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Julius_Caesar
Guest
We know Mary was obedient to God, bit how much did she really understand of her Son’s mission?
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L
Limoncello4021
Guest
She knew what Gabriel told her about who Jesus was, and she knew what Simeon revealed about Jesus’ impact and the suffering He’d go through as well as her own suffering because of Jesus’ “sign of contradiction.” She understood at both the Annunciation and Cana that Jesus’ mission was intimately tied with her own will. She understood as we see at the Visitation that her Son fulfilled Scripture’s longing for a Messiah. She was told by Jesus at the Finding at the Temple that Jesus was intimately involved with His “Father’s house,” the Temple perhaps or more broadly His Father’s plans although mysteriously (to me at least) we are also told that both she and Joseph at the time had no idea what He was talking about. If not told directly by her Son, she certainly knew during the increasingly hostility of those to Him in His public life that He would be put to death eventually. And she understood through Jesus’ words on the Cross that she was to become John’s mother; hence, mother of all of us.
J
Julius_Caesar
Guest
The text indicates that she didn’t knowand she knew what Simeon revealed about Jesus’ impact and the suffering He’d go through as well as her own suffering because of Jesus’ “sign of contradiction.”
J
Julius_Caesar
Guest
We are told that Joseph and Mary were shocked at Simeon’s words.
K
kerberos
Guest
IMHO, probably very little. With, presumably, isolated flashes of insight into the Life with which her life was so closely connected.
I believe that to answer this question, it is essential to have an idea of her that lets her be “credibly human”, a genuinely human being, rather than putting her on a pedestal that distances her from the human condition. If Jesus Christ was “credibly human”, I don’t see how she can have not been. In no respect is she greater than He. If we have to walk by faith, and if St Paul had to - then so, surely, did she have to. This way of looking at her is also how the Servant of God Frank Duff, the Founder of the Legion of Mary, saw her. I think that is good authority for seeing her in this way.
Since she was a Saint, she presumably was far more richly graced with the capacity to know, love, and serve God than the rest of us. That makes her more fully and authentically and developedly human than the rest of us - not less human. But she still needed faith, hope and charity - just as all Christians on Earth do.
I believe that to answer this question, it is essential to have an idea of her that lets her be “credibly human”, a genuinely human being, rather than putting her on a pedestal that distances her from the human condition. If Jesus Christ was “credibly human”, I don’t see how she can have not been. In no respect is she greater than He. If we have to walk by faith, and if St Paul had to - then so, surely, did she have to. This way of looking at her is also how the Servant of God Frank Duff, the Founder of the Legion of Mary, saw her. I think that is good authority for seeing her in this way.
Since she was a Saint, she presumably was far more richly graced with the capacity to know, love, and serve God than the rest of us. That makes her more fully and authentically and developedly human than the rest of us - not less human. But she still needed faith, hope and charity - just as all Christians on Earth do.
B
Buks
Guest
I think the Lord would tell his parents. It might be hard for us to relate to the level of grace that they were given.
P
PennyinCanada
Guest
This familiar passage might hold a clue…
For myself, if an angel appeared in front of me, that would be a frightening moment. However, Mary was troubled, not by the angel, but the greeting. How familiar was she to seeing angels I wonder? Did they have conversations?26 In the sixth month of Elizabeth’s pregnancy, God sent the angel Gabriel to Nazareth, a town in Galilee, 27 to a virgin pledged to be married to a man named Joseph, a descendant of David. The virgin’s name was Mary. 28 The angel went to her and said, “Greetings, you who are highly favored! The Lord is with you.”
29 Mary was greatly troubled at his words and wondered what kind of greeting this might be. 30 But the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary; you have found favor with God. 31 You will conceive and give birth to a son, and you are to call him Jesus.
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Dan_Defender
Guest
In truth, we don’t know how much she knew, we can only speculate. To me, her knowledge/understanding grew in time, keeping all in her heart. She probably knew/understood more at the Passion than say, at the stay-behind episode of Jesus childhood. She probably was ahead of the Apostles.
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stpurl
Guest
No, not ‘shocked’ as in blindsided. What translation are you using?
E
EugeneCharles
Guest
- In the Annunciation -
Mary said "Behold, I am the handmaid of the Lord. May it be done to me according to your word.” — She accepted God’s Will for her. - In the Presentation at the Temple -
“Behold, this child is destined for the fall and rise of many in Israel, and to be a sign that will be contradicted and you yourself a sword will pierce so that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.”—She didn’t leave the Lord even after she heard that. - When Jesus was left at the Temple -
“He went down with them and came to Nazareth, and was obedient to them; and his mother kept all these things in her heart.” - At the Wedding Feast at Cana -
Mama Mary told the wine servers to do what her Son is going to say. - At the Paschal Mystery of Christ -
Even Mary was grievous, she didn’t become angry but she trusted God.
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Julius_Caesar
Guest
If an old man came and told you stuff about your baby that He’d be the cause of pain, you’d be apprehensive too.No, not ‘shocked’ as in blindsided.
C
ColoradoCatholic
Guest
A lot more than any of us. Remember she was conceived without sin, and thus did not suffer from its effects. Plus she is God’s most perfect creation…something tells me she was far more in tune with her understanding of God’s mission than anyone or anything ever will be.
J
Julius_Caesar
Guest
Are you saying she was without pain or death? Because her son experienced both.Remember she was conceived without sin, and thus did not suffer from its effects.
She even has her moments when she is amazed or ponders on the events that have happened.Plus she is God’s most perfect creation…something tells me she was far more in tune with her understanding of God’s mission than anyone or anything ever will be.
C
ColoradoCatholic
Guest
Did Jesus have to die? No.
Did Jesus have to experience pain? No.
Neither did Mary but she chose to, to be like her son in all respects.
I am speaking more to the effects about being able to understand and contemplate the perfect way God intended things to be. This allowed her to surpass most of us in understanding about the “plans” of God. I’m not saying she is omniscient, I’m saying that she has far more knowledge about things than we do because she was created and remained as God’s highest creature.
Did Jesus have to experience pain? No.
Neither did Mary but she chose to, to be like her son in all respects.
I am speaking more to the effects about being able to understand and contemplate the perfect way God intended things to be. This allowed her to surpass most of us in understanding about the “plans” of God. I’m not saying she is omniscient, I’m saying that she has far more knowledge about things than we do because she was created and remained as God’s highest creature.
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Julius_Caesar
Guest
You make it sound like Mary chose to be born.Neither did Mary but she chose to, to be like her son in all respects.
She is not God.
C
ColoradoCatholic
Guest
You are putting words in my mouth based on your speculation of who I am and what I believe. I never said she is God, and no she did not choose to be created. I already stated she is a creature, but a creature far above any man or Angel except for God (Jesus, Holy Spirit, Father).
If God is #1, Mary is #2
If God is #1, Mary is #2
Maybe I should rephrase this to: did not “inherit” its effects…though sin caused the death of her Son (because he chose to allow himself to suffer, and Mary chose to be like him in all respects, and suffer along with him but not due to her own sin but to ours.)thus did not suffer from its effects.
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Julius_Caesar
Guest
You said.You are putting words in my mouth based on your speculation of who I am and what I believe. I never said she is God, and no she did not choose to be created.
Your questions are wrong on three counts. One Jesus came to take our infirmities, so yes He had to experience pain. Two, Jesus Himself said it was necessary for Him to die. Three, Mary without sin, was still a regular human being. She had moments of confusion as Luke says. Why wouldn’t she have pain?Did Jesus have to die? No.
Did Jesus have to experience pain? No.
Neither did Mary but she chose to, to be like her son in all respects.
C
ColoradoCatholic
Guest
So your saying God had no choice? He isn’t powerful enough to solve the problem with a wave of His hand? You and I believe in a different God then. He didn’t have to die, He chose to.Your questions are wrong on three counts. One Jesus came to take our infirmities, so yes He had to experience pain.
So was Jesus…and I already said she experienced pain haha, I feel like you aren’t reading my response haha.Three, Mary without sin, was still a regular human being. She had moments of confusion as Luke says. Why wouldn’t she have pain?
Well, I can tell you probably aren’t going to listen to this anyway, so I’ll take my leave.
You should do some study on Mariology. You might be surprised at what Catholic Scholars and Theologians say about Mary there is plenty on this topic.
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