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Bill_Pick
Guest
When in the Bible how many times did Jesus talk in symbol and NOT explain what He was saying…
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planten
Guest
**I have read the bible (4 gospels). I enjoyed reading mathew and other chapters. It was all good and interesting, very useful for the considerate mind. But not all has to be taken literally, such as son of God and sons of God and begotten etc. It is very serious matter.When in the Bible how many times did Jesus talk in symbol and NOT explain what He was saying…
Jesus used to talk and teach in parables. He used symbolic language. Just imagine about the only sign that Jesus promised to show to the wicked generation. That was the sign of prophet Jonas. That was also symbolic.
Because Jesus never went into the belly of the fish. Similarly, he talked about a person who made a garden (vineyard). The person gave the garden in care of some workers and went away. Then Jesus gave the example that the owner sent his servants to collect the yield of the garden but the workers (tenants) beat up the workers… It is all there in the bible.
The garden is the life of the world. The tenants are the sinful people of the world. The servants were the prophets of God. They were beaten and denied.
Then the owner sent his son thinking that bad people will care for him and will deliver the goods. (That was Jesus). The tenants thought they should kill the son because he was the heir. They tried to do that.
Then Jesus asks: What would the owner of the Garden (the God Almighty) do next. He will come himself and will catch the bad tenants and beat them and put them in prison (hell).
It is a very good example of symbolic teaching. I am ready to explain it further, if any one is interested.**
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cathopologist
Guest
You cannot even explain anything about your religion let alone comprehend the teachings in the Bible. Thanks but no thanks.It is a very good example of symbolic teaching. I am ready to explain it further, if any one is interested.
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Bill_Pick
Guest
No,Thank but I do not listen to private interpretation its not condoned in the bible 2peter 1:20**I have read the bible (4 gospels). I enjoyed reading mathew and other chapters. It was all good and interesting, very useful for the considerate mind. But not all has to be taken literally, such as son of God and sons of God and begotten etc. It is very serious matter.
Jesus used to talk and teach in parables. He used symbolic language. Just imagine about the only sign that Jesus promised to show to the wicked generation. That was the sign of prophet Jonas. That was also symbolic.
Because Jesus never went into the belly of the fish. Similarly, he talked about a person who made a garden (vineyard). The person gave the garden in care of some workers and went away. Then Jesus gave the example that the owner sent his servants to collect the yield of the garden but the workers (tenants) beat up the workers… It is all there in the bible.
The garden is the life of the world. The tenants are the sinful people of the world. The servants were the prophets of God. They were beaten and denied.
Then the owner sent his son thinking that bad people will care for him and will deliver the goods. (That was Jesus). The tenants thought they should kill the son because he was the heir. They tried to do that.
Then Jesus asks: What would the owner of the Garden (the God Almighty) do next. He will come himself and will catch the bad tenants and beat them and put them in prison (hell).
It is a very good example of symbolic teaching. I am ready to explain it further, if any one is interested.**
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jkpreece
Guest
hmmm…
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reteeks21
Guest
So why ask the question? If you want examples why can’t you listen to see what they have to say?No,Thank but I do not listen to private interpretation its not condoned in the bible 2peter 1:20
An example: when Jesus was speaking to the Sanhedrin He talked about judgement (coming on a cloud etc) that was symbolic in that it mirrored the exact symbols used in the OT to repesent God’s judgement. He didn’t bother to explain that.
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Bill_Pick
Guest
The answer was to a muslim friend you may try to keep up with the thread and not this jump it at any time,smile have a good daySo why ask the question? If you want examples why can’t you listen to see what they have to say?
An example: when Jesus was speaking to the Sanhedrin He talked about judgement (coming on a cloud etc) that was symbolic in that it mirrored the exact symbols used in the OT to repesent God’s judgement. He didn’t bother to explain that.
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reteeks21
Guest
And you can’t listen to someone cause they are a Muslim? I was keeping up.The answer was to a muslim friend you may try to keep up with the thread and not this jump it at any time,smile have a good day
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Bill_Pick
Guest
Not if they are talking about the BibleAnd you can’t listen to someone cause they are a Muslim? I was keeping up.
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reteeks21
Guest
That makes no sense. That would be the perfect time to try and help direct them to the truth. If nothing changes for them at least you have planted a seed. It never hurts to listen. No one said you had to accept anything they said, but don’t you think that we owe people the courtesy especially if we want to see them led to Christ? Unless they hear it how can they believe it?Not if they are talking about the Bible
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Bill_Pick
Guest
Have you read what their post Jesus did not die on the cross,He lived until the age of 123 years of age,He was married and had many wifes if thats how they interpretation of the bible are I for one do not have to listen,sorry you got upset but I do not have to listen to people that are always insulting christian… DO YOU THINK THEY ARE HEAR TO LEARNThat makes no sense. That would be the perfect time to try and help direct them to the truth. If nothing changes for them at least you have planted a seed. It never hurts to listen. No one said you had to accept anything they said, but don’t you think that we owe people the courtesy especially if we want to see them led to Christ? Unless they hear it how can they believe it?
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The_GreyPilgrim
Guest
Muslims also reject the notion of the Trinity and reject the notion of God as a loving Father. They will always dismiss the Trinitarian doctrine and claim that Jesus’ testimony to the Sanhedrin was merely “symbolic” or “metaphorical”.
If they refuse to accept our propositions why should we accept theirs?
If they refuse to accept our propositions why should we accept theirs?
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reteeks21
Guest
I have read what they have said, and it is disgusting. Maybe they aren’t here to learn, but that shouldn’t stop anyone from speaking the truth. You still start threads that question Protestants, and then are eager to tell them how they are wrong, but that isn’t the case for Muslims who say crazy things? You criticize Protestant beliefs but you can’t take it when Muslims do the same?Have you read what their post Jesus did not die on the cross,He lived until the age of 123 years of age,He was married and had many wifes if thats how they interpretation of the bible are I for one do not have to listen,sorry you got upset but I do not have to listen to people that are always insulting christian… DO YOU THINK THEY ARE HEAR TO LEARN
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reteeks21
Guest
1.) Was Jesus being symbolic or will He literally come on a literal cloud?Muslims also reject the notion of the Trinity and reject the notion of God as a loving Father. They will always dismiss the Trinitarian doctrine and claim that Jesus’ testimony to the Sanhedrin was merely “symbolic” or “metaphorical”.
If they refuse to accept our propositions why should we accept theirs?
2.) I never said accept their positions. I wouldn’t ask you to do so. I am just saying that their crazy ideas shouldn’t keep us from engaging them.
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The_GreyPilgrim
Guest
1.) Was Jesus being symbolic or will He literally come on a literal cloud?
2.) I never said accept their positions. I wouldn’t ask you to do so. I am just saying that their crazy ideas shouldn’t keep us from engaging them.
- I would rather take Him at His word than not take Him at His word, how about you?
- I didn’t say positions but propostions. Say “God the Father” or “Father” in reference to God in front of a muslim and they will accuse you of blasphemy. The double standard is that they demand that we accept God on their terms but in turn refuse to accept how we speak of God on our terms.
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reteeks21
Guest
I whole-heartedly agree with the last two statements. I know that at times we have to shake the dust off our feet and move on, and even defend our faith. I was only putting forth that going down to their level might not be a good thing.True fraternal dialogue requires patience and understanding. It is impolite to demand that someone must speak in your language alone or in your terms alone.
- I would rather take Him at His word than not take Him at His word, how about you?
- I didn’t say positions but propostions. Say “God the Father” or “Father” in reference to God in front of a muslim and they will accuse you of blasphemy. The double standard is that they demand that we accept God on their terms but in turn refuse to accept how we speak of God on our terms.
As to the first statement: a.) if the Bible is to be taken as a whole and in context it would make sense to assume that maybe He was being symbolic. The images He used were exact mathces to the images used in the OT. That’s why the Jewish leaders were so outraged because He was using language that put Him on par with God, i.e, He’s the Messiah. b.) This is where some could say that if you take the Eucharist section of John literally and the Clouds refernce, shouldn’t you take the “I’m the gate” reference literally, too? After all, in neither of those refernces did He have to explain Himself.
I’m not saying I believe in those arguements, and I am not asking you to believe in them either. I am just putting forth other ideas with the expectation that maybe some dialougue will come out of it. Let me also add that I would hope that the dialougue could be civil and not full of finger pointing.
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The_GreyPilgrim
Guest
So IOW Jesus was pointing from symbols to more symsols. I might agree if metaphorical language such as the word “like” was used. The images that Jesus used I don’t believe were exact matches. The images that Jesus used were “types” that prefigured a reality that would point to Him. The reason the Jewish leaders were outraged was because Jesus was literally saying that you must eat His flesh and drink His blood. It would’ve been very easy for Jesus to back off from His words, but He didn’t. The more incredulity they showed Him the more graphic and assertive His language became.As to the first statement: a.) if the Bible is to be taken as a whole and in context it would make sense to assume that maybe He was being symbolic. The images He used were exact matches to the images used in the OT. That’s why the Jewish leaders were so outraged because He was using language that put Him on par with God, i.e, He’s the Messiah.
b.) This is where some could say that if you take the Eucharist section of John literally and the Clouds refernce, shouldn’t you take the “I’m the gate” reference literally, too? After all, in neither of those refernces did He have to explain Himself.
I understand His language to be that, “Yes, you must eat my flesh and drink my blood in order to seperate yourself from Adam’s flesh and join yourself to Me. I(Jesus) will do this for you.”
He is the gate, no one can enter the fold except through Him, through His flesh and blood.
When it comes to matters of salvation, I take Jesus at His word and lean not on my own understanding(Prov 3:5).
It is mysterious, maybe even strange, but I believe it is more real than anything else. And I believe because He said so.
God Bless
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NDfan
Guest
Bill many times. Are you looking for an example??When in the Bible how many times did Jesus talk in symbol and NOT explain what He was saying…
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Cnote11
Guest
I stumbled upon this forum a few minutes ago and registered just to tell you that metaphors never use the word like, so for you to say " I might agree if metaphorical language such as the word “like” was used" seems extremely foolish.So IOW Jesus was pointing from symbols to more symsols. I might agree if metaphorical language such as the word “like” was used. The images that Jesus used I don’t believe were exact matches. The images that Jesus used were “types” that prefigured a reality that would point to Him. The reason the Jewish leaders were outraged was because Jesus was literally saying that you must eat His flesh and drink His blood. It would’ve been very easy for Jesus to back off from His words, but He didn’t. The more incredulity they showed Him the more graphic and assertive His language became.
I understand His language to be that, “Yes, you must eat my flesh and drink my blood in order to seperate yourself from Adam’s flesh and join yourself to Me. I(Jesus) will do this for you.”
He is the gate, no one can enter the fold except through Him, through His flesh and blood.
When it comes to matters of salvation, I take Jesus at His word and lean not on my own understanding(Prov 3:5).
It is mysterious, maybe even strange, but I believe it is more real than anything else. And I believe because He said so.
God Bless
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Bill_Pick
Guest
When did I criticze a non-cathloic,I do not criticze NC because I know they do not believe in tradition and only have a part of the Bible,and believe in the fales teaching of Sola Scriptura…Dont get upset all the time ,and I,m sorry but I do get upset with the same posting day after day like being told that Our Lord did not die on the cross and lived until the age of 123 was married and had many wife… and yes if a NC is saying its just a “symbol” then please tell me WHY…Maybe you can tell me “this is my Body” is this a symbol… Jesus always explain so can you explain this to me… I assume you are NC. from your post. and yes I do know what you do when you assume…thing…Have a great day and may Our Lord bless you…I have read what they have said, and it is disgusting. Maybe they aren’t here to learn, but that shouldn’t stop anyone from speaking the truth. You still start threads that question Protestants, and then are eager to tell them how they are wrong, but that isn’t the case for Muslims who say crazy things? You criticize Protestant beliefs but you can’t take it when Muslims do the same?
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