the Spirit, calls him Lord, saying, 'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand, till I put thy enemies under thy feet? If David thus calls him Lord, how is he his son?”
 
Ah yes, nothing like 2000 year old biblical loony bable to explain it to those heretics who dare question!!!😃
 
God eternally generates Cognizance of Himself. God knowing God eternally. This second Person is God’s Word. God 'generates Cognizance of Himself so the Cognizance of God is His Son and the Son of God reveals the Father because that is who He is from eternity. The Cognizance of God became man and revealed the Father.
 
Agripa said:
Ah yes, nothing like 2000 year old biblical loony bable to explain it to those heretics who dare question!!!😃
Click to expand...
Sorry. I wasn’t referring to your question there, but rather the OP.

To your question, I’d look at the original word, μειζων, the comparative form of μέγας.

The word means greater in stature, or stronger, or mightier. Jesus restricted the things that He could do (for example, He chose not to be deathless, but capable of dying), which does suggest that the Father is more powerful in some self-imposed regards.
 
I look at it like this, for what it’s worth:

God created everything, knows everything, is everywhere at all times, is eternal, and is simply *in *everything and *of *everything. God IS.

God exists in three “aspects”, roles or functions:

Father (Lord, Master): The creator; holds all things in existence by his will; lives in Heaven; eternal;

Christ (Son, Redeemer, Messiah): the part of God that became human and gave God an intimate relationship with humanity; born, died, resurrected; promised forgiveness of sins, among much else. The humanity of Christ is the key to understanding his role;

Holy Spirit: to use an analogy from popular culture, “the Force”; the God of strength and resilience, but also humility and grace; unites the church; converts people; guides the faithful; inspires. When they say in Mass, “The fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you…”
that’s the key: fellowship.

Jesus knew who his father was, and that the spirit was guiding him–after all, they were all part of the same “firm”. Jesus just knew that he had this special job to do here on earth, as a person.

Anyway, I realise that’s fairly standard, high-school stuff, and probably of little help.
 
Agripa said:
At one point in the Doughy bible, Jesus says “The Father is Greater than I” - I think it was in Luke - I will check.

But my question is how does the fact that Jesus is quoted as saying the Father is greater than he, yet the Church later taught that there are three undivided beings in one God under the notion of the Trinity?
Click to expand...
Jesus has 2 natures. Divine and human. Jesus is speaking about His humanity.
newadvent.org/summa/4020.htm
 
steve_b said:
Jesus has 2 natures. Divine and human. Jesus is speaking about His humanity.
newadvent.org/summa/4020.htm
Click to expand...
Quoting Augustine from the link provided:

*On the contrary, Our Lord says (John 14:28), “The Father is greater than I”; and Augustine says (De Trin. i, 7): “It is not without reason that the Scripture mentions both, that the Son is equal to the Father and the Father greater than the Son, for the first is said on account of the form of God, and the second on account of the form of a servant, without any confusion.” Now the less is subject to the greater. Therefore in the form of a servant Christ is subject to the Father. *

. . . and there you have it, yet another tortured, apologetic reasoning on the part of ancient men to answer such pesky contradictions in the Bible!! 👍
 
Agripa said:
Quoting Augustine from the link provided:

*On the contrary, Our Lord says (John 14:28), “The Father is greater than I”; and Augustine says (De Trin. i, 7): “It is not without reason that the Scripture mentions both, that the Son is equal to the Father and the Father greater than the Son, for the first is said on account of the form of God, and the second on account of the form of a servant, without any confusion.” Now the less is subject to the greater. Therefore in the form of a servant Christ is subject to the Father. *

. . . and there you have it, yet another tortured, apologetic reasoning on the part of ancient men to answer such pesky contradictions in the Bible!! 👍
Click to expand...
You’re cherry picking.

Augustine didn’t ignore, what you’re choosing to ignore, that is the 2 natures of Jesus, one divine, one human.

"As we are not to understand that Christ is a creature simply, but only in His human nature, whether this qualification be added or not, as stated above (Question 16, Article 8), so also we are to understand that Christ is subject to the Father not simply but in His human nature, even if this qualification be not added; and yet it is better to add this qualification in order to avoid the error of Arius, who held the Son to be less than the Father. "
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top