Jewish Faith

[Maaike]

When did the Jewish people start omitting Isahiah and Daniel from their scriptures?

 

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi Maaike!

You posted:

When did the Jewish people start omitting Isahiah and Daniel from their scriptures?

We don’t omit, and have never omitted, Isaiah (jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Bible/Isaiahtoc.html) & Daniel (jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Bible/Danieltoc.html) from our scriptures. I’m curious: Where did you get the idea that we did?

Be well!

ssv

 

[Semper_Fi_1]

stillsmallvoice:

Hi Maaike!

You posted:

We don’t omit, and have never omitted, Isaiah (jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Bible/Isaiahtoc.html) & Daniel (jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Bible/Danieltoc.html) from our scriptures. I’m curious: Where did you get the idea that we did?

Be well!

ssv

ssv,

I know that in the NT times, the Jewish sages omitted the deuterocanonicals from the septuagint to separate themselves from the Christians. Can you list which books you consider “most” inspired, or is there different levels of inspiration you consider for your books? We Catholics believe everything in the OT (including the deuterocanon [mac, tobit, etc.]) & NT is inspired.

 

[Fidelis]

Maaike:

When did the Jewish people start omitting Isahiah and Daniel from their scriptures?

I think what the OP is referring to is, not the the removal of these books from the Jewish canon, but the omission of passages from them in their schedule of liturgical (synagogue) readings that are commonly seen by Christians as prophecies directly relating to Jesus as the Messiah. An example would be Isaiah 53.

I have also heard this, but I don’t remember if it was in the past, or still continues today.

 

[stillsmallvoice]

Hi all!

It is Saturday night here & Shabbat (i.e. the Sabbath) has been over for about 3.5 hours. On Shabbat (from sundown Friday to nightfall Saturday), orthodox Jews don’t use most electric/electronic devices, including TVs, radios, phones & computers. (See jewfaq.org/shabbat.htm for a good introductory read.) And DW & I are usually way too busy on Friday dealing with Da Boyz and cooking & cleaning (both the flat & ourselves) for her to let me anywhere even remotely near the computer. So, Shabbat being out (and everyone being except the hamster & myself), I’m now online.

The foregoing is my way of explaining to my CAF friends why I haven’t posted a reply sooner.

Our Sages (at Yavneh/Jamnia, after the destruction of the 2nd Temple in CE 70 :crying: & before the Bar Kochba Revolt in CE 132-135) excluded the so-called Apocryphal books from the Tanakh (what we call what you call the “Old Testament”) for several reasons; however, I’m not aware that
Semper Fi:

I know that in the NT times, the Jewish sages omitted the deuterocanonicals from the septuagint to separate themselves from the Christians.

was one of them. Ferinstance, I Maccabees, while considered to be very historically accurate & written by a believing Jew, was not considered to be Divinely inspired. The Prayer of Manasseh (while quite moving & a spiritual gem, in my humble opinion) was considered to be inauthentic (i.e., not by King Manasseh). Other books were considered to contain/be full of/ nonsense (i.e. ideas that didn’t jibe with the Torah), as well as inauthentic and/or uninspired.
Semper Fi:

Can you list which books you consider “most” inspired, or is there different levels of inspiration you consider for your books? We Catholics believe everything in the OT (including the deuterocanon [mac, tobit, etc.]) & NT is inspired.

Semper Fi, I think that I’ve already answered you in part, at least regarding the “deuterocanonicals.” This tinyurl.com/435wl is The Jewish Encyclopedia entry entitled “Biblical Canon”; this tinyurl.com/2jaeu is the entry on “Apocrypha”. I believe that they’ll go into more detail.

As far as the 39 books of the Tanakh are concerned, the Torah (Genesis to Deuteronomy) is certainly our basic and holiest scripture. It is the spiritual axis around which everything else revolves & is measured (more or less). Some of our Sages wanted to exclude Ezekiel from the scriptural canon because certain passages which detail certain Temple at first glance might seem to appear to contradict passages in the Torah. See myjewishlearning.com/texts/bible/TO_Prophets_1460/TOLiteraryProphets/EzekielFreehof.htm.

Fidelis:

I think what the OP is referring to is, not the the removal of these books from the Jewish canon, but the omission of passages from them in their schedule of liturgical (synagogue) readings that are commonly seen by Christians as prophecies directly relating to Jesus as the Messiah. An example would be Isaiah 53.

I have also heard this, but I don’t remember if it was in the past, or still continues today.

See messiahtruth.com/haftorah.html.

Howzat?

Be well!

ssv